What about pre-recorded Music Discs???

[drtweak]

All I hear about Blu-ray is talk about movies. Will there be any Blu-ray music-only discs? If so, what companies may be releasing them and will it contain both stereo and multi-channel options? What will the resolution be? I'm hoping that with all this storage capacity they can improve over CD's 44.1kHz sampling rate big time!

I can't find anything on the Blu-ray site about music or music standards... What's up with that?

The only thing I've heard is that the Blu-ray players should be able to play the old redbook CDs as well as DVDs and SACDs. That's nice, but what about some new high-res audio standards to match the hi-def video capability? Will Blu-Ray be the first commercial digital disc system that will finally surpass the performance of my trusty old vinyl-spinner???

TIA for any help!

Frank

[Zinn]

5.1 in 24/192 and 7.1 in 24/96 (bit/kHz) Also profile 3 is Audio only, so somthing must be in the works.

From: wikipedia.org

Profiles

The BD-ROM specification defines four profiles of Blu-ray players. All video-based profiles are required to have a full implementation of BD-J.

1.0

This is the basic profile that all current Blu-ray players (as of April 2007) are based on. Players based on this profile are only required to have 64 KB of application data area storage, which is typically used for bookmarks and other preference storage.[citation needed] Most players have more than the minimum required 64KB.[citation needed] After October 31, 2007 this profile will be superseded by profile 1.1 as the new minimum profile.

1.1 (mandatory November 2007)

What is typically referred to as "Profile 1.1" (but is more formally known as "Final Standard Profile") adds a secondary video decoder (typically used for picture in picture), secondary audio (typically used for interactive audio and commentary) and capability of supporting a minimum of 256MB of local storage (for storing audio/video and title updates). Compliance with this profile will be mandatory for player models introduced to the market after October 31, 2007[1], but existing products will be unaffected. No players compliant with this profile have been announced or released.

Some profile 1.0 players may be upgradeable via firmware update to profile 1.1 if they have the appropriate hardware, but no manufacturer has announced any such upgrade. When software authored with interactive features dependent on Profile 1.1 hardware capabilities are played on profile 1.0 players some features may not be available or may offer limited capability. Profile 1.0 players will still be able to play the main feature of the disc, however.

2.0 (BD-Live)

Profile 2, also known as BD-Live, adds network connectivity to the list of mandatory functions and increases mandatory local storage capability to 1 GB. No players have been announced as compatible with this profile. However it has been speculated that the PS3 could be upgradeable to this profile.

3 (audio only)

Profile 3 is meant for an audio-only player and does not require video decoding or BD-J.

[frenchglen]

Yeah, sounds good, with BD you could fit on multiple soundtracks for backwards compatibility with old sound systems [and have no worries about cutting down bitrates of the high-res soundtrack for audiophiles]

Because DVD-Audio didn't take off I hope they'll market this one properly. I think consumers will eventually adopt it, once blu-ray movies take off in mainstream people will finally have a taste of hi-res. Then they will want to have that same "sound experience" in music. Well, I would anyway

Or maybe it's too late and the iPod has dumbed people down and all they care about is that shiny HDTV. People think CD is the best quality you can go.

Crusade for Sound!

[drtweak]

Gents,

Many thanks for the replies. It sounds like no formal standards for music have been set at this time, but that Sony has provided for it and is thinking about it.

There's a lot of music from movie soundtracks that's already mixed in hi-res multi-channel, so it would be great if those tracks were available on music-only Blu-ray discs. Even a higher res stereo format would be welcome -- and long overdue!

frenchglen, You're 100 percent right -- typical consumers have been way dumbed-down by the iPod and MP3 and actually think that those formats sound pretty good. CD-quality is considered the "gold-standard," but it was inadequate 25 years ago when they adopted the 44.1kHz standard and in light of the advancing technology over that timespan it is woefully inadequate and outdated. It's like trying to use a table spoon to dig a large hole for a pool when you have a backhoe available.

All my analog sources (turntable, reel-to-reel tape, and FM radio) have much higher quality sound than CD on my hi-res audio system (and even on a cheap retro system I threw together using a '70's solid-state Onkyo receiver and 35 year-old JBL speakers). CD, by comparison (my CD player is highly acclaimed and costs $2500 USD), sounds flat, anylitical, and less involving, while the analog sound is lush, sweet, and engaging -- definitely a more intimate and fulfilling musical experience.

