Old TV shows / anything shot on tape - no need for blu-ray?

[damnspynovels]

I’m confused. I love Blu-Ray, but don’t understand how it can ever truly replace DVD.

I understand movies or in fact anything shot on film can be remastered, rescanned and transferred again to improve on a previous DVD release. I get it.

But what about tv shows? All those tv box sets from shows shot on tape. Am I right in thinking none of that can be converted properly to a higher resolution? What would be the point of ever converting it?

[Bobby Henderson]

There is no need to convert old TV shows recorded on videotape to HD. However, those shows can benefit from the higher available bit rates and disc capacity of Blu-ray. An entire season's worth of shows could be stored on just one or two BD discs whereas with DVD you're looking at a stack of discs.

An uncompressed digital master tape of SD material can run upwards of 250 million bits per second. DVD video is limited to a 10 million bit per second bandwidth limit for video and cumulative bit rate of all audio tracks in the program. Blu-ray has much more headroom to lower compression levels.

There's lots of vintage TV shows originally produced on film. They can be remastered to high definition, although there would be controversy in cropping 4:3 composed TV shows to 16:9. I prefer pillar-boxing and keeping the show's original aspect ratio intact.

[damnspynovels]

I guess. Though I see it as a less compelling reason for your average guy to upgrade their six disc box set of Married With Children than their copy of Casino Royale. Who knows though.

[bageleaterkkjji]

Originally Posted by Bobby Henderson

I prefer pillar-boxing and keeping the show's original aspect ratio intact.

me too...anyone who watches stretched out tv has to be retarded...sort of like this guy
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0wQq9YWZ568

[Mr.White]

Yes most comedy's were shot on tape like All In The Family,The Jeffersons,etc,so they should be fine on DVD,with the the execption of M*A*S*H,that was shot on film,I think a restored complete series of that show would look incredble on Blu,release the whole series together Fox not season by season like they did w/ the Dvd's and saving the Martini's and Medicine36 disc set after fans bought each season seperately for alot of $!!! Dramas on the other hand were usually FILMED,shows like Kojak,Dragnet,Dallas,etc,they would also look great on blu,if restored! And here's another extreme,MONTY PYTHON'S FLYING CIRCUS,that was a COMBO deal,film and tape,I think that the DVD's from A&E are just fine,plus I like the gritty,rough feel on Monty,that's part of the shows "charm"!

[Jeff Kleist]

MASH has or soon will have HD masters available

I don't expect to see them even think about it for a long time however, so HD airings on cable will probably be the best you get

11 seasons is painful to replace. I know it's not something I'm planning to do unless I can buy it for $20 a season

[Clark Kent]

Originally Posted by Bobby Henderson

There is no need to convert old TV shows recorded on videotape to HD. However, those shows can benefit from the higher available bit rates and disc capacity of Blu-ray. An entire season's worth of shows could be stored on just one or two BD discs whereas with DVD you're looking at a stack of discs.

An uncompressed digital master tape of SD material can run upwards of 250 million bits per second. DVD video is limited to a 10 million bit per second bandwidth limit for video and cumulative bit rate of all audio tracks in the program. Blu-ray has much more headroom to lower compression levels.

I strongly agree with this idea. I foresee a time when the studios will release complete runs of a show in standard definition on Blu-ray on a few discs but with elaborate physical props to entice consumers to buy the show over again. We started seeing that in a limited way already on dvd with things like the Seinfeld set. Once people get used to the idea of having the entire show on a few discs the studios will add tons of gimmicky extras.

[Jeff Kleist]

I strongly agree with this idea. I foresee a time when the studios will release complete runs of a show in standard definition on Blu-ray on a few discs but with elaborate physical props to entice consumers to buy the show over again.

While there may be a limited edition like that, it's not going to become common practice in any way. It'll just be a set of BD-25s each one containing a sitcom season

There are already a few shows that have been upconverted, and at least one is planned for blu release, but everything I see says to me that once people find out it's an upconvert, it'll kill sales hardcore

[lobosrul]

I know this has been discussed here, but:

Going back to the 70's the overwhelming majority of US weekly TV shows have been filmed (some of them in 16mm though, which still will probably show improvement from 480i to 720p). I Love Lucy was the first filmed TV show I believe. However, its less compelling (to me anyway) to see an old sitcom @ BD quality than the latest action/sci-fi movie.

If they released them on BD for cheap, and maybe used 720p for some older shows (you could easily fit an entire season of half hour shows @ 720p quality on 1 disc with DD audio), then there would be a few I'd purchase.

As far as cramming a bunch of standard def taped shows on 1 BD rather than many DVD's. Yeah its a good idea in theory, but I'm not re-purchasing any box sets just for convenience. If I was made of money I would. Theres also a worry that the "average joe" expects BD's to always be High definition, and releasing standard def blu-rays may confuse people

Oh, and OAR or bust.

Edit: Monty Python's Flying circus was taped indoors, outdoor shots were filmed on 16mm. This was very common in the UK until the late 90's.

[tron3]

Originally Posted by Bobby Henderson

...
There's lots of vintage TV shows originally produced on film. They can be remastered to high definition, although there would be controversy in cropping 4:3 composed TV shows to 16:9. I prefer pillar-boxing and keeping the show's original aspect ratio intact.

Seinfeld has been airing in HD with that stupid 16:9 cropping. You do see grain, which is part of the appeal / disadvantage of film. Depends on who you ask. Otherwise, it is a very nice picture.

I don't like the cropping because you sometimes lose the subtle hand gestures on close shots. This would really hurt Bookman, the library cop with his hand pointed accusations. 16:9 isn't everything. Keep it 4:3 or you will be sorry.

"What do you know about sorry? Did you ever kill a man? Ever have a man die in your arms?" - Bookman the library cop / Seinfeld

[Dynamo of Eternia]

Originally Posted by bageleaterkkjji

me too...anyone who watches stretched out tv has to be retarded...sort of like this guy
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0wQq9YWZ568

Well then I guess I'm retarded.

However, I should state that I would prefer to watch the shows pillar boxed.

But I had a problem a while ago where my wife and I watched a lot of 4:3 content pillar boxed for probably a good couple of weeks without much of anything that filled up the whole screen being watched inbetween. And then on the left side of the screen, for a while, that section (where the pillar box had been) was darker, and then even after that cleared up, there was a line going right down where the end of the pillar box met up with where the show is displayed.

Luckily we have an LCD TV and this wasn't permanent, but it took a good while for it to go away and has freaked me out ever since.

So, I watch a lot of that type of content on the "Zoom 2" setting on my TV, which kind of does a medium of stretching the content to fit the screen, but also stretches it up and down a little bit, cutting off a little from the top and bottom in exchange for not having the picture as badly distorted horizantally as it otherwise would be. I prefer pillar box, but I do worry about doing it too much.

Lately, I will watch something pillarboxed if it's only a single, 1/2 hour program and I will be watching something else that fills up the whole screen afterwards.

But I am going to sit down and watch a bunch of episodes of a 4:3 TV show on DVD, due to my concern over this issue, I will unfotunately end up watching it in Zoom 2 mode.

[lobosrul]

Originally Posted by Dynamo of Eternia

Luckily we have an LCD TV and this wasn't permanent, but it took a good while for it to go away and has freaked me out ever since.

You may occasionally get image retention with an LCD, but you will never ever, ever, ever, ever, ever ,ever have permanent burn in. Its actually almost impossible with newer plasmas as well.