LG's new Z3 8K OLED TV

[Robert Zohn]

Let the discussions begin!

Just completed our LG Z3 8K OLED TV webpage with a lot of new information and, prices, delivery dates, and the .pdf spec. sheets:

[HDTV1080P]

Awesome to see a 8K resolution OLED in a 88 inch size for a good price of only $24,999 (lot cheaper than prior years for 8K technology). 8K displays are released a few years before native 8K material arrives (the displays always come first just like 2K and 4K did). The only thing that concerns me is that the HDCP chip is not firmware upgradable, therefore if in the year 2026+ if a 8K optical disc format, 8K streaming box, 8K cable TV box, 8K satellite box, or 8K videogame console decides to use a theoretical HDCP 3.4 instead of HDCP 2.3, then one will only be able to use a 8K camcorder with the HDMI inputs and will not be able to use 8K external boxes at 8K quality (but might be able to use a external 8K device at 4K quality with HDCP 2.3). But HDCP 2.3 is secure (at least much more secure then HDCP 1.4), so maybe the movie studios will allow 8K movies with HDCP 2.3, but there is a strong possibility something like HDCP 3.0 or higher might be needed. This is why all future Displayports and HDMI ports need to have a mandate by the HDMI industry to have the HDCP chip firmware upgradable on all future consumer products manufactured by a certain date. This is what is keeping many earlier adopters from buying $25,000+ displays, $6,000+ A/V receivers, and other equipment with a HDMI input.

On the positive side, most likely in the year 2026+ LG Electronics theoretically will issue a firmware update to the TV’s operating system and add native 8K apps like 8K YOUTUBE, 8K Netflix, 8K Amazon, 8K VUDU, etc. So by 2026+ one should be able to watch streaming content in true 8K resolution with either lossless or lossy audio (hopefully lossless).

[HDTV1080P]

I wish LG and Sony would start adding HDR10+ to their OLED displays. Then consumers could have both Dolby Vision HDR and HDR10+ from one display if that were to happen.

[Vilya]

"Pinnicle" is spelled p-i-n-n-a-c-l-e.

Premium priced products should have correctly spelled promotions.

Premium priced products like the LG 8K Z3 should be full-featured and support all varieties of HDR.

8K physical media is a pipe dream and any 8K streaming will likely be compressed to hell and back. I'd love to be wrong about that, but I don't think that I will be.

Without a meaningful supply of 8K content to view, what real value does this TV offer? Does it markedly improve the appearance of 4K/2K content? Is some degree of better upscaling all that we can hope for with this $10,000 to $25,000 8K TV? The ability to watch 8K youtube cat videos in all of their glory isn't much of a selling point.

[Robert Zohn]

Sorry for my typo in my LG dealer status name "Prestigious Pinnacle Dealer"and thanks for letting me know so I can fix it now.

Regarding the value in buying a premium 8K OLED TV I hope this helps to understand some of the many advantages that only a Native 8K TV can deliver.

It's not just the 8K resolution that makes any 8K TV perform better than all 4K TVs. 8K TVs have 400% more RGB sub-pixels so 8K TVs are brighter with better color saturation and color volume.

Also because the the significantly smaller pixels and enhanced pixel density all curved items are naturally rendered with better uniformity as the 8K TV can make smoother circles.

Other advantages are for anyone who owns an 8K camera or any Samsung Cell Phone that comes with the built-in Native 8K camera. I filmed our son's wedding that was in the backyard of our home and when I played the native 8K stills and video I felt like I belonged in Hollywood! All of the images were stunning!

Also it future proofs you for when more 8K content becomes available. I have already discussed with most of the manufactures and I was assured they built the new 2023 and 2024 8K SoC processors to have the ability to accept firmware upgrades to accept all of the potential 8K content from streaming and physical disc, and OTA, cable and satellite content.

[Robert Zohn]

@Vilya, Typo fixed

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by Robert Zohn

It's not just the 8K resolution that makes any 8K TV perform better than all 4K TVs. 8K TVs have 400% more RGB sub-pixels so 8K TVs are brighter with better color saturation and color volume.

