Once A Thief

[Hatman]

For anyone considering buying the German Mediabook: Don't.

It's an SD upscale, albeit likely a pretty good one. I wasn't instantly sure in the beginning but still had my suspicions.

I just sent it back to Amazon to get a refund. Not going to support this.

[russweiss1]

Originally Posted by Hatman

For anyone considering buying the German Mediabook: Don't.

It's an SD upscale, albeit likely a pretty good one. I wasn't instantly sure in the beginning but still had my suspicions.

I just sent it back to Amazon to get a refund. Not going to support this.

Someone on one of the other threads said that all the German mediabooks were upscales and not "legit" releases where HK films were concerned.

[Hatman]

Can't speak to all of them, High Risk (aka Total Risk but from a different German label) and Full Contact (aka Cover Hard) definitely are true HD masters but it might be true about some Golden Princess titles like this one and Peace Hotel (aka Never Die) being upscales. Someone mentioned they might even be bootlegs if I remember correctly but I don't know about that.

I was going to get Peace Hotel but I'm going to skip that now since it's also from TG Vision Gate like Once A Thief and the asking prices are insane.

Looking forward to all the In the Line of Duty releases from Eureka in the UK instead, even though the German Mediabooks are said to have the same 2K Remastered video quality, but I don't feel like taking a chance with them.

While many of them are distributed through Cargo Records, it seems that different labels are behind all these HK releases so it's all a bit murky to make sense of or try to gauge which ones are okay.

[russweiss1]

I saw High Risk in the theater but can't remember much of anything about it.

High Risk Chinese A.jpg

High Risk Chinese B.jpg

[Hatman]

It's a Die Hard rip-off and then some. Here are my thoughts on it from when I viewed it recently: https://letterboxd.com/blade57/film/high-risk-1995/

[Nutcracker]

Peace Hotel is real HD, the same as the HK Blu-ray, but with added artificial grain.

[NeoNical]

Once a Thief has been newly restored in 4K and is being shown at the Hong Kong Film Archive as early as September 10, 2023. There is another screening on November 11th later this year.

[YenChanChow]

Originally Posted by NeoNical

Once a Thief has been newly restored in 4K and is being shown at the Hong Kong Film Archive as early as September 10, 2023. There is another screening on November 11th later this year.

https://www.blu-ray.com/movies/Once-...1987/#Overview

So it seems like they decided to release that restoration on blu ray just a couple months back. Anyone check this out? After all that fuss about a construction company owning the golden princess library and shit in the end Fortune Star/Kam and Ronson still owns the rights to Hong Kong distribution. Now A Better Tomorrow, Hard Boiled, Once a Thief have all been restored in some form or another. Even Bullet in the Head, but for some reason it has not made it to blu ray. Maybe because it was a flop back then so they think there's no money in it?

https://www.filmarchive.gov.hk/en/we...fs-film31.html

That leaves only the Killer, but 35mm theatrical screenings have happened in LA theaters over the years with John Woo present, so even if the original negative has been lost, there are sources and deals Fortune Star could make if they really wanted to. What's the hold up?

[apollo828]

- The new Blu appears to be sourced from the 4K master and looks pretty nice. Still, the disc is the usual K&R junk. BD25, 5.1 remix (no original mono), etc. There's also a trailer and Kent Tsang interview but that's it. The Disk Kino 4K should be much nicer when it comes out, although it'll be significantly more expensive.
- As best I can tell from all the stories floating around, the original Golden Princess owners (I'm not sure if they still own the rights) aren't willing to make any new deals unless everything is licensed for some astronomical fee. Presumably, that wouldn't include the actual costs of restoring these films, but who knows. Either way, just because there are avenues doesn't mean there are options. John Woo said in an interview that he can't get the owners to license his films. If a powerful player in Asian and Hollywood cinema can't shake these films loose, I'm not holding my breath for re-releases anytime soon. (Believe me, the lack of remasters isn't for lack of trying by people who have major connections and money backing them.)
- Why the odd 4K remaster for A Better Tomorrow and Once a Thief? ABT was, as I recall, paid for by a luxury watch company that just wanted to say they supported art. I assume they paid through the nose and got little more out of it than bragging rights. I think OaT had a similar sponsor, although I can't find the info offhand.

