120hz vs. 60hz

[j_rocca42]

I was a bestbuy today adimiring the new sony xbrs and i saw that they were 120hz instead of 60. They had a 60hz sony right next to the xbr. the difference in picture between the two was unbelievable! my question is, if i get the xbr, which i so badly want, does my ps3 or any current stand alones, support that? or does it only have to do with the tv itself...

[Slapper]

Originally Posted by j_rocca42

I was a bestbuy today adimiring the new sony xbrs and i saw that they were 120hz instead of 60. They had a 60hz sony right next to the xbr. the difference in picture between the two was unbelievable! my question is, if i get the xbr, which i so badly want, does my ps3 or any current stand alones, support that? or does it only have to do with the tv itself...

TV itself. PS3 and standalones will work fine.

Edit: I'm saving my pennies for this TV myself.

[Whytewash]

I noticed the 120 hz TVs about 3 months ago. I think that they are so much better! The picture quality is phenominal! Its like I am right there watching all the action first hand! That will be my next TV purchase... Although it will be Samsung with the same capabilities!

[quetzalcoatl]

The XBR's are the second best sets on the market right now to me. First would be the Pioneer plamas but they are also quite abit more.

[doctorD]

Originally Posted by Whytewash

I noticed the 120 hz TVs about 3 months ago. I think that they are so much better! The picture quality is phenominal! Its like I am right there watching all the action first hand! That will be my next TV purchase... Although it will be Samsung with the same capabilities!

Which Samsung series are you looking to get? I just picked up the 5271 yesterday, but haven't broken open the box yet. My wife wants to have a new entertainment cabinet first...so hopefully this coming weekend!

[ay221]

120hz is used to avoid judder and the use of 4:3 pulldowns. both 30 hz of normal tv, and 24 hz of movies both fit perfectly into 120hz.

[Mr3dfx]

So am I the only one who thinks the image looks like it's in fast forward and it drives me nuts!

[j_rocca42]

Originally Posted by quetzalcoatl

The XBR's are the second best sets on the market right now to me. First would be the Pioneer plamas but they are also quite abit more.

That's true, but the pioneer is way out of my range!!!

Originally Posted by ay221

120hz is used to avoid judder and the use of 4:3 pulldowns. both 30 hz of normal tv, and 24 hz of movies both fit perfectly into 120hz.

What is judder?

Originally Posted by Mr3dfx

So am I the only one who thinks the image looks like it's in fast forward and it drives me nuts!

Not sure what you mean... The picture looks almost life like. didn't notice any fastforwarding...

[mmbielscy]

I had a olevia 37 htvs TV and I was very satisfy with the picture quality until I saw a 40" bravia XBR4 at best buy. That LCD in my opinion is the best thing you can currently buy for the price. I was trying to purchase one of those in Chicago but the price was out of my rich until I got great deal at FRYS.com.
Our store had the tv on back order so I took the trip to Indianapolis .
Best purchase I ever made. The PS3 games and Blue Ray movies looks stunning it's entire new experience. If you don't like the "fast forward" feel of the movie you can lower the motion processor to the lower setting and still enjoy "3D like" movies.
I can highly recommend XBR4 120 HZ

[hienesey]

Originally Posted by j_rocca42

I was a bestbuy today adimiring the new sony xbrs and i saw that they were 120hz instead of 60. They had a 60hz sony right next to the xbr. the difference in picture between the two was unbelievable! my question is, if i get the xbr, which i so badly want, does my ps3 or any current stand alones, support that? or does it only have to do with the tv itself...

I have my ps3 hooked up to the xbr4, and it works great. Bestbuy sells them for a lot, though. I would try Fry's or someplace online.

[Blu Devil 69]

Better refresh rates = smoother picture

[turboLAZER]

Originally Posted by Mr3dfx

So am I the only one who thinks the image looks like it's in fast forward and it drives me nuts!

i agree, looks like everything was filmed on digital handycam, doesn't look natural at all

[slee915]

Perhaps I need to have my eyes checked, but I tried to turn on & off 120Hz on the XBR4 and I can't see much difference in PQ. Hillary & Obama still looks like $hit in 120Hz.

So I ended up buying a Sharp w/o 120Hz (though it has 4ms response time) because of its superior black level vs. Sony.

I'm more interested in the LED backlighting.

[slee915]

Originally Posted by j_rocca42

I was a bestbuy today adimiring the new sony xbrs and i saw that they were 120hz instead of 60. They had a 60hz sony right next to the xbr. the difference in picture between the two was unbelievable!

