Video Nasties

[nastiesexpert]

Originally Posted by OgamiittoMcJ

you could maybe do a Banned and Seized but not Official Nasty section List
New York Ripper for example, still cut in UK and Banned for cinema and escorted out of country, deserves a mention somewhere

nice work though

The tale of New York Ripper being escorted out of the country is fiction.
I believe one of the various Video Nasties documentaries confirms this.

Although it's interesting to see 2 female BBFC examiners state the film was the worst they'd ever seen on the C4 Sex and the Censors documentary. One of those females has a rather large input on the Video Nasties 2 documentary. Made in 1991 it's a grim depressing 50 minutes showing exactly how bad it was in the UK with vice officers marching into London porn shops and making piles of magazines on the floor they think are illegal.
Equally depressing is smug git James Ferman showing us several sections of movies that he proudly censored. The UK population are so different from anyone else, even the audience for C4 have to be spared the Death Wish 2 rape scene which the camera shows briefly then moves away so we can't see it.

It's a great doco and C4 got into hot water for showing it. Not sure exactly which bits caused most problems but they do have a lengthy chat with a video nasty collector who is proudly playing a dreadful quality bootleg tape of New York Ripper in the background for which the camera zooms into in order to show the razor blade moments still missing today - and they played those same moments several times.
The doco has never been shown again. The only reason I have it is because I recorded it on VHS at the time and I eventually transferred it to dvd several years ago

[nastiesexpert]

Originally Posted by fatboyslim142

Does anyone know if Blue Underground still have UK rights to Snuff? It'd be a prime candidate for 88 films to release.

If they had it passed 13 years ago it seems unlikely they would still have the rights.
I agree it's perfect 88films fodder but of all the nasties it has to be the one that will disappoint anyone who watches it even if you do manage to get to the end.
It would need some substantial extras to make it a worthwhile purchase.

The excellent magazine of the time Video Viewer had a 2 page feature on the impending release with the "real life murder" aspect played up and the head of Astra Video bragging that as it was on video the authorities were powerless to stop him. Didn't take him long to realise that wasn't quite true. The feature also covers the increasing complaints and how authorities were concerned about which laws were being broken by the few notable titles out at that point like I Spit On your Grave as they knew video was outside BBFC control.

I still find it hard to understand why BBFC cut and classified versions on video of things like The Evil Dead and Tenebrae ever got caught up in all the fuss. And successfully prosecuted IIRC. It was a bizarre situation with movies being taken to court and being convicted in one court and cleared in another depending on where you were in the country.
The Video Nasties documentaries most shocking revelation is that the MP hoodwinked into giving us what would eventually be the Video Recordings Act still doesn't see what an idiot he was taken for or what an over reaction the whole thing was

[fatboyslim142]

Originally Posted by nastiesexpert

If they had it passed 13 years ago it seems unlikely they would still have the rights.
I agree it's perfect 88films fodder but of all the nasties it has to be the one that will disappoint anyone who watches it even if you do manage to get to the end.
It would need some substantial extras to make it a worthwhile purchase.

The excellent magazine of the time Video Viewer had a 2 page feature on the impending release with the "real life murder" aspect played up and the head of Astra Video bragging that as it was on video the authorities were powerless to stop him. Didn't take him long to realise that wasn't quite true. The feature also covers the increasing complaints and how authorities were concerned about which laws were being broken by the few notable titles out at that point like I Spit On your Grave as they knew video was outside BBFC control.

I still find it hard to understand why BBFC cut and classified versions on video of things like The Evil Dead and Tenebrae ever got caught up in all the fuss. And successfully prosecuted IIRC. It was a bizarre situation with movies being taken to court and being convicted in one court and cleared in another depending on where you were in the country.
The Video Nasties documentaries most shocking revelation is that the MP hoodwinked into giving us what would eventually be the Video Recordings Act still doesn't see what an idiot he was taken for or what an over reaction the whole thing was

They could use the extras Blue Underground did for their BD .

The best quote from the first Video Nasties set doc is this golden gem from Graham Bright.

"I believe research is taking place and it will show that these films not only affect young people but I believe they affect dogs as well. "

[fatboyslim142]

Originally Posted by nastiesexpert

The tale of New York Ripper being escorted out of the country is fiction.
I believe one of the various Video Nasties documentaries confirms this.

