Kuro vs Kuro Elite Help

[msnoopy22]

1st what is the real difference btwn the kuro 5020 & kuro elite 111FD? I heard on CNET that the elite has better color. At BestBuy right now I can get the 5020 with a price match from (COSTCO) for $1,999 or I can get the 111 for $2,799. Am I going to notice a $800 difference in color?

With Pioneer stop making plasma is there going to be another price break? I think there current program is going on until March 3rd.

I also looked at the spec on both tv at BESTBUY.COM it says the "screen refresh rate" is 60HZ... I thought the Kuro was the best tv on the market. At least thats what CNET.com says. The Panosonic refresh rates on the 85u are 480 HZ's... Am I missing something here??? Why do the Panny have that much better of a screen refesh rate?

Is the Kuro the best bang for the buck?

[Sonny]

Originally Posted by msnoopy22

1st what is the real difference btwn the kuro 5020 & kuro elite 111FD? I heard on CNET that the elite has better color. At BestBuy right now I can get the 5020 with a price match from (COSTCO) for $1,999 or I can get the 111 for $2,799. Am I going to notice a $800 difference in color?

With Pioneer stop making plasma is there going to be another price break? I think there current program is going on until March 3rd.

I also looked at the spec on both tv at BESTBUY.COM it says the "screen refresh rate" is 60HZ... I thought the Kuro was the best tv on the market. At least thats what CNET.com says. The Panosonic refresh rates on the 85u are 480 HZ's... Am I missing something here??? Why do the Panny have that much better of a screen refesh rate?

Is the Kuro the best bang for the buck?

Best Buy said they would price match Costco?

[RISE23_BLU]

Ijust ordered the Pro 111, because its the best deal going for any of the Elite tv's. I was holding out for the Pro 141 or 151, but could not pass up the deal that being offered by Bestbuy for the Pro 111. Every home theater magazine has the Pro 111 as the Best TV on the market, so I say join the club, while you can get it at $2799. I saved myself 3 to 4 thousand by going with the 50"

[sheedoe]

Originally Posted by msnoopy22

1st what is the real difference btwn the kuro 5020 & kuro elite 111FD? I heard on CNET that the elite has better color. At BestBuy right now I can get the 5020 with a price match from (COSTCO) for $1,999 or I can get the 111 for $2,799. Am I going to notice a $800 difference in color?

The elite can have more accurate color because of the finer level of control over picture settings. Whether its worth the premium depends on how much of a videophile you are. For some it is worth the extra money, for others not so much. I say if you want the best TV there is and can afford it, go for it!

With Pioneer stop making plasma is there going to be another price break? I think there current program is going on until March 3rd.

That is hard to predict. Your guess is as good as mine.

I also looked at the spec on both tv at BESTBUY.COM it says the "screen refresh rate" is 60HZ... I thought the Kuro was the best tv on the market. At least thats what CNET.com says. The Panosonic refresh rates on the 85u are 480 HZ's... Am I missing something here??? Why do the Panny have that much better of a screen refesh rate?

Higher refresh rate for plasma doesn't mean better quality. The pio offers 60hz for 3:2 pulldown and 72hz for 3:3 pulldown (1080/24P).

Is the Kuro the best bang for the buck?

With the current prices, imo, YES.
With the kuro at their MSRP, I would chose the panasonic viera.

[msnoopy22]

Yes, Bestbuy said they would price match... I called and told them what I could get a 50 Kuro 5020 for at Costco and they said they would match it....

"Screen refresh rate" What is it? With the Kuro having the same refresh rate as LCD's does that mean I'm going to get that slow flicker I get with my LCD????

Quote: "Higher refresh rate for plasma doesn't mean better quality. The pio offers 60hz for 3:2 pulldown and 72hz for 3:3 pulldown (1080/24P)."

huh? What does that mean? I thought all Plasma's had the "Best" picture and motion? Am I better off just waiting and getting the 09 Panny? CNET says that the 09 Panny's still dont have the picture quality of the KURO.

If I get the 5020 KURO proffesional calibrated, will it fix the color problem that CNET says you have with the 5020 Kuro??????????

[Sonny]

Originally Posted by msnoopy22

Yes, Bestbuy said they would price match... I called and told them what I could get a 50 Kuro 5020 for at Costco and they said they would match it....

"Screen refresh rate" What is it? With the Kuro having the same refresh rate as LCD's does that mean I'm going to get that slow flicker I get with my LCD????

