The Kid (1921)

[WaverBoy]

Originally Posted by pro-bassoonist

The Kid Blu-ray REVIEW



The definitive release of Charlie Chaplin's The Kid has arrived.

An outstanding 4K restoration that is guaranteed to have a reserved spot on all prestigious Top 10 lists at the end of 2016. The bonus features are also very impressive. Fans of silent cinema should be quite pleased with Ben Model's technical analysis. Fantastic.

Buy this release, folks

Pro-B

It may look fantastic, but alas, it ain't definitive, because it's still missing crucial footage. I'm reeeeeaaaaaalllllly glad I picked up the proper version while the getting was good. It'll do me just fine until the Estate realizes how ridiculous their mostly-enforced policy is.

[WaverBoy]

Originally Posted by Professor Echo

I recently scored the original uncut release DVD from Image brand new for $20, in lieu of buying the Chaplin revisionist edit from Criterion. I'm not a fan of directors coming back after the fact and changing their minds for whatever reason. So am glad to have as close to the original theatrical version available in my collection. For me, it's a worthwhile trade off from being in HD. I'm trying to pick up all the Image releases of the untampered Chaplins, though it's hard to find deals on them.

I've got 'em all, although poor LIMELIGHT is cut even on the Image DVD; only the old LD is uncut. The missing scene is excellent, too. Charlie, I love ya, but you should have left your classics alone, instead of trying to inspire George Lucas.

[Professor Echo]

Originally Posted by WaverBoy

It may look fantastic, but alas, it ain't definitive, because it's still missing crucial footage. I'm reeeeeaaaaaalllllly glad I picked up the proper version while the getting was good. It'll do me just fine until the Estate realizes how ridiculous their mostly-enforced policy is.

Much as I like Pro-B, I have to agree with this assessment. The review should be amended to read "The definitive edition of Chaplin's revisionist, edited version of THE KID." There is a very big difference between the two versions and no critic familiar with each would ever deem the cut one "definitive." It's a misleading description.

[jdw89]

I don't see why people don't wait until the Criterion sales to buy these Blu's, or wait till they show up at Costco for $20

[FilmKoala]

I like this film but I'm disappointed Criterion decided to release it instead of some of his other films. I've been desperately wanting to see The Circus, for example, but the DVD is OOP and really expensive so the only way I'll get to is if/when Criterion puts it out. Hell, I'll even take A King in New York on BD at this point over The Kid.

Granted, I'm biased because I bought the OOP mk2 DVD for like $30 two months before this was announced. I'm not ready to upgrade as of yet.

[Kamdan]

Originally Posted by jdw89

I don't see why people don't wait until the Criterion sales to buy these Blu's, or wait till they show up at Costco for $20

You don't like to save money?

[Namuhana]

Originally Posted by FilmKoala

I like this film but I'm disappointed Criterion decided to release it instead of some of his other films. I've been desperately wanting to see The Circus, for example, but the DVD is OOP and really expensive so the only way I'll get to is if/when Criterion puts it out. Hell, I'll even take A King in New York on BD at this point over The Kid.

Granted, I'm biased because I bought the OOP mk2 DVD for like $30 two months before this was announced. I'm not ready to upgrade as of yet.

The Circus and A King in New York are both available via Hulu if that's an option for you.

[jdw89]

Originally Posted by Kamdan

You don't like to save money?

I'd save money by waiting... lol

[jacksparrow900]

What irks me is they had a 4k scan from first generation elements and edited it to match Chaplin's reissue version. Hopefully someone can do a fan edit using the blu ray and all the deleted scenes and reinstate them along with the original title cards.

[whiteberry]

Originally Posted by jacksparrow900

What irks me is they had a 4k scan from first generation elements and edited it to match Chaplin's reissue version. Hopefully someone can do a fan edit using the blu ray and all the deleted scenes and reinstate them along with the original title cards.

I agree. The original version should have been the number one priority. Another Criterion that I can skip.

[Bandit Tajomaru]

Originally Posted by whiteberry

I agree. The original version should have been the number one priority. Another Criterion that I can skip.

You act like Criterion had a choice in the matter. They only release what m2k and the Chaplin family let them release.