I'm wondering if the difference between the xbr4 & the older xbr is due to 120Hz or other factors like the newer xbr uses a better panel, has better contrast, uses a more advanced DSP chip, etc. Some stores may even set the older tv to a poorer picture setting to lure buyer to the newer expensive sets.

Did you try turning on and off the XBR4 120Hz setting just to see how much difference in PQ that changes ?

[j_rocca42]

Originally Posted by slee915

I'm wondering if the difference between the xbr4 & the older xbr is due to 120Hz or other factors like the newer xbr uses a better panel, has better contrast, uses a more advanced DSP chip, etc. Some stores may even set the older tv to a poorer picture setting to lure buyer to the newer expensive sets.

Did you try turning on and off the XBR4 120Hz setting just to see how much difference in PQ that changes ?

no I didn't try that. i was just looking at the display and wasn't about to start fiddling around with it

[Smc77]

Originally Posted by slee915

I'm wondering if the difference between the xbr4 & the older xbr is due to 120Hz or other factors like the newer xbr uses a better panel, has better contrast, uses a more advanced DSP chip, etc. Some stores may even set the older tv to a poorer picture setting to lure buyer to the newer expensive sets.

Did you try turning on and off the XBR4 120Hz setting just to see how much difference in PQ that changes ?

The new XBR Bravia's (XBR4 and 5) use a 10 bit LCD panel, as opposed to the 8 bit panels on the older models. The 10 bit panels allow millions more colours, for a much smoother gradation on the screen.

[unreal1080p]

In order to enjoy watching movies in their native 1080P24 format, you need a player capable of outputting 1080P24 and an HDTV capable of accepting the 1080P24 feed and then display it at a multiple of 24 refresh rate like below:

24 X 3 = 72hz or 3:3
24 X 4 = 96hz or 4:4
24 X 5 = 120hz or 5:5

You must be very careful when choosing a 120hz HDTV.
There are 120hz HDTV's that will accept 1080P24 feeds and then do a proper 5:5 conversion to 120hz. However, there are other 120hz HDTV's that do no accept 1080P24 and perform 3:2 pulldown on the feed to bring it to 1080P60 (60hz) and then they double up the refresh to 120hz resulting in an image that is still plagued with judder. If you have 720P60 or 1080i60 HDTV feeds, then doubling up the refresh from 60hz to 120hz is the correct thing to do and will give you a better picture... however, the correct thing to do with 1080P24 feeds is to do a TRUE 5:5 pulldown (24 x 5 = 120).

Most here, I assume, would like to use the 120hz capabilities to enjoy 1080P24 from their Blu-Ray players so this will be a VERY important point to research on the individual HDTV's you are interested in. That's one thing the AVSforum is still very usefull for (the HDTV display forums) and not boggled down by fanboyism or biasmodism.

One example of this deficiency comes from our "favorite" manufacturer : Toshiba. Their LX177 series do NOT du 5:5 pull down as the engine is running at 60Hz and does a 3:2 pulldown with 24 fps input and then the resulting frames go through ClearFrame interpolation to 120Hz. The resulting images are not completely judder-free, but rather judder-smoothed...

[ShawnE94SL]

I went to tweeter looking at the 52XBR and walked out with the 52W3000 because I didn't like the way the 120hz looked. They had Spiderman 3 on all of the TV's and I thought the W3000 looked more natural in the fast moving scenes. Not to mention I saved over $1200 too

[cleric]

Originally Posted by unreal1080p

One example of this deficiency comes from our "favorite" manufacturer : Toshiba. Their LX177 series do NOT du 5:5 pull down as the engine is running at 60Hz and does a 3:2 pulldown with 24 fps input and then the resulting frames go through ClearFrame interpolation to 120Hz. The resulting images are not completely judder-free, but rather judder-smoothed...

Yea except that Sony, Panasonic(only lcd), Samsung(only lcd?), and Sharp all do it too. The only people that make a 24p TV worth a hoot is Pioneer (I know shocking right?) and their tvs are 72hz "3:3 pulldown". All the 120hz lcds out there are unwatchable its like watching the bbc.

[HDJK]

Originally Posted by cleric

Yea except that Sony, Samsung, and Sharp all do it too. The only people that make a 24p TV worth a whoot is Pioneer (I know shocking right?) and their tvs are 72hz "3:3 pulldown". All the 120hz lcds out there are unwatchable its like watching the bbc.

At least for Europe this isn't true. I have a confirmation from a Sharp rep that their X20E and XL2 series display 24P native with a 48Hz refresh.