Untitled Superman Film (JJ Abrams)

[Prog5000]

A fresh start makes sense from the studio. They made a mess of superman’s 3 most recent appearances and starting again makes sense to them. Restarting with Henry is unlikely as the studio will want to push the new start angle and will perceive a new start with the same actor as confusing to an audience. We may not agree but I’m hoping for a decent film out of this.

[enenra]

Originally Posted by The Swan Returns

These are unprecedented levels of “I’m not racist, but...”

This is such a pathetic way to shut down arguments/debates.
You know exactly why too.

Embarrassing.

[voltz]

Originally Posted by Chedwiggen

I'm going to pass on this reboot, WB is clearly intent on making DC films one big epic disaster. Hope Cavill gets another franchise, maybe Bond.

I'm hoping reboot is a disaster.
I'm hoping Snyder cut is a hit and sets the establishment.
I'm hoping Cavill gets re-cast as Superman to main films, crossovers etc.
I'm hoping JJ gets a detailed foot print on his jeans.

[Jumpman]

Originally Posted by captveg

They are no longer interested in a shared universe.

If you are a filmmaker with a DC movie idea they think they can sell they'll look into making it.

Reeves and a Batman movie not connected to any other DC movie? Being made.

A Joker film that has nothing to do with any other DC movie? Made.

Wonder Woman 3 will ignore all films except Wonder Woman and Wonder Woman 1984. The Amazons spin off will ignore all films except the WW films.

Aquaman 2 will ignore all films except Aquaman. The Trench film will ignore all other films except the Aquaman films.

Shazam/Black Adam films will ignore all other films except the first Shazam film.

This is not one universe. It is dozens of universes.

That's the current approach. There's not just one Batman, there's five in five different continuities. There's not just one Superman, there's four in four different continuities.

They DO NOT WANT a single universe. That ship sailed in 2017. There will only ever be one MCU. They won the movie industry sweepstakes for all time, and no studio will ever - EVER - be able to do what they did in the next 100 years. It cannot be done, because anyone that tries to follow will ALWAYS be considered inferior and "copying" the MCU. So best for AT&T and WB to just make movies like they know how - one at a time. Successes get direct sequels, and those that don't succeed get abandoned.

This is exactly it.

And the kicker? This was sort of the plan when Man of Steel was made. Man of Steel was suppose to kick off the Dark Knight Trilogy treatment for Superman. A trilogy of films for Superman. That’s it. No shared universe. But, WB management at the time got Disney envy and here we are. But, as you said, 2017 killed that dream. Now, they’re going back to the old days; just making movies....which is what they should’ve been doing all along with these characters. Using the multiverse in the Flash movie is all about just saying “every piece of DC catalog content matters.” All that does is REALLY free them up to do whatever they want.

[voltz]

Shows you they don't have the ability to work within the context.

It's because of this that DC can't make a proper transition of any kind to the film medium like Marvel has and for fans this is a complete letdown.

[CreasyBear]

Marvel made CSI: The Superhero Franchise, so let's calm down about what they "accomplished". It's easy to pander and make shallow interchangeable insignificant pap over and over again, never straying from a single tired formula. It's difficult to put your own stamp on something like Superman or Batman and make it uniquely your own.

[mwynn]

If it is so easy why has no one else been able to accomplish it?

[mwynn]

Originally Posted by slumcat

I think it should be Clark Kent. It sends a better message. That black Superman ain’t some fringe variation. No, actual proper Superman now is black. No ifs or buts.

Jordan is a business man. He would want to have his own brand. This would pretty much give Warner another IP to exploit.

[slumcat]

Originally Posted by Dunemoon

Tell that to Jerry and Joe. Wakanda doesn't exist either. So, should it be reworked as Whitecanya?

Because white heroes are dime a dozen. It is simply a question of volume. There haven’t been big heroic representations of black people and that needs to change. It is a question of representation.

Originally Posted by mwynn

If it is so easy why has no one else been able to accomplish it?

I think MCU is a big screen TV series. I like only 1 MCU movie the russos directed. I have little interest in Antman or MCU Spider-Man so never seen those films, and haven’t seen several MCU films. But I have still seen many. The quality is variable, certainly.