[pro-bassoonist]

Originally Posted by WaverBoy

It may look fantastic, but alas, it ain't definitive, because it's still missing crucial footage. I'm reeeeeaaaaaalllllly glad I picked up the proper version while the getting was good. It'll do me just fine until the Estate realizes how ridiculous their mostly-enforced policy is.

Originally Posted by Professor Echo

Much as I like Pro-B, I have to agree with this assessment. The review should be amended to read "The definitive edition of Chaplin's revisionist, edited version of THE KID." There is a very big difference between the two versions and no critic familiar with each would ever deem the cut one "definitive." It's a misleading description.

I am going to quote my friend Bandit Tajomaru because he has said everything that needs to be said.

Originally Posted by Bandit Tajomaru

You act like Criterion had a choice in the matter. They only release what m2k and the Chaplin family let them release.

Pro-B

[Professor Echo]

Originally Posted by pro-bassoonist

I am going to quote my friend Bandit Tajomaru because he has said everything that needs to be said.



Pro-B

That only further illustrates the inappropriateness of using the word "Definitive" in your review. Definitive implies something that is without equivocation and which is unconditional, yet the quote you use clearly shows this release to be anything but that.

[Mrdamron]

Love THE KID. My better half usually does not even pretend to share my affinity for the silent films of Chaplin, Keaton, etc. However, the other night THE KID was on TCM and she not only gave it a chance, endured it, but enjoyed it and commented that she had never really given the old films a chance but is beginning to see what it's all about, how impressive storytelling can be that way and the emotional kick that is possible through expression, not sound. She may even check out some more Chaplin. That is a big win for me.

[pro-bassoonist]

Originally Posted by Professor Echo

That only further illustrates the inappropriateness of using the word "Definitive" in your review. Definitive implies something that is without equivocation and which is unconditional, yet the quote you use clearly shows this release to be anything but that.

Exactly the opposite is true.

The Chaplin family is protecting what the creator of the film thought was the "definitive" version of his film. So, the description could not be any more appropriate.

Pro-B

[Professor Echo]

Originally Posted by pro-bassoonist

Exactly the opposite is true.



The Chaplin family is protecting what the creator of the film thought was the "definitive" version of his film. So, the description could not be any more appropriate.



Pro-B

Maybe you need to supply a footnote with your review explaining exactly what you meant when you used the word definitive. Your use of it sounded more like you were saying this Blu incarnation is the definitive release of the film and I'm sorry, but that's just not true, despite what the estate thinks. There are too many variables at work with this film for the term DEFINITIVE to be bandied about.

I enjoy your reviews very much and you've definitely helped me make smart buying choices, which I greatly appreciate, but on this release we will have to agree to disagree.

[Professor Echo]

Originally Posted by sc1957

A "definitive" version of a Chaplin film would surely include the tens of thousands of feet of film that he exposed while he obsessed over the exact angle of some actor's chin, would it not?

I'm looking forward to Criterion's release of The Kid.

A definitive version for me would include as best as possible an approximation of the original theatrical cut as the director originally envisioned it and executed it, not just a latter day revision because he changed his mind somewhere down the line. I personally prefer the uncut Image DVD, but there's room for both. I just would not deem the Criterion definitive in any way unless it's purely from the perspective of transfer quality.

Anyway, I've had my say on this and all semantics aside, the one thing most of us can agree on is that it would be nice if the Chaplin estate would provide both the original cut and the revisionist cut for the releases as they did with THE GOLD RUSH. Do that and I'll gladly call them definitive!

[bigshot]

I'm happy with my bare bones import blu-ray of The Kid... until it comes out with the original cut as you say. That would make me buy it again.

[joie]

Could "definitive" from the estate's point of view exclude cuts with expired copyright?

[Egbert Souse]

I was expecting both cuts since The Gold Rush was handled that way, but unlike The Gold Rush... Chaplin's re-cut of The Kid actually works a little better as a film. I'm curious to why Chaplin's estate was OK with The Gold Rush, but not The Kid. Although, I suspect that it may have to do with the score since there doesn't seem to be a version of it re-arranged and re-recorded to fit the 1921 version like The Gold Rush does. Perhaps they didn't want to just take Chaplin's score and re-edit it to fit.

Does the 1928 version of The Circus still exist, either?