[Jigvell]

This video should explain the problems with licensing John Woo films...

The REAL Reason why John Woo's Hard Boiled & The Killer won't ever be released on 4K! - YouTube

[YenChanChow]

Originally Posted by apollo828

- The new Blu appears to be sourced from the 4K master and looks pretty nice. Still, the disc is the usual K&R junk. BD25, 5.1 remix (no original mono), etc. There's also a trailer and Kent Tsang interview but that's it. The Disk Kino 4K should be much nicer when it comes out, although it'll be significantly more expensive.
- As best I can tell from all the stories floating around, the original Golden Princess owners (I'm not sure if they still own the rights) aren't willing to make any new deals unless everything is licensed for some astronomical fee. Presumably, that wouldn't include the actual costs of restoring these films, but who knows. Either way, just because there are avenues doesn't mean there are options. John Woo said in an interview that he can't get the owners to license his films. If a powerful player in Asian and Hollywood cinema can't shake these films loose, I'm not holding my breath for re-releases anytime soon. (Believe me, the lack of remasters isn't for lack of trying by people who have major connections and money backing them.)
- Why the odd 4K remaster for A Better Tomorrow and Once a Thief? ABT was, as I recall, paid for by a luxury watch company that just wanted to say they supported art. I assume they paid through the nose and got little more out of it than bragging rights. I think OaT had a similar sponsor, although I can't find the info offhand.

At this point I'll take the usual K&R junk with shit audio and compression with a nice image over nothing. I'm well aware of the hearsay about the all or nothing deal of the Golden Princess library, but that only applies outside of China/HK. Clearly Fortune Star/K&R still owns all the rights. Why else did we get fairly recent (restored) releases of ABT (2016), Hard Boiled (2019), and now Once A Thief (2024), all which are part of the Golden Princess library?

That's the thing that gets me, if the K&R still owns the rights, then there nothing holding them back from releasing the recent restoration of Bullet in the Head, or some version of The Killer. Shit audio's better than no video!

Interesting tidbit about the luxury watch company. Didn' know that. I did find some possibly related information about 4k restoration of multiple classics at the 2024 Shanghai International film fest, seems like they used AI to do it? It's using some proprietary tech, I gotta wonder what the results look like.

https://x.com/Amarsanaa__/status/1796129361680376305
https://informedainews.com/docs/ai-e...y/3-2024-06-08
https://www.cnbeta.com.tw/articles/movie/1433952.htm

Originally Posted by Jigvell

This video should explain the problems with licensing John Woo films...

The REAL Reason why John Woo's Hard Boiled & The Killer won't ever be released on 4K! - YouTube

This only applies to western releases. Doesn't explain K&R's lack of Bullet in the Head/The Killer.

[NeoNical]

Originally Posted by YenChanChow

https://x.com/Amarsanaa__/status/1796129361680376305
https://informedainews.com/docs/ai-e...y/3-2024-06-08
https://www.cnbeta.com.tw/articles/movie/1433952.htm



This only applies to western releases. Doesn't explain K&R's lack of Bullet in the Head/The Killer.

We're getting a 4K restoration of The Killer according to this new project by the China Film Archive. Given the archive's bad track records with restorations, I think it's safe to say that this film is eternally SCREWED, especially with the recent mentions of AI in their restorations.

[apollo828]

Originally Posted by YenChanChow

That's the thing that gets me, if the K&R still owns the rights, then there nothing holding them back from releasing the recent restoration of Bullet in the Head, or some version of The Killer. Shit audio's better than no video!

You're assuming K&R cares about these films enough to ensure that they're restored. Frankly, I was kinda shocked when I saw that they put out a OaT Blu. I assumed K&R had folded or otherwise moved on from physical media! Maybe I'm wrong but I'm pretty sure their entire backcatalog of Blus is OOP.