Quote: "Higher refresh rate for plasma doesn't mean better quality. The pio offers 60hz for 3:2 pulldown and 72hz for 3:3 pulldown (1080/24P)."

huh? What does that mean? I thought all Plasma's had the "Best" picture and motion? Am I better off just waiting and getting the 09 Panny? CNET says that the 09 Panny's still dont have the picture quality of the KURO.

If I get the 5020 KURO proffesional calibrated, will it fix the color problem that CNET says you have with the 5020 Kuro??????????

My Best Buy said NO. They have never matched Costco or Sams.

[Clark Kent]

The Elite Kuro's can achieve a more refined, truly accurate image with the help of a professional calibration over the regular model. If you get the Elite you really need an I.S.F. calibration to go with it to get the absolute best picture quality. The difference is worth it if you have the money but many people will be satisfied with the regular model.

[Slec]

Originally Posted by Sonny

My Best Buy said NO. They have never matched Costco or Sams.

With the economy the way it is.... these policies might get a bit looser

[msnoopy22]

Originally Posted by Clark Kent

The Elite Kuro's can achieve a more refined, truly accurate image with the help of a professional calibration over the regular model. If you get the Elite you really need an I.S.F. calibration to go with it to get the absolute best picture quality. The difference is worth it if you have the money but many people will be satisfied with the regular model.

Is the calibration that BESTBUY OFFERS the I.S.F calibration you are talking about? Is it the same thing basically?

Here's a question for $1,999 is there a better 50 inch plasma or LCD I can buy better than the KURO 5020??

[naturephoto1]

I have and love my 50" Kuro Elite PRO-111FD. It has a great picture and it also comes with side add on speakers that do not need to be mounted if you only wish to use the TV in your Home Theater with your whole system in operation. For myself, I attached the side speakers because I also watch the TV by itself with DirecTV HD broadcast and SD TV.

The Kuros in general and the PRO-111FD in particular are probably the best calibrated Plasma TVs right out of the box. The PRO-111FD also offers much more adjustment capabilities that are absent with the Kuro 5020 which are used to improve the picture performance.

The Plasma TVs do not suffer from the motion blur that LCDs do. They do not require as fast a refresh rate.

It is your call on which TV to purchase. But, at this point in time the Kuro Elite is the best Plasma TV made and very probably the finest 50" TV ever offered. For me, I wanted the best. I paid $4600 for mine in July right after they came out with a list price of $5000. Now, with the list price of $4500 and a selling price of $2799, I would consider that a steal.

Rich

[JimShaw]

Originally Posted by Sonny

Best Buy said they would price match Costco?

I have seen $2799 for the Elite at Best Buy already without a price match

[sheedoe]

Originally Posted by msnoopy22

"Screen refresh rate" What is it? With the Kuro having the same refresh rate as LCD's does that mean I'm going to get that slow flicker I get with my LCD????

You can read about refresh rate here.

If I get the 5020 KURO proffesional calibrated, will it fix the color problem that CNET says you have with the 5020 Kuro??????????

Pioneer intentionally crippled the non-elites to mark a difference between the elite model. There's just not enough controls available to make it perfect, even with the pro accessed service menu.

[My_Two_Cents]

Originally Posted by msnoopy22

I also looked at the spec on both tv at BESTBUY.COM it says the "screen refresh rate" is 60HZ... I thought the Kuro was the best tv on the market. At least thats what CNET.com says. The Panosonic refresh rates on the 85u are 480 HZ's... Am I missing something here??? Why do the Panny have that much better of a screen refesh rate?

Is the Kuro the best bang for the buck?

That is not the refresh rate. That is the subfield drive, which is all Marketing-speak for the technology that improves motion resolution (not 'blur', but the ability of the set to resolve ~900 lines during motion). Each pixel is divided into 8 sub-fields that refresh at 60Hz, 8x60Hz=480Hz subfield drive. The actual refresh rate is 60Hz, so the set handles 24p content with 3:2 pulldown. Some of the new Panys have a true 96Hz refresh rate, so they handle 24p at 4:4, which makes for a smoother 24p picture at times.

[naturephoto1]

Originally Posted by sheedoe

Pioneer intentionally crippled the non-elites to mark a difference between the elite model. There's just not enough controls available to make it perfect, even with the pro accessed service menu.

I wouldn't say that Pioneer intentionally crippled the non-elite TVs, I would just say that they didn't offer the adjustment capabilities found in the Elites. Though it was in part to separate the 2 lines and to give reason for the buyer to consider spending approximately $1000 additional.