Yet I still acknowledge that Fiege’s achievement in what he has done with MCU is skull crushing. Filmmaking is a business but it is also logistics. Managing about 100 characters and actors across multiple franchises and cross overs, weaving in storylines and laying the foundation of others, working with gigantic budgets yet consistently delivering crowd pleasers and critical hits with literally every movie is absolutely outrageous. And he was working with a bad hand. Non comic book readers did not know any of these characters. I never read comics and I knew Superman and Batman but iron man Thor cap I had never heard of. For fiege to make them bigger than Batman Superman, and make no mistake in cinema terms that are, is again an insane achievement.

If anyone has done project management in their offices, ensuring consistency of tone and message say in the slides of 3 people even is a challenge. To do it across thousands of people is a miracle.

Again, I might not like or watch all MCU projects, but the scale of their ambition and execution is literally inhuman.

I think only people who know nothing about filmmaking would sneeze at MCU.

I always say this, take the word of the beloved star whose balls Snyder fans routinely ride. It was Ben Affleck the star of Snyderverse who proclaimed that Fiege is the greatest producer who ever lived.

[Darthvaderrocks]

Originally Posted by CreasyBear

Marvel made CSI: The Superhero Franchise, so let's calm down about what they "accomplished". It's easy to pander and make shallow interchangeable insignificant pap over and over again, never straying from a single tired formula. It's difficult to put your own stamp on something like Superman or Batman and make it uniquely your own.

We don't agree on other directors but hell yes if we agree on the MCU.

The happy Madison of superheroes in a nutshell, just the same trope, unrecognizable directing, no stakes and CGI popcorn shit.

I don't like the DCEU, but at least I do have common sense when it comes to actual quality instead of bashing stuff like TDK and Joker to prop up MCU's garbage, and soulless products.

[oneway23]

This is going to go over great, because people always seem to take changes like this in stride. Multi-verse enables a dozen Supermen, if they so choose. Who cares? No big deal...So long as it's Calvin Ellis and not Clark Kent.

I'm sure there are people who'll get annoyed by that statement, and that's fine, BUT, I'd argue that it may be more insulting to the black community to merely race-swap an existing established character and say, "Look, you get your own Superman for you, too!"

It's not only insulting, but, it's elitist and, frankly tone deaf if they were to use a black actor to play Clark Kent. There's no "message sent" there. Instead of investing in and building up one out of the countless array of existing black superheroes, the only message WB would be sending by having a black actor play Clark Kent is basically saying that none of the existing black superheroes are worthy of trusting in, banking on, or, believing in.

I'm not going to overreact until I see how this develops, as, we're likely a few years away, at least. I fully expect Michael B. Jordan (if he even gets the role) to direct himself in Creed 3 first.

[CreasyBear]

Fiege lucked into it with Iron Man and made it up as they went along, using the post credits as a way to tease a story that might come. Civil War wouldn't exist, for example, had DC not announced Batman v Superman. The Russo's admitted that. They leach and cheat filmgoers by always teasing and rarely, if ever, truly delivering. Portals is a great moment, but the battle that follows is insanely forgettable and mundane. That kind of encompasses the MCU - strong buildup and anticipation, but never having the balls to trust the audience, genuinely commit to the story, and follow through.

[Darthvaderrocks]

I never liked the MCU, since 2008.

It's just a big TV series directed by talentless hacks, and has no stakes. All the character development is swept under the rug, there's no recognizable talent, wit and heart.

Their films are flash-in-the-pan that gets hyped and then forgotten i guess, since anyone can see how IW lacks of a logical or good story structure or that Civil War was just a bathroom brawl, and people spitting jokes so... a tonally inconsistent mess.

Give me Hulk, Spider-Man 1 and 2 (despite their flaws), Logan, Man of Steel and Sin City over anything from the MCU.

[John1701D]

[s2mikey]

Originally Posted by oneway23

This is going to go over great, because people always seem to take changes like this in stride. Multi-verse enables a dozen Supermen, if they so choose. Who cares? No big deal...So long as it's Calvin Ellis and not Clark Kent.

I'm sure there are people who'll get annoyed by that statement, and that's fine, BUT, I'd argue that it may be more insulting to the black community to merely race-swap an existing established character and say, "Look, you get your own Superman for you, too!"

It's not only insulting, but, it's elitist and, frankly tone deaf if they were to use a black actor to play Clark Kent. There's no "message sent" there. Instead of investing in and building up one out of the countless array of existing black superheroes, the only message WB would be sending by having a black actor play Clark Kent is basically saying that none of the existing black superheroes are worthy of trusting in, banking on, or, believing in.