Also because the the significantly smaller pixels and enhanced pixel density all curved items are naturally rendered with better uniformity as the 8K TV can make smoother circles.

Other advantages are for anyone who owns an 8K camera or any Samsung Cell Phone that comes with the built-in Native 8K camera. I filmed our son's weeding that was in the backyard of our home and when I played the native 8K stills and video I felt like I belonged in Hollywood! All of the images were stunning!

Also it future proofs you for when more 8K content becomes available. I have already discussed with most of the manufactures and I was assured they built the new 2023 and 2024 8K SoC processors to have the ability to accept firmware upgrades to accept all of the potential 8K content from streaming and physical disc, and OTA, cable and satellite content.

Are these improvements that we can readily perceive and appreciate at normal viewing distances/environments or are these just better statistics on a piece of paper? Does the rubber meet the road here?

Do these manufacturers *guarantee* compatibility with potential changes to 8K content or is it just nebulous good intentions? Are there even any discussions about creating an industry wide 8K standard like we currently have with 4K? For example, with 4K we have agreed upon standards with the blu-ray disc association (BDA); I am not aware of any similar efforts regarding the standardizing of 8K content.

There have been no indications, as far as I can tell, that anyone is developing an 8K physical format, yet alone the hardware to play it. This seems to be pure fantasy on the part of the naively optimistic, or, perhaps, the 8K TV marketing departments telling customers to be ready for something that isn't even being planned conceptually.

We have had 8K displays for a few years now and I am not seeing any movie/TV studios, or streaming services, planning to offer 8K content. If it is not happening after all of this time, when, if ever, will it? The 8K TV market share hasn't exactly been exciting anyone with its miniscule growth year over year. Without significant 8K content to view anytime soon, do the 8K TV manufacturers really expect increased brightness and 4K upscaling to inspire the consumer to buy into this essentially unsupported display tech with no agreed upon standards and no meaningful supply of 8K content? 8K TVs really seem like the product that nobody has asked for.

Congratulations to your son and to your daughter-in-law on their recent wedding.

[cipher]

Robert, is this the 2023 or 2024 Z models?

These have "3" in their model names (77Z3, 88Z3) instead of "4" like the rest of of their OLED line this year (G4, C4, B4). LG models usually take the number from the current year so it's a bit confusing. Also, the specs indicate they are using the A9 processor instead of the newer A11 coming in the G4. Is that accurate?

I'd love a 88" Z series OLED, but I'd have to wait until prices drop on these 8K OLEDs before I could even consider them. Those who can afford them are very lucky.

[Vilya]

Most commercial movie theaters still project at 2K resolution and a small few at 4K resolution, but none project at 8K resolution. Seeing as cinema screens are vastly larger than what any of us have at home, why do we need, or even want, 8K resolution? If the increase in resolution from 4K to 8K is not worth the effort at the cinema, what is the benefit of doing it at home on our comparatively tiny screens? Increased resolution alone just isn't enough to justify 8K displays.

Top tier 4K displays already have great color saturation and color volume; is there really that much room left for improvement? Is the improved color saturation/volume on a 8K display THAT dramatic? $10,000, even $25,000, dramatic?

4K displays are already closing in on 2,000 nits and up; how much more do we need? Apparently, the Z3 is actually dimmer than the LG 4K G3 at one-third the price:

"The surprising limitation is that the OLED77Z3 is palpably less bright than LG’s G3 4K OLED TVs, despite both sets using the MLA-plus-processing Brightness Booster Max technology. It’s slightly brighter than its Z2 predecessor, to be fair, but the ‘giant brightness leap for OLED kind’ witnessed with the G3s just isn’t there to nearly the same extent."

https://www.whathifi.com/reviews/lg-z3-oled77z3

Without any supply of 8K content beyond demo clips, what we really have here is a very expensive upscaler. Is that enough to justify the price?

8K displays seem like a case of truly diminishing returns. They cost plenty of bucks, but they don't seem to deliver all that much bang.

[Robert Zohn]

LG's Z3 is brighter than the G3 period. Sorry to disagree with whathfi.com is saying.

