Why is 720p still around?

[nec1912]

Why do they still sale 720P TV's when all blu ray movies are in 1080P and the standard definition is 1080P now?

I thought they would be phasing out the stock of 720P TV's by now?

Or is 720P TV's only for small TV's has small TV's cannot show 1080P do to the small size.

I thought they would be phasing out the stock of 720P TV's .

[NJ_RAMS_FAN]

Originally Posted by nec1912

Why do they still sale 720P TV's when all blu ray movies are in 1080P and the standard definition is 1080P now?

I thought they would be phasing out the stock of 720P TV's by now?

Or is 720P TV's only for small TV's has small TV's cannot show 1080P do to the small size.

I thought they would be phasing out the stock of 720P TV's .

i guess to give consumers an option to buy tvs. For example, I wouldn't buy a 32" inch or below 1080p. Also, not all broadcast is 1080p yet.

[4K2K]

Originally Posted by NJ_RAMS_FAN

i guess to give consumers an option to buy tvs. For example, I wouldn't buy a 32" inch or below 1080p. Also, not all broadcast is 1080p yet.

Is any?

[danman227460]

Because video games and a lot of HD TV content is still being produced in 720P. Only a handful of games and TV shows are actually broadcast in 1080P. Really, 1080P is only the standard for HD movies, anything else HD is still using 720P.

[Grif32]

Originally Posted by danman227460

Because video games and a lot of HD TV content is still being produced in 720P. Only a handful of games and TV shows are actually broadcast in 1080P. Really, 1080P is only the standard for HD movies, anything else HD is still using 720P.

When did they start broadcasting shows in 1080P? I didn't think anything was and probably wouldn't for a long time. Interesting didn't know that.

[dobyblue]

CBS and NBC broadcast in 1080i.
1080i is the same resolution as 1080p if your TV performs deinterlacing properly and handles 2:3 and 2:2 cadences.

So with a 1080p set it is possible to watch a lot of 1080p content.

ABC and FOX broadcast at 720p. The only way to see their programs in higher resolutions is to buy them on Blu-ray.

In addition the only way to make sure you're watching these programs in their native resolution is to get them for free OTA with an antenna. Otherwise your cable/satellite provider may be changing the resolution to fit in their bandwidth/system more easily. Some people think when they change the resolution on their cable/satellite box they are changing the resolution of the program, but you're only changing the output resolution of the box.

For example, in Canada Bell takes all signals and converts them to 720p. Hockey Night in Canada on CBC is broadcast at 1080i. If you set the box to 1080i you're taking a 1080i signal that's already been converted to 720p and changing it back to 1080i again, you've lost half the resolution, you should just leave it at 720p and skip an additional conversion step.

You would be amazed how much clearer and cleaner an OTA antenna signal looks than most of the HD channels I've seen from Canadian and US cable/satellite providers.

[Jeff Kleist]

Especially a 720p broadcast signal. 19.2 isn't really the best for 1080i, especially when there are sub-channels (which there often are). My Fox station broadcasts full bitrate 720p, and they kick the butt of all the other channels in terms of consistency and quality.

720p also lets them offer cheaper TVs. Most people don't care if it's 720 or 1080 in the bedroom for example.

[Beta Man]

My living room T.V. is used for DVD/T.V. (standard Def. TV at that) about 95% of the time..... I can fit a 50" MAX, in my stand/unit and I'm keeping my eye out for a 45-50" plasma at 720p on the cheap..... and although 1080p has come down in price a lot at that size, I don't care if it's only $100 or $200 more, I'm not going to need it to be 1080p for the rare occasions where I watch a Blu-ray in my living room.

[bboisvert]

Originally Posted by Jeff Kleist

720p also lets them offer cheaper TVs. Most people don't care if it's 720 or 1080 in the bedroom for example.

Exactly. I just bought a 19" LED for the kitchen. I was happy to save some $$$ and go with 720p. 1080 would be a waste of money in that situation.

[OrlandoEastwood]

Settings wise, DVD upscalling is best at 720, but that's just me. Blu-rays, 1080 all the way.

[nec1912]

Originally Posted by Jeff Kleist

Especially a 720p broadcast signal. 19.2 isn't really the best for 1080i, especially when there are sub-channels (which there often are). My Fox station broadcasts full bitrate 720p, and they kick the butt of all the other channels in terms of consistency and quality.

720p also lets them offer cheaper TVs. Most people don't care if it's 720 or 1080 in the bedroom for example.

What is the aspect ratio of say 720p and 1080p And what is better 1080i or 1080P ?

Also is the picture quality that much better that say 1080p over 720p ?

And most 90% stuff on TV is not in HD has only some channels are HD.And not all HD channels have HD programs.The news channels ,sports channels and movie channels seem to be more into HD but TV shows channels and reality TV channels are not.

[BIslander]

Originally Posted by nec1912

What is the aspect ratio of say 720p and 1080p And what is better 1080i or 1080P ?

They're all 16:9. 1080i often ends up the same as 1080p, depending on how the source material is recorded and the processing along the way.

Also is the picture quality that much better that say 1080p over 720p ?

The size of your screen and your viewing distance play big roles there.

And most 90% stuff on TV is not in HD has only some channels are HD.And not all HD channels have HD programs.The news channels ,sports channels and movie channels seem to be more into HD but TV shows channels and reality TV channels are not.

The amount of HD material is growing daily. The vast majority of primetime shows and sports events are now in HD. News is a mixed bag - most stations/networks have HD studio cameras and graphics, but the field material is still predominantly SD, although a lot of it is now shot in 16:9. It is true that more than a few HD cable channels show mostly SD content. I simply avoid those channels.

[4K2K]

Originally Posted by nec1912

And what is better 1080i or 1080P ?