Although it's interesting to see 2 female BBFC examiners state the film was the worst they'd ever seen on the C4 Sex and the Censors documentary. One of those females has a rather large input on the Video Nasties 2 documentary. Made in 1991 it's a grim depressing 50 minutes showing exactly how bad it was in the UK with vice officers marching into London porn shops and making piles of magazines on the floor they think are illegal.
Equally depressing is smug git James Ferman showing us several sections of movies that he proudly censored. The UK population are so different from anyone else, even the audience for C4 have to be spared the Death Wish 2 rape scene which the camera shows briefly then moves away so we can't see it.

It's a great doco and C4 got into hot water for showing it. Not sure exactly which bits caused most problems but they do have a lengthy chat with a video nasty collector who is proudly playing a dreadful quality bootleg tape of New York Ripper in the background for which the camera zooms into in order to show the razor blade moments still missing today - and they played those same moments several times.
The doco has never been shown again. The only reason I have it is because I recorded it on VHS at the time and I eventually transferred it to dvd several years ago

I wouldn't mind a copy of the doc as it sounds interesting.

[dallywhitty]

Terrific idea for a thread. I wasn't around when the video nasties controversy kicked off (I was born in '94) but I've always been fascinated by it. I actually wrote an essay in Film Studies once about the lasting impact it has had on British censorship today.

It's worth noting that the 'American Horror Project Vol. One' set includes The Witch Who Came from the Sea, so I'd recommend adding it to Chip's list. I think I own all those with the exception of Bloody Moon (which I intend to pick up eventually) and The Man from Deep River aka Deep River Savages (which is up for pre-order).

[HotRats]

The Sex And The Censors documentary got Channel 4 reported under the Obscene Publications Act and it was a very close call whether there would be a prosecution. Channel 4 gave an undertaking not to repeat the programme.

Also worth seeing (some are on Youtube) Fear, Panic And Censorship, Empire Of The Censors, Dear Censor, Banned In The UK. The book Seduction Of The Gullible is a must.

[stigdu]

Censored by Tom Dewe Matthews and Killing for Culture by Davids Kerekes and Slater are also fascinating reads.

[drterror666]

Originally Posted by HotRats

The book Seduction Of The Gullible is a must.

I've got a signed first print of this. Invaluable!

[nastiesexpert]

Originally Posted by HotRats

The Sex And The Censors documentary got Channel 4 reported under the Obscene Publications Act and it was a very close call whether there would be a prosecution. Channel 4 gave an undertaking not to repeat the programme.

Also worth seeing (some are on Youtube) Fear, Panic And Censorship, Empire Of The Censors, Dear Censor, Banned In The UK. The book Seduction Of The Gullible is a must.

The 2 part documentary "Ban the Sadist Videos" ( a genuine Daily Mail headline of the time) was included with Vipcos otherwise lacklustre Box of the Banned sets although it's also included as a bonus disc with the US Bluray of "Expose" AKA House on Straw Hill.
There was certainly significant footage included in "Sex and the Censors" as C4 actually showed scenes that the BBFC had specifically cut from various films including Ken Russells "Crimes of Passion" aswell as others. I think C4 thought that seeing the footage out of context was enough to clear them of any wrongdoing. It was the first time I realised just how much the BBFC had cut from Death Wish 2.

One of the most contentious moments was an interview with Derek Jarman while footage showing an erection from one of his movies (Sebastiene IIRC) played in the background as it was that moment the BBFC cut on the grounds it was classed as obscene.

Violence aside, the outdated Obscene Publications Act really does need to be scrapped. it's been useless for years as it's description of what is obscene is so vague and open to interpretation.
Thanks to one porn company appealing one of their movies back in 2000 hardcore porn was effectively legalised overnight yet we still have the stupid rules that ban sale from anywhere except licenced premises and a ban on sending it via mail order so while you can legally import hardcore from any country you can't have it sent from any company based in the UK.

What's even more annoying is that despite 2 very public cases where footage of fisting and other "obscene" content was cleared by a jury the BBFC continue to cut this material from R18 titles and the CPS refuse to acknowledge that this content should no longer be banned.