The G3 has 4x the amount of self illuminating pixels as as it was correctly said they share the same MLA advancements.

Also my post above explains many of the advantages of what 8K TVs can naturally render in overall image performance vs. 4K TVs.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by Robert Zohn

LG's Z3 is brighter than the G3 period. Sorry to disagree with whathfi.com is saying.

The G3 has 4x the amount of self illuminating pixels as as it was correctly said they share the same MLA advancements.

Also my post above explains many of the advantages of what 8K TVs can naturally render in overall image performance vs. 4K TVs.

You stated some non-specific advantages, but you did not quantify them in any way, such as how much brighter is brighter? 1%, 10%, 25%, etc.? How many nits in what % window does the Z3 achieve compared to the G3? The G3 scores 1410 nits in a 10% window for HDR brightness; how fares the Z3? Less subjective adjectives and more hard information would be helpful.

How much smoother are the rendering of curves and circles? I have never noticed such a problem on any of the 4K TVs that I own nor have I ever even heard of anyone complain about how well circles are rendered on their 4K TVs- and that's on a forum filled with people complaining about every little thing.

How much better is the color saturation or the color volume? Is it obviously better, as in everyone would notice it right away, or is it just an incremental bump in a test bench score?

Rtings.com scores the color gamut and color volume for the LG G3 at 8.6 and 8.3 (out of 10), respectively. They score the Sony A95L at 9.4 and 9.2, respectively. Where does the Z3 rate on these two points? Would a score above 9.4 and 9.2 be $10K to $25K worth of significant?

https://www.rtings.com/tv/reviews/lg/g3-oled#test_179

https://www.rtings.com/tv/reviews/lg/g3-oled#test_179

The Z3 costs a whole of money just to upscale a 4K stream from Netflix or to watch the occasional 8K home video shot with a smartphone. I'm trying to see what makes this TV worth its price beyond the bragging rights of simply having the latest toy. Where exactly is the "wow!" factor? TVs costing five figures should really, really have one helluva "wow" factor.

[Robert Zohn]

@Vilya, when LG's very first allocation/shipment of Z38K OLED TVs arrive, which is now expected early May we will be throughly testing and evaluating the 77" and 88" Z3.

For now I have seen the Z3 at CES and a private meeting and LG had the Z3 next to the G4. It is easy to see the higher luminance and enhanced color saturation and color volume on the Z3 vs. the G4 and the Z2.

I'll post more technical information when we complete our testing and evaluation.

[Vilya]

I'd love to see all of the flagship TVs, but we don't have high-end A/V retailers out here in the boonies. Not even a Best Buy within 50 miles.

[Robert Zohn]

It's not the same seeing TVs over the Internet, but hope you will tune into our April 20th unboxing, set-up and 1st impressions on many of the new 2024 premium TVs that will be on Stop the FOMO's YouTube Channel.

We also started the planing of our 2024 TV Shootout® Evaluation event that will be late June - early July 2024.

[Deciazulado]

Originally Posted by Vilya

Are these improvements that we can readily perceive and appreciate at normal viewing distances/environments or are these just better statistics on a piece of paper?

I sit closer than 2PH ( <- = middle of a theater) from my UHDTV trying to get the IMAX experience. Remember that all those recommended size/distances charts usually tell you the farthest distance you can see the resolution (farther you start not seeing it). That doesn't mean you can't sit closer, on the contrary, sit closer and you still see it or see it better + you get telepresence and immersiveness (like in the cinema). Smaller pixels, even with 4K content will make the image look more solid and seamless in the bigger FoV. (And apparently people want the bigger FoV at the cinemas, look at all the noise Oppenheimer and Dune IMAX create, so why not home).

2nd, as I posted long ago in a 8K thread if you like art and photography, well most art and photography will display better in 8K. 35mm Still Photography (24mm x 36mm) (= to VistaVision) generates a "6K" wide (or tall for portraits) scan at 4000ppi (4K) and it was one of the smallest film photo formats. Now we have digital cameras with 8K or more, and there's also Panoramic stitching of images. Imagine seeing Louvre paintings in your home in 8K with QD/W-OLED/microLED contrast and 2020 color spaces. Etc. There's applications besides movies and sports.


