Horizon: An American Saga - Chapter Two

[Cremildo]

Kevin Costner’s “Horizon: An American Saga — Chapter Two” is set to world premiere at the Venice Film Festival in September after its U.S. release was pulled.

“Chapter Two” — which Costner again directs and stars in alongside Sienna Miller, Sam Worthington, Jena Malone and Danny Huston — will bow on the Lido out-of-competition on Sept. 7. +

[Cremildo]

Metacritic

[captveg]

The Variety review is hilarious to me, complaining about how hard it'll be for people to follow the storylines, like Chapter 1. Gee, thanks for your concern for my stupidity, but I know how to pay attention to a movie and recollect things. I had no issue following anything in Chapter 1, so I doubt Chapter 2 will be any more challenging in that regard, but your condescension is noted.

[BluBonnet]

"Stupidity" has nothing to do with it. The storyline here is a chore because the characters aren't particularly interesting or appealing.

[captveg]

Originally Posted by BluBonnet

"Stupidity" has nothing to do with it. The storyline here is a chore because the characters aren't particularly interesting or appealing.

In regards to Chapter 1 I disagree with that completely.

But no, they write like they think viewers are not smart enough to be able to contextualize the storylines due to the cross cutting between them, as though no one has ever been tasked with inferring what occurred during offscreen moments before. And they suggest one needs a brilliant mind to recall the events of the previous film. "Costner [is] confoundingly presumptuous about our level of detailed recall of the previous film. Even the most assiduous viewer, who has perhaps watched the first film only recently, will still struggle on occasion to identify which particular massacre is being glancingly referred to, or why characters whom we vaguely remember being closely bonded are now on the outs, or vice versa."

If it was just about the characters, why suggest that a recap of Chapter 1 or a TV version "reedited for clarity" would help in understanding the storylines?

A filmmaker that expects me to pay attention is not a negative in my book, as a film that doesn't hand hold is seemingly rare these days. I'm also tired of "member berries" and nostaligia recall cinema, so Chapter 1 was a nice contrast in that regard.

Obviously since I liked the first film and you didn't our biases will color our reading of such reviews, so I don't expect you to agree with me. I'm just tired of film criticism that expects the lowest amount of thought or consideration from the film viewing audience.

[BluBonnet]

I don't believe that's an accurate summation of what Variety said....

[captveg]

Like I said, you and I will never agree on this.

I feel talked down to in that review. It implies I can't figure the film out because I don't have a recap and it edits between stories too much, or because - gasp! - I have to make some inferences of some offscreen events when storylines get picked up again. It's insulting.

Also, based on the Hollywood Reporter review, these people still don't understand that New Line/Warner didn't finance these films whatsoever. No, they won't be investing in the production of Chapters 3 & 4 - they didn't invest in the production of Chapters 1 & 2, either! Be a professional and actually know what you're talking about, please, paid writers.

[Creed]

Originally Posted by captveg

Like I said, you and I will never agree on this.

I feel talked down to in that review. It implies I can't figure the film out because I don't have a recap and it edits between stories too much, or because - gasp! - I have to make some inferences of some offscreen events when storylines get picked up again. It's insulting.

Also, based on the Hollywood Reporter review, these people still don't understand that New Line/Warner didn't finance these films whatsoever. No, they won't be investing in the production of Chapters 3 & 4 - they didn't invest in the production of Chapters 1 & 2, either! Be a professional and actually know what you're talking about, please, paid writers.

Yep, they're just distributing. Similar to Lionsgate only distributing Megalopolis, since no studio would've bothered financing either project.

[Member-682067]

Originally Posted by BluBonnet

"Stupidity" has nothing to do with it. The storyline here is a chore because the characters aren't particularly interesting or appealing.

Agreed, not surprisingly the character Costner played and his story was the only one that had some juice for me. His star power and talent made it come alive.

[Member-682067]

Originally Posted by captveg

Like I said, you and I will never agree on this.

I feel talked down to in that review. It implies I can't figure the film out because I don't have a recap and it edits between stories too much, or because - gasp! - I have to make some inferences of some offscreen events when storylines get picked up again. It's insulting.

Also, based on the Hollywood Reporter review, these people still don't understand that New Line/Warner didn't finance these films whatsoever. No, they won't be investing in the production of Chapters 3 & 4 - they didn't invest in the production of Chapters 1 & 2, either! Be a professional and actually know what you're talking about, please, paid writers.

I saw the movie not even a week ago and except for the Costner character and story, I can't remember anything else about it.

[BluBonnet]

Originally Posted by TV2693

I saw the movie not even a week ago and except for the Costner character and story, I can't remember anything else about it.

Watched it in the theater, all I remember is there was a gunfight and Sienna plays that age-old Hollywood cliché, the prostitute with the heart of gold.

[Member-682067]

Originally Posted by BluBonnet

Watched it in the theater, all I remember is there was a gunfight and Sienna plays that age-old Hollywood cliché, the prostitute with the heart of gold.

Idk if I would have forgiven myself for paying to see it at a theater and making myself sit through it all the way through.

I had to watch it in 45 min spurts on HBO MAX and that was hard.

[BluBonnet]

Originally Posted by TV2693

Idk if I would have forgiven myself for paying to see it at a theater

I used Regal unlimited, so it's not like I actually paid good money to watch it.

But it is a really terrible bargain for people who did buy a ticket, all they got to see was just the introduction of the main characters. Nothing more.

[captveg]

Originally Posted by TV2693

I saw the movie not even a week ago and except for the Costner character and story, I can't remember anything else about it.

I saw it in theaters in June, and it's been on my mind ever since.

How can the same movie have such different impacts?

That's art, baby.

[earthwormjim]

Originally Posted by BluBonnet

Watched it in the theater, all I remember is there was a gunfight and Sienna plays that age-old Hollywood cliché, the prostitute with the heart of gold.

It wasn't Sienna, it was Abbey Lee.

[russweiss1]

I saw this in the theater and enjoyed it. My main disappointment was when I found out that Chapter 2 was not going to get theatrical play. This was better than The Dead Don't Hurt and The Thicket which are 2 other westerns that I saw this year.

[HomerThompson]

Chapter 2 still might get a theatrical play. Though with these tepid reviews coming in, who knows if it just might be a limited thing this time around.

[Modren]

Originally Posted by HomerThompson

Chapter 2 still might get a theatrical play. Though with these tepid reviews coming in, who knows if it just might be a limited thing this time around.

I'm sure WB will put it out in theaters, I assume it's required in whatever contract Costner signed for distribution. The bigger question is what happens with parts 3&4. Supposedly Costner expects to finish production on 3 next year and go straight into 4, but I think it'd be smarter on his part to scale back and combine them into one movie.

[Member-682067]

Originally Posted by captveg

I saw it in theaters in June, and it's been on my mind ever since.

How can the same movie have such different impacts?

That's art, baby.

Strangely enough, I still want to see part 2 even though I didn't care for part 1. The cinematography and set designs kept part 1 somewhat interesting.

[BluBonnet]

Originally Posted by TV2693

The cinematography and set designs kept part 1 somewhat interesting.

For me one of the most disappointing things about this is that Costner chose to shoot flat, and not take advantage of a an anamorphic format to really show off those locations they way the deserve.... After having done such a good job of it with Dances with Wolves, it really is a major letdown.