Anyway, the point is that these restorations don't just come out of thin air. Whoever puts these discs out either has to pay for the restorations or settle for whatever materials they're given by the rights holders. K&R has a long track record of using whatever's given to them. They're not like 88, Eureka, VinSyn, or even Spectrum, driving the restorations of films and also pushing for the original audio. If K&R isn't putting something out, they don't have the rights, or they don't think it's worth their while, or both.

Originally Posted by NeoNical

We're getting a 4K restoration of The Killer according to this new project by the China Film Archive.

[YenChanChow]

Originally Posted by NeoNical

We're getting a 4K restoration of The Killer according to this new project by the China Film Archive. Given the archive's bad track records with restorations, I think it's safe to say that this film is eternally SCREWED, especially with the recent mentions of AI in their restorations.

What are the other restorations that China Film Archive has done? What are some that made it to blu ray? What were their problems?

[apollo828]

Originally Posted by YenChanChow

What are the other restorations that China Film Archive has done? What are some that made it to blu ray? What were their problems?

I don't think any are on Blu-ray but, as I understand things, they add loads of gimmicks to their restorations. The Horse Thief is a great example. There were actually two restorations, one in 2K by Xi'an Film Studio and one in 4K by China Film Archive. The Xi'an restoration was released on Blu-ray in China. It looks and sounds really good.

Meanwhile, the CFA restoration interpolated extra frames so that the film runs at 48 fps (i.e., they made it look more soap opera-esque), used what I'm told was a really bad surround sound remix, and messed with the color timing. I don't think it has ever been released for home video or streaming, and that's okay with me. This gimmicky garbage was made around 2017-2018, years before "AI" was plastered over everything by idiot marketing men and middle managers who assume it'll do all the work for a fraction of the cost. If CFA really is restoring The Killer, I fully expect the restoration to be bad enough to make fans want to cry.

[NeoNical]

I'm quite certain that this new restoration of The Killer will be bad since one of the companies involved in the restoration, ByteDance and their Volcano Engine software (Used in TikTok and Douyin), has a strong connection with AI usage.

[apollo828]

Yeah, I saw that the restoration was premiered a few weeks ago at the Shanghai Int'l Film Fest. (I believe four restorations were premiered. I can't remember the others offhand but I'm sure the names are out there.) I'd be very curious to know if there are any reviews out. The idea of slapping a TikTok filter on that film makes me wish that Chow Yun-Fat could come out of the screen, guns blazing at everybody involved in that atrocity.

[Richardrli]

Originally Posted by apollo828

I don't think any are on Blu-ray but, as I understand things, they add loads of gimmicks to their restorations. The Horse Thief is a great example. There were actually two restorations, one in 2K by Xi'an Film Studio and one in 4K by China Film Archive. The Xi'an restoration was released on Blu-ray in China. It looks and sounds really good.

Meanwhile, the CFA restoration interpolated extra frames so that the film runs at 48 fps (i.e., they made it look more soap opera-esque), used what I'm told was a really bad surround sound remix, and messed with the color timing. I don't think it has ever been released for home video or streaming, and that's okay with me. This gimmicky garbage was made around 2017-2018, years before "AI" was plastered over everything by idiot marketing men and middle managers who assume it'll do all the work for a fraction of the cost. If CFA really is restoring The Killer, I fully expect the restoration to be bad enough to make fans want to cry.

Just confirming, the World Cinema Library release of The Horse Thief uses the crappy CFA restoration right?

[apollo828]

Originally Posted by Richardrli

Just confirming, the World Cinema Library release of The Horse Thief uses the crappy CFA restoration right?

No.

Originally Posted by apollo828

There were actually two restorations, one in 2K by Xi'an Film Studio and one in 4K by China Film Archive. The Xi'an restoration was released on Blu-ray in China. It looks and sounds really good.