But about movies and sports.

Originally Posted by Vilya

"Do these manufacturers *guarantee* compatibility with potential changes to 8K content or is it just nebulous good intentions? Are there even any discussions about creating an industry wide 8K standard like we currently have with 4K? For example, with 4K we have agreed upon standards with the blu-ray disc association (BDA); I am not aware of any similar efforts regarding the standardizing of 8K content.

There have been no indications, as far as I can tell, that anyone is developing an 8K physical format, yet alone the hardware to play it. This seems to be pure fantasy on the part of the naively optimistic, or, perhaps, the 8K TV marketing departments telling customers to be ready for something that isn't even being planned conceptually.

We have had 8K displays for a few years now and I am not seeing any movie/TV studios, or streaming services, planning to offer 8K content. If it is not happening after all of this time, when, if ever, will it? The 8K TV market share hasn't exactly been exciting anyone with its miniscule growth year over year. Without significant 8K content to view anytime soon, do the 8K TV manufacturers really expect increased brightness and 4K upscaling to inspire the consumer to buy into this essentially unsupported display tech with no agreed upon standards and no meaningful supply of 8K content? 8K TVs really seem like the product that nobody has asked for.

That's a hurdle but then again 20 years ago nobody had discs beyond ~500p x 720 but I'd been watching them in 720p x 1280 monitors for a few years by then. Now we have both 2160p and 4320p displays. Media might catch up. What happens when the iPhone 18 or whatever has 12K 2.20 wide chips and 6K video. and everyone has one, etc. And stuff after that.

I've said this story before, about someone vehemently opposed to DVDs cus VHS were good enough. Some people think 65" TVs are too big. Some will not need or want 8K, some will. It goes as any other tech, starts and spurts, and yes fails.

[Deadend45]

Yeah I will pay 30K for zero content to take advantage of and 8k streaming with dvd Mbps is a joke.

[Robert Zohn]

MSRP on the 77" Z3 is $9,999. and the 88" Z3 MSRP is $24,999. Plus we gift our cleints with a 5% store credit, free shipping Nationwide and more savings that I can't publicly discuss.

Most importantly is that for all enthusiasts that have the budget the Z3 is the very best TV available and the 8K resolution has many benefits when watching any content.

Hope you, and all members and visitors get the opportunity to see the Z3 in person!

[cjamescook]

Originally Posted by Robert Zohn

Sorry for my typo ...

Other advantages are for anyone who owns an 8K camera or any Samsung Cell Phone that comes with the built-in Native 8K camera. I filmed our son's weeding that was in the backyard of our home and when I played the native 8K stills and video I felt like I belonged in Hollywood! All of the images were stunning! ...

"Weeding"?

Life imitates art.

[Robert Zohn]

Typo fixed, ^ sorry for not reading it before posting. The d and e letters are next to each other.

[Deciazulado]

https://vastphotos.com/photo/ballsta...roberto-moiola

It has just a 4K preview,
but here's an actual 1:1 pixel size detail of 1/8 the width of what would be the 8K image you'd see full screen on a 8K monitor
(which would be 4X the pixels than the 4K preview, the full image twice as wide twice as tall than it)



From an older previous post, more 8K wide images:

https://i0.wp.com/measuringlight.com...8/dscf0198.jpg

and a download https://www.dpreview.com/reviews/ima...6f40c6f358.jpg


11.4K wide pics:

https://www.dpreview.com/files/p/art...841208418.jpeg

https://www.imaging-resource.com/PRO...S-0053-MOD.JPG

click on " Original: " on these:

https://www.dpreview.com/sample-gall...ery/3369436515

https://www.dpreview.com/sample-gall...ery/5289113267 color

https://www.dpreview.com/sample-gall...ery/2596825071 for b/w

https://www.dpreview.com/sample-gall...-tv/4605174596

You could resize these 11.4Ks to 8K wide or crop them to 4K x 8K