They're turning on the Emperor... Civil War has begun!

[shamus]

You are saying that everybody is aware of the fact that MS IS PAYING AMIR "to be here", that he is spending hours and hours posting here not just because he such a nice guy but because this is part of HD-DVDs marketing and promotion strategy? That everybody is aware of the term VIRAL MARKETING? That brainwashing from the first "Boy, are we in for a treat..." thread to the latest "comments" regarding motivations why studios choose AVC or even MPEG2 over VC-1 for some releases (summary: to cut costs, because they don't know better, because they don't care about PQ, my favorite:" because they don't know how to contact us/me",... Going as far as brainwashing people into believing AVC is used for "noisy content" because it filters the grain unlike VC-1 which preserves it extremely well... Let me tell you - I have worked as a projectionist for many years - to claim the "smooth" looking VC-1 preserves film grain and the film look in a more natural way than AVC/MPEG2 encodings is used-car-dealer-talk) is all over the place (and suceeding). Most of the so-called VC-1 fanboys have never even seen a proper high-bitrate MPEG2 and/or AVC encoding - yet they are firm in their believe that VC-1 is the second coming... This is the very definition of being mind f....d (excuse my inmature french, I'm just trying to make a VERY strong point here). THIS forum is intended for enthusiasts to share their experiences and NOT for companies paying staff to come over here to manipulate the opinion of this (obviously) VERY IMPORTANT crowd (-> early adopters and enthusiasts are opinion leaders).

-post #72
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...0&page=1&pp=30

[degas]

Wow, amazing post!

[dialog_gvf]

What an amazing thread. Time was, only maybe a month ago, when everyone would have flamed the OP, instead of joining in.

And every new PS/3 convert compares the experience and frequently comments on the "lies" they have been told about the PS/3 and BD movie quality.

Right there is the sign of a format deathwatch. HD DVD had a bunch of early adopters. It has lost many them now and is losing more everyday. And it will be next to impossible to get them back if BD continues to perform nominally.

Some quotes from those who are now getting it:

" I DO believe BD has caught HD DVD in PQ and, overall, surpassed HD DVD in AQ." - ricwhite

"In my opinion HDDVD blew it but I don't know why or what happened." - Art Sonneborn

And some from those the usual suspect that choose to (or are paid to) remain clueless:

"Most of you guys seem to forget that the average non gamer is not going to buy a game console to watch their films." - trgraphics

"In reality HD DVD IS SUPERIOR TO BR in price, quality, software support, PQ, manufacturing overhead, ease of use, and the studio support is a non-issue. But does it seem that way to most? NO!" - LAGOSIAN

"Troll Troll Troll Troll Troll Troll Troll ... (100+ times)" - hmurchison (now removed)

[shamus]

Originally Posted by dialog_gvf

What an amazing thread. Time was, only maybe a month ago, when everyone would have flamed the OP, instead of joining in.

And every new PS/3 convert compares the experience and frequently comments on the "lies" they have been told about the PS/3 and BD movie quality.

Right there is the sign of a format deathwatch. HD DVD had a bunch of early adopters. It has lost many them now and is losing more everyday. And it will be next to impossible to get them back if BD continues to perform nominally.

Some quotes from those who are now getting it:

" I DO believe BD has caught HD DVD in PQ and, overall, surpassed HD DVD in AQ." - ricwhite

"In my opinion HDDVD blew it but I don't know why or what happened." - Art Sonneborn

And some from those the usual suspect that choose to (or are paid to) remain clueless:

"Most of you guys seem to forget that the average non gamer is not going to buy a game console to watch their films." - trgraphics

"In reality HD DVD IS SUPERIOR TO BR in price, quality, software support, PQ, manufacturing overhead, ease of use, and the studio support is a non-issue. But does it seem that way to most? NO!" - LAGOSIAN

"Troll Troll Troll Troll Troll Troll Troll ... (100+ times)" - hmurchison (now removed)

I was shocked to see Art buy a BD player.

[shamus]

This is the original post... in case thread gets deleted.

Boycotting HD DVD

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Call me troll or whatever names you want to call me. run around in circles like scared fanboys. delete this post if you want. i give up.

i originally went with HD DVD because of MOVIES! hd dvd simply had more of the movies i wanted. what happened? hd dvd seems to have little interest in pushing their product. they have more old movies than current movies. their upcoming releases are practically non-existant. they don't appear motivated and i've lost almost all confidence in it, thanks to them.

why should i keep supporting a system that gives the impression of it being on it's deathbed?

instead of spending money on any more hd dvds, i'm putting it towards a BD player! i figure 2 things could happen if more people do this:

1. HD DVD gets off it's ass and kicks it into high gear and earns my support again.

2. HD DVD dies off quicker and BD gets Universal movies, which will be great for everyone!

how you would see me as a troll rather than a really pissed off HD DVD supporter is beyond me. fanboys don't know what else to do but cry troll. maybe if you actually CARED about better home entertainment rather than being a fanboy for one system or another, you'd actually see my point. and i don't think a troll would own the Toshiba HD-A1 along with the movies:
Aeon Flux
Unforgiven
The Thing
The Hulk
Christmas Story
Slither
Constantine
Van Helsing(you HAD to be an HD DVD supporter to buy THAT movie!)
King Kong
Blazing Saddles
Batman
Superman Returns
Doom
Pitch Black
Chronicles of Riddick
Army of Darkness
Sleepy Hollow
Lady in the Water
V for Vendetta
The Grinch
Wolf Creek
Corpse Bride
Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas

Current BD Player: None.
Current BDs: None.

that's my story and i'm sticking with it.