Even worse, when the Dangerous Pictures Act came into force a few years back it was supposed to be a way to ban violent porn but during the creation of this law some busybody somewhere decided to add a few extra bits to it making possession illegal of content that had not been before.
I don't think a single person has been convicted under the DPA where the offender was originally being investigated for that.Usually what happens is that computers are routinely seized by police investigating all manner of crimes and once they find a 10 second clip of animal porn stashed away somewhere that's it - you're in hot water.
Prosecutions have even happened when people have been sent clips lasting several seconds without asking for them yet because they forget to delete them they get convicted and as if in homage to the stupidity of the nasties era possession of animal porn is now on par with possession of child porn.
In one typically stupid case a guy was prosecuted for a video apparently showing someone having sex with a tiger.
The CPS took it to court , wasted public funds and once there finally played the whole clip which showed the tiger talking and revealing it was a complete fake.
The CPS should be held accountable and pay compensation to people who have to go through such trials because of their stupidity

[nastiesexpert]

Originally Posted by Fnord Prefect

No sure that's quite right. I remember him stating that he got around that BBFC decision by simply projecting the movie in 1:85 ratio in the UK rather than the intended 1:33. Probably played havoc with the frame composition but what could you do in such a situation?

Either way, it had to be removed because the BBFC would not have allowed it.
The BBFC were not averse to requesting reframing or even doing it themselves.
IIRC the original video release ( can't recall if it was the same for the cinema release) of Pulp Fiction required a shot showing a needle being injected into someone reframed to remove the detail.

It's quite laughable to think of the cuts and the reasons they would sometimes give.
The famous "eye" scene from Zombie Flesheaters for example. That was missing for decades. Watching it made you wince but precisely what did the BBFC think they were achieving by removing it?

James Ferman was the biggest boil on the arse of film fans for more than 2 decades. Fellow examiners would disagree with his decisions and end up sacked. Why nobody stepped in and said "hang on a minute" before 1998 is a mystery.
His re-edit of the house invasion sequence in Henry Portrait of a Serial Killer is an all time low I think

Going back to the C4 documentary: I recall the scene showing the Video Packaging Review Committee. What a bunch of knobs they were. And how depressing that such nonsense was allowed to happen. What a loony country the UK is.

I always wondered why the MP's who spent thousands of tax payers money on jollies they called "fact finding missions" never took one to Denmark or Holland to find out exactly why freely available porn of all varieties and no censorship on video had not turned those countries into the violent cesspools they seemed to think the UK would become if we could watch I Spit On your Grave uncut

[dallywhitty]

Originally Posted by nastiesexpert

James Ferman was the biggest boil on the arse of film fans for more than 2 decades. Fellow examiners would disagree with his decisions and end up sacked. Why nobody stepped in and said "hang on a minute" before 1998 is a mystery.
His re-edit of the house invasion sequence in Henry Portrait of a Serial Killer is an all time low I think

The snobbery of that guy is/was hilarious. Didn't he say that it was acceptable for educated, upper-class individuals to watch The Texas Chain Saw Massacre but 'what if a factory worker from Manchester was to see it?'

It's crazy to think that The Texas Chainsaw Massacre 2 was banned simply because of its association with the original film.

I've never seen this 'Sex and the Censors' documentary but it sounds interesting. Obviously the two Marc Morris-Jake West features ('Fear, Panic and Censorship' and 'Draconian Days') are brilliant and I liked 'Ban the Sadist Videos'.

[nastiesexpert]

Originally Posted by dallywhitty

The snobbery of that guy is/was hilarious. Didn't he say that it was acceptable for educated, upper-class individuals to watch The Texas Chain Saw Massacre but 'what if a factory worker from Manchester was to see it?'

It's crazy to think that The Texas Chainsaw Massacre 2 was banned simply because of its association with the original film.

I've never seen this 'Sex and the Censors' documentary but it sounds interesting. Obviously the two Marc Morris-Jake West features ('Fear, Panic and Censorship' and 'Draconian Days') are brilliant and I liked 'Ban the Sadist Videos'.

I've seen that quote from Ferman many times but I've not actually seen visual proof he said it but if he did I expect it may well have been back in the 70's when people would actually allow him to say it without telling him where to go.

The list of adjusted movies and cuts over the years is breathtaking.
IIRC The Burbs was edited because inoffensive clips from a banned movie was playing on a screen.
When Universal released Terror In the Aisles in the UK I seem to recall all references to The Exorcist . TCM and other "unavailable" films were taken out.
Fermans bizarre over reaction to a request to look at the use of martial arts weapons lead to him issuing a blanket ban on nunchuks with no exceptions so their appearance was even cut from one of the Pink Panther sequels.

The majority of US action movies that included random violence were cut in some way from the mid 80's until he left.
Cliffhanger was severely cut, ( uncut now of course) and the Arnie movie Eraser had such a long list of brief cuts they totalled 3-4 minutes.

Licence to Kill was cut by almost a minute and still got a 15. Goldeneye had headbutts and ear claps removed , Tomorrow Never Dies had the soundtrack adjusted to lessen the impact of punches etc.