I'm not going to overreact until I see how this develops, as, we're likely a few years away, at least. I fully expect Michael B. Jordan (if he even gets the role) to direct himself in Creed 3 first.

Bravo. Someone gets it. There are numerous characters that they could go with that would not only be just as "representative" but would do without the "catering" or "box-checking" that a race swap would feel like. The message would be "Oh, some exec at DC must have had a memo come across his desk to race swap Superman to feel like they're *doing something*". C'mon. Enough.

Look at how well Black Panther came out. I enjoyed that film and honestly it was simply good because it was good. Not the best superhero film ever or anything but very entertaining and its on my shelf. While watching it I never linger on the characters race - I simply get into their development & the outcome of the story. It was somewhat unique and thats what made it good. Great casting too. And thats it.

As for another Superman movie? Ehhh. Im a big fan of the first two Reeves film and those are my canon per se. Returns is OK as a sequel to those and despite its issues its far better than the older SM 3 and 4 which are unwatchable trash. Id probably be OUT for any new ones. Ill watch the The original SM 1 and SM2 and Returns if I need some Superman.

Originally Posted by Darthvaderrocks

I never liked the MCU, since 2008.

It's just a big TV series directed by talentless hacks, and has no stakes. All the character development is swept under the rug, there's no recognizable talent, wit and heart.

Their films are flash-in-the-pan that gets hyped and then forgotten i guess, since anyone can see how IW lacks of a logical or good story structure or that Civil War was just a bathroom brawl, and people spitting jokes so... a tonally inconsistent mess.

Give me Hulk, Spider-Man 1 and 2 (despite their flaws), Logan, Man of Steel and Sin City over anything from the MCU.

We enjoy some of the MCU individual films(Iron man, Thor, etc) but as a whole universe we cant get into it. The Avengers and all that just doesnt do it for me. Its just too much. I thought the Ed Norton Hulk was great if thats what you were talking about. Love the Raimi Spider man films. Not a fan at all of MoS though. Im a Reeves Superman(1&2 only) guy.

[mwynn]

Originally Posted by Darthvaderrocks

I never liked the MCU, since 2008.

Really wow, have not heard this statement from you in the last could hours. I would have though you would have changed your mind since yesterday.

[Darthvaderrocks]

Originally Posted by mwynn

Really wow, have not heard this statement from you in the last could hours. I would have though you would have changed your mind since yesterday.

I also don't like the DCEU, excluding Wonder Woman and MoS.

[mwynn]

Originally Posted by CreasyBear

Fiege lucked into it with Iron Man and made it up as they went along, using the post credits as a way to tease a story that might come. Civil War wouldn't exist, for example, had DC not announced Batman v Superman. The Russo's admitted that. They leach and cheat filmgoers by always teasing and rarely, if ever, truly delivering. Portals is a great moment, but the battle that follows is insanely forgettable and mundane. That kind of encompasses the MCU - strong buildup and anticipation, but never having the balls to trust the audience, genuinely commit to the story, and follow through.

That sounds like a statement on the Warner current DC universe. Reboot reboot reboot, and just for good measure reboot again.

[mwynn]

Originally Posted by Darthvaderrocks

I also don't like the DCEU, excluding Wonder Woman and MoS.

Can you add me to your ignore list for the third time?

[mwynn]

Originally Posted by oneway23

This is going to go over great, because people always seem to take changes like this in stride. Multi-verse enables a dozen Supermen, if they so choose. Who cares? No big deal...So long as it's Calvin Ellis and not Clark Kent.

I'm sure there are people who'll get annoyed by that statement, and that's fine, BUT, I'd argue that it may be more insulting to the black community to merely race-swap an existing established character and say, "Look, you get your own Superman for you, too!"

It's not only insulting, but, it's elitist and, frankly tone deaf if they were to use a black actor to play Clark Kent. There's no "message sent" there. Instead of investing in and building up one out of the countless array of existing black superheroes, the only message WB would be sending by having a black actor play Clark Kent is basically saying that none of the existing black superheroes are worthy of trusting in, banking on, or, believing in.

I'm not going to overreact until I see how this develops, as, we're likely a few years away, at least. I fully expect Michael B. Jordan (if he even gets the role) to direct himself in Creed 3 first.

If there plan is to get people to organize and support like what happened with Black Panther, they will get the opposite if they cast Jordan as Clark Kent.