[iceman]

Good post, should have posted it 2 years ago though to limit the damage :/

[dialog_gvf]

Everything is unfolding as MANY people said would happen: The PS/3 would arrive and dominate the equation.

No amount of anti-Sony venom will alter the fact that the predictions have and are coming true. Perhaps even to a far more degree than predicted (50+% usage versus 20%).

If you ignore the usual suspects, AVSF is actually become a more logical place every day.

Gary

[phloyd]

Originally Posted by dialog_gvf

Everything is unfolding as MANY people said would happen: The PS/3 would arrive and dominate the equation.

Oh yeah, of course. Many of us had laid this out, even stating that Jan 2007 would be the time of reckoning and that content will win out regardless.

Of course we didn't count on HD reducing output as much as they have - that is just a bonus - but to any rational person, the writing was on the wall months ago - only it was a future thing so we got laughed out of town...

But this is what we see... Soon we will not need to bother defending anything... the answer will always be "even if that is true, the numbers indicate that nobody really cares"

[Petra]

They're turning on the Emperor... Civil War has begun!

LOLOLOL

OH NOES!! We've got a mutiny, a rebellion, a revolution....this is fun

[Deciazulado]

Originally Posted by TheLion

Let me tell you - I have worked as a projectionist for many years - to claim the "smooth" looking VC-1 preserves film grain and the film look in a more natural way than AVC/MPEG2 encodings is used-car-dealer-talk) is all over the place (and suceeding). Most of the so-called VC-1 fanboys have never even seen a proper high-bitrate MPEG2 and/or AVC encoding - yet they are firm in their believe that VC-1 is the second coming..

Projectionists of the world unite!



Who knows what grains lurk in the hearts of film? Only The Projectionists knows...

.

[PeterTHX]

Originally Posted by dialog_gvf

Everything is unfolding as MANY people said would happen: The PS/3 would arrive and dominate the equation.

No amount of anti-Sony venom will alter the fact that the predictions have and are coming true. Perhaps even to a far more degree than predicted (50+% usage versus 20%).

If you ignore the usual suspects, AVSF is actually become a more logical place every day.

Gary

I predicted this back in 2005, as soon as Warner & Paramount switched to "neutral".

Sure, there have been bumps along the way: the late launch and subsequent NR bug in the Samsung player. The endlessly delayed Pioneer/Sony units. I didn't count on "The Fifth Element" not being the best it could be or the HD DVD group would bring out initial releases with a lot of value added content (I thought at least the BD releases would be comparable).

I never understood the HD DVD fandom. They endlessly compare the Beta-VHS wars, the product with the most CE support won. They criticize Sony, laud Toshiba...yet Sony is the one backed by Panasonic, Pioneer, Samsung, Philips, etc. Sony is "evil" yet they turn a blind eye to Microsoft being the other controlling entity. I'm a strong MS supporter in the PC field, but even I know they're not pure as the driven snow.

"Tortise and the Hare" I quoted back summer 2006 in the HTF. I was nearly laughed off the board...and as bad as some here think of the AVS, at least I was never threatened with bannination and I'm *sharply more* critical of HD DVD there. I was nearly kicked off the HTF for being a "Blu-ray zealot".

[dialog_gvf]

You'll note that many of the usual suspects are adopting an elitist attitude now. HD DVD is better because the (unspecified) type of movies they like are only available on HD DVD.

Apparently, they only are interested in the offerings of Universal, porn producers and tiny independents. How amazingly convenient that HD DVD was tailored to this niche!

Gary

[hyperdine]

All the lies and misinformation are coming back to haunt them. They couldn't expect to keep up the charade perpetually. A few M$ employees and a couple HD-DVD fanatics posting on a website aren't going to be able to hold back the tsunami of PS3 owners, massive Blu-Ray content, etc.

As JTK says- "Facts are pesky things."

[thunderhawk]

Been telling you since 2004.

Nice to see some action tho. lol

[dialog_gvf]

Prediction: In a last desperate bid to stay relevant, Microsoft convinces the HD DVD studios to release full-frame only.

They'll lose many of the purists, but gain many of the black bar haters.

THAT could be a factor. Certainly 1000x more of one than small producer stuff.

Gary

[Petra]

here's one more

copied and pasted, in case got deleted

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=800329

Where Is Amir?!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! We Need Answers!!!!.
A management change at NBC/UNIVERSAL, a lack of release dates, retailers like Best Buy and Circuit City treating HD-DVD like a red headed step child and the continuous cries for really good mind at ease information that would bring nice big smiles to our faces and not this silent treatment would be greatly appreciated by all of us that spent money in support of the HD-DVD format. At the recent CES Amir himself said that "we