Fermans ghost haunts us though. IN the last couple of years a ludicrous list of changes to the quite superb The Woman In Black were made to secure a 12. Widely quoted as having just 6 seconds cut - it is true that only 6 seconds was completely removed but lots of other sequences had the image darkened to make them less frightening and for the same reason the music was adjusted too.
Annoyingly the distributor did get the uncut version classified as a 15 but they didn't release it on disc and still haven't.
The US disc is uncut but region locked - not sure about the European versions

[Marv Inc.]

Originally Posted by nastiesexpert

The tale of New York Ripper being escorted out of the country is fiction.
I believe one of the various Video Nasties documentaries confirms this.

Although it's interesting to see 2 female BBFC examiners state the film was the worst they'd ever seen on the C4 Sex and the Censors documentary. One of those females has a rather large input on the Video Nasties 2 documentary. Made in 1991 it's a grim depressing 50 minutes showing exactly how bad it was in the UK with vice officers marching into London porn shops and making piles of magazines on the floor they think are illegal.
Equally depressing is smug git James Ferman showing us several sections of movies that he proudly censored. The UK population are so different from anyone else, even the audience for C4 have to be spared the Death Wish 2 rape scene which the camera shows briefly then moves away so we can't see it.

It's a great doco and C4 got into hot water for showing it. Not sure exactly which bits caused most problems but they do have a lengthy chat with a video nasty collector who is proudly playing a dreadful quality bootleg tape of New York Ripper in the background for which the camera zooms into in order to show the razor blade moments still missing today - and they played those same moments several times.
The doco has never been shown again. The only reason I have it is because I recorded it on VHS at the time and I eventually transferred it to dvd several years ago

Please upload the doc to youtube for us all.

[Lucy Ashton]

Originally Posted by dallywhitty

The snobbery of that guy is/was hilarious. Didn't he say that it was acceptable for educated, upper-class individuals to watch The Texas Chain Saw Massacre but 'what if a factory worker from Manchester was to see it?'

Wow, that would not fly in these politically correct times. Way to brand himself as a condescending jerk. Seriously, if you find a source/quote on this hilarious stance, please post it!

[Se.Vero]

Originally Posted by Fnord Prefect

I know that David Kerekes and David Slater exhaustively researched book See No Evil also included Xtro and Cain's Cutthroats on the list of titles liable for prosecution. Are those the 2 you are referring to? It also states that Samuel Fuller's Big Red One of all things may have briefly been included.

One of the two titles missing on the the online section 3 list but is mentioned on the dvd is "Eaten Alive". I dont remember the second...

[fatboyslim142]

Originally Posted by dallywhitty

Terrific idea for a thread. I wasn't around when the video nasties controversy kicked off (I was born in '94) but I've always been fascinated by it. I actually wrote an essay in Film Studies once about the lasting impact it has had on British censorship today.

I was born the year after all the Video Nasty controversy & 1 year before Feguson became United manager. November '85.

[fatboyslim142]

Originally Posted by Se.Vero

One of the two titles missing on the the online section 3 list but is mentioned on the dvd is "Eaten Alive". I dont remember the second...

Thanks. The 2 missing films NOT on list on Video Nasties Wikipedia page or Section 3 of pre-cert videos site are

Eaten Alive (Umberto Lenzi)
Honeymoon Horror (Harry Preston)

I just found complete list of DPP Section 3 (all 82 titles) in this review of the 2nd Video Nasties set.

http://www.nerdly.co.uk/2014/05/21/v...iew-screening/

Another thread with Section 3 BD info will be done shortly.

[agent999]

I have a relative who was in the police during this period. On a training course they were shown clips of video nasties, and explicitly told that Driller Killer was a real snuff film! No wonder there was such chaos and confusion at the time and innocous titles were seized if that kind of misinformation was being distributed by the powers that be. Maybe they were just concerned that the Videodrome signal coded into all these video nasties would give us brain tumours...

[drterror666]

I lived through this era of video nasty fun! I was never a trader, but I scored a few vids, namely The Beyond, Dawn of the Mummy, etc. It's hard to imagine the fear of being caught just for having this stuff in your house, but, like the threat of nuclear war, it was always there in the background. The kids don't know how good they've got it these days. I mean, just to get a banned film was good enough, it didn't matter if the PQ and / or SQ were utter shite!

[nastiesexpert]

Originally Posted by Marv Inc.

Please upload the doc to youtube for us all.

I wouldn't know where to begin.
I have it on a dvd and the tape is long gone