Rich

[sheedoe]

Originally Posted by naturephoto1

I wouldn't say that Pioneer intentionally crippled the non-elite TVs, I would just say that they didn't offer the adjustment capabilities found in the Elites. Though it was in part to separate the 2 lines and to give reason for the buyer to consider spending approximately $1000 additional.

Rich

The reason why I wrote 'intentioanally crippled' is because the firmware based control wouldn't have cost them much to include. I would understand if there was more cost (i.e. better hardware) to build the elite, but picture controls, cmmon!!

edit: Also on the 9G NE they removed controls found on the 8G non-elites, whats that all about? Seems like intentional crippling to me .

[naturephoto1]

Originally Posted by sheedoe

The reason why I wrote 'intentioanally crippled' is because the firmware based control wouldn't have cost them much to include. I would understand if there was more cost (i.e. better hardware) to build the elite, but picture controls, cmmon!!

The Elites are adjusted better right out of the box. I can not confirm this, but I had been told from my Audio store that the parts going into the Elite models were hand selected off of the QA/QC line for their performance. That was supposed to be partially the difference. Additionally, the side speakers and the fact that they can be added and removed add to the price. In addition, as I recall the Kuro TVs come with a 1 year warranty while the Elite line comes with a 2 year warranty.

Rich

[sheedoe]

Originally Posted by naturephoto1

The Elites are adjusted better right out of the box. I can not confirm this, but I had been told from my Audio store that the parts going into the Elite models were hand selected off of the QA/QC line for their performance. That was supposed to be partially the difference. Additionally, the side speakers and the fact that they can be added and removed add to the price. In addition, as I recall the Kuro TVs come with a 1 year warranty while the Elite line comes with a 2 year warranty.

Rich

Those differences are certainly justifiable. But the main difference is still the picture controls. Omitting that feature pushes most people to go for the elite. Pioneer wanted to make a marketable difference, so they crippled the Non-elites to make the Elite supreme. And they are.

[msnoopy22]

Originally Posted by sheedoe

Those differences are certainly justifiable. But the main difference is still the picture controls. Omitting that feature pushes most people to go for the elite. Pioneer wanted to make a marketable difference, so they crippled the Non-elites to make the Elite supreme. And they are.

When I went to BESTBUY they told me that they take the back of the tv off and plug something into that would control setting that I cant get to. Anyone ever hear this?? Maybe it's just a simple sales tactic for upsale of CALIBRATION... but what if its not???? What if they can get to the other adjustment that aren't accessible through the regular KURO....IF SO... it would give the better picture... Right.... Okak maybe I'm strecthing....lol ;-)

What does this calibration actually? ITS $300!!!!!!!!!! Is calibration real? Or MEDIA HYPE?

Do you think If I got it Calibrated would I get the "same picture" as the ELITE????

[sheedoe]

Originally Posted by msnoopy22

When I went to BESTBUY they told me that they take the back of the tv off and plug something into that would control setting that I cant get to. Anyone ever hear this?? Maybe it's just a simple sales tactic for upsale of CALIBRATION... but what if its not???? What if they can get to the other adjustment that aren't accessible through the regular KURO....IF SO... it would give the better picture... Right.... Okak maybe I'm strecthing....lol ;-)

What does this calibration actually? ITS $300!!!!!!!!!! Is calibration real? Or MEDIA HYPE?

Do you think If I got it Calibrated would I get the "same picture" as the ELITE????

Calibration is real. You can access the service menu to do the calibration using a serial cable and controlCAL software. I, like most people here, would not recommend you hire someone from best buy to calibrate your TV. Find an independent pro calibrator with experience working with the kuro. If you're ready to learn more about the set, everything you need to know is in this thread.
Also, even if you get the non-elite professionally calibrated, it won't be as accurate as the Elite's. But it will be pretty close.

[jcs913]

[QUOTE=sheedoe;1630138
edit: Also on the 9G NE they removed controls found on the 8G non-elites, whats that all about? Seems like intentional crippling to me .[/QUOTE]

I have the 5010 and there are much more picture adjustments in the user menu then in the 5020. This was intentional to further diferentiate the Elite from the non. The 8g model I have is almost identical to the Elite model, except for slightly better video processing and some (I mean a small amount) of picture adjustments, hence me not spending the extra money for the Elite. The 9g models are a bigger difference between the Elite and non in adjustability. I would have definetly opted for the Elite (especially at the $2799 price) in a heartbeat, due to the advanced adjustments.