We already have the technology in place to allow for a superior musical presentation from digital on Blu-ray. It is my fervent hope that the recording industry actually steps up and sets a new framework of audio playback standards that can take advantage of what this great format is capable of offering. I'm sure that would help bolster sagging music sales, and it sure would be great to hear digital music in a hi-res format.

Heck, Sony already owns an extensive catalog of music titles, so all they'd have to do is set the new parameters and then start reissuing titles on hi-res Blu-ray. Right now, Sony seems to be waiting for other recording companies to step in and do this while the recording industry is waiting on Sony to make the first move... Sony needs to get off its corporate butt and get the ball rolling!!!

Cheers to All !!!!

[Zinn]

Hopefully they make hybrid disc with a 25GB BD side and a regular CD side on all discs.

[drtweak]

Zinn,

NO NO NO, my man, that would be a serious marketing blunder! If they made a Blu-ray hybrid disc with a regular redbook CD soundtrack, owners of regular CD players would be content with that and wouldn't purchase a Blu-ray player (because they've been brainwashed with "perfect sound forever" for so long). But I'm telling you that "CD-quality" is NOT good enough and it's far from perfect! Hi-res Blu-ray would be sooooo much better!

If anything, there should be a hi-res 7.1 and 5.1 multichannel layer and then another layer for hi-res 2-channel stereo sound (because many older recordings were mastered that way and could be remastered to Blu-ray standards). This would allow hi-res headphone and 2-channel stereo playback for folks who don't have multi-channel surround sound.

My feeling is that the Superior picture and sound quality the Blu-ray offers for movie reproduction will get folks intrigued enough to buy Blu-ray players. Then, having the added bonus of being able to purchase hi-res music-only discs would be the icing on the cake...

Frank A.

[drtweak]

Guys,

I just wanted to add to my earlier post that allowing Blu-ray players to read and play the older formats: CD, SACD, and DVD, etc., would be great and makes perfect sense. After all, who wants to have a bunch of different disc players hooked up just to play older discs. Having a universal Blu-ray player would be terrific.

But Sony shouldn't offer people incentive not to buy Blu-ray by encoding a regular redbook CD layer into Blu-ray discs. I'm not certain if that would even be possible.

[HDJK]

Originally Posted by drtweak

Zinn,

NO NO NO, my man, that would be a serious marketing blunder! If they made a Blu-ray hybrid disc with a regular redbook CD soundtrack, owners of regular CD players would be content with that and wouldn't purchase a Blu-ray player...

Frank A.

Originally Posted by drtweak

What would happen is that I would get sucked into the Blu-ray player purchase through the allure of the hi-res MUSIC offerings. Then I would realize I need a newer TV with higher-res capability and an HDMI digital interface. I would also need to update my home theater receiver for the same reason. All this would spark me to start buying new music and movie titles in the Blu-ray format for the ultimate audio/video experience.

You totally contradict yourself there. I bought SACDs hybrids long before I got a SACD player. Gave me the advantage of already having the disc when the time comes and still be able to enjoy the music in the meantime. The same could be true for BDs with a redbook layer. You say so yourself, BD music would get you to buy a better HD TV.

Originally Posted by Filterlab

Thing is that the iPod has put paid to a lot of potential high quality audio, due to its 'funkiness'.

I'll go on record saying that high quality audio has been around for many many years, and in either analogue or digital form, high quality is still high quality.

Just because Blu-ray offers large data transfer rates this will still not compensate for a half deaf, convenience driven, compression happy audio engineer. Unfortunately most music is mastered by these fools these days.

However, if one is to listen to something by Supertramp, Dire Straits, Alan Parsons Project or something of that ilk, they may be surprised in that it sounds cleaner and crisper than something of the modern day.

Why? Simply because they are / were self produced musicians - the best of both worlds. Does it make any difference what Mbps transfer rate the media runs at? Course not, in fact any of these type of artists will sound amazing on redbook, but only because the original recordings are first class.

Yes, my Esocteric player has SACD capability, but I own none. Why have I not bought any? Because redbook is excellent quality as it is and the machine is engineered properly. Will the PS3 ever replace it? HAHAHAHA! Don't be ludicrous!

My thoughts exactly

Heck, I 'only' have the Denon to play my CDs now, but I get some really nice sounding music out of it through my studio monitors.