Also is the picture quality that much better that say 1080p over 720p ?

The difference is, in current broadcasting, 720p allows 60 fps (50 in Europe), "1080p" in current broadcasting - ie. a 24p or 30p (or 25p in Europe) signal stored in 1080i (ie. progressive segmented frames) doesn't.

So 1080i (interlaced material) and 720p broadcasting both allow better temporal res than current "1080p" (stored in 1080i) type broadcasting (which isn't the 1080p50/60 type yet).

So it depends on more than just "1080i", "1080p", or "720p", but which type you are comparing.

If you want to broadcast 1080p24 material, 1080p24 would in theory be best (though it won't be preferred by the broadcaster as they will want to switch between/overlay different types of content).

1080p60/50 is better than 720p50, 720p60, 1080p24 and 1080/50i and 1080/60i, but nobody broadcasts with it yet, and it would need more bandwidth than 720p50/60.

Also is the picture quality that much better that say 1080p over 720p

It depends on the content (and what type of 1080p/720p you're talking about), and screen size, viewing distance, bitrate etc.
eg. sports would look better at 720p60 than at 1080p24. A high detailed 1080p24 Blu-ray would look better and more detailed on the right 1080p TV at the right viewing distance, than on a 720p TV at the same viewing distance.

[nec1912]

It depends on the content (and what type of 1080p/720p you're talking about), and screen size, viewing distance, bitrate etc.
eg. sports would look better at 720p60 than at 1080p24. A high detailed 1080p24 Blu-ray would look better and more detailed on the right 1080p TV at the right viewing distance, than on a 720p TV at the same viewing distance.

So 1080p really is no good for TV smaller than 37'' ?

[Azyiu]

Originally Posted by nec1912

So 1080p really is no good for TV smaller than 37'' ?

I wouldn't say "no good", rather you wouldn't see as much a different if you are viewing the same 1080p material over a smaller screen.

[4K2K]

Originally Posted by nec1912

So 1080p really is no good for TV smaller than 37'' ?

It depends on viewing distance. eg. you could have a 21.5" 1080p monitor and still make out all pixels - since you'd use it closer than a normal TV.

If you watched a 36" HDTV from 4.7 feet you'd be able to resolve all 1080p pixels (according to the viewing distance calculator http://myhometheater.homestead.com/v...alculator.html)

The further away from the 36" HDTV you go the less you'd notice any difference in spatial resolution between a 1080p HDTV and a 720p one.


This site:
http://carltonbale.com/1080p-does-matter

says that for a 50" HDTV, "the benefits of 1080p vs. 720p start to become apparent when closer than 9.8 feet".

So I'd think for a 36" (diagonal) HDTV, the benefits of 1080p vs 720p would start to become apparent when closer than around 7.06 feet.

(I get the 7.06 feet answer by using the calculation from another site too):
ie. 2.7x the screen width for a 720p 16:9 TV
http://www.practical-home-theater-gu...-distance.html

PS: Another thing to note is that some "720p" TVs are actually 1366x768 not 720p.

[nec1912]

Originally Posted by Azyiu

I wouldn't say "no good", rather you wouldn't see as much a different if you are viewing the same 1080p material over a smaller screen.

So biggger TV is more ideal if one is watching far away has closer you are to TV the more pixels you make out?

If one is 4 feet away from TV the ideal TV is 21 '' or smaller ? And 50'' TV the ideal is for 10 feet away or more or you will make out the pixels ?

I was also reading that smaller TV's cannot show all the resolution.

[dobyblue]

As long as they have the pixels, they can show the resolution.

"And 50'' TV the ideal is for 10 feet away or more or you will make out the pixels?"

No, within 10ft you will start to benefit from 1080p resolution. At 10ft you will not notice much of a benefit between 720p and 1080p.

Full 1080p resolution on a 50" TV requires you to be around 6ft away.

[U4K61]

Originally Posted by nec1912

So 1080p really is no good for TV smaller than 37'' ?

Just depends on how close you are sitting. I'm 2-3 feet from my 32" set typing away. Would see the improvement of 4k over 1080/720p if was available. Have an old post on Vewing Distance. Has lots of charts that illustrate concept.

[BarkingGhost]

First, the ATSC specification included a variety of pixel resolution and aspect ratios from 480P 4:3 to 1080i 16:9. The national broadcasting chose two formats that filled the bill for the ability of broadcast electronics to handle a specific amount of bandwidth. If you compare the amount of bandwidth needed for 720P you will see that is is about the same as 1080i.

Why one broadcast network chose one format over the other had more to do with motion artifact that commonly arise in interlaced formats. Hence, it was no surprise that those sports-inclined broadcast networks ABC and Fox chose 720P, and while those not inclined chose 1080i which is what CBS and NBC did.

At this point the consumer electronics association chose to make products for their HDTV standards that fit these two bills, and is why a lot of analog sets were capable of 720P and or 1080i. It wasn't until well after the ATSC standard was adopted in 1995-96, and after the CEA began making serious displays that electronics evolution and a new transport medium started offering content on 1080P.

This new transport form was in the optical media industry and consumerized in the forms of HD DVD and Blu-ray media. Once consumer broadband started picking up in available bandwidth along with much more efficient compression codecs that streaming of 1080P content began to become realized.

But keep in mind that national broadcasters have spent a pretty penny in near term legacy equipment for the ability to broadcast in 720P/1080i and asking them and all of their affiliates to change out again in such a near term of unacceptable, and probably unaffordable by the the bulk of the affiliates.

So, while we can all drool over 1080P asking networks to change out expensive infrastructure to please folks for commercial television isn't probably going to happen for a long time. It will probably be another decade or more before OTA changes are made in the commercial world (which is different from FCC adoptions) and will probably be for higher resolution and skipping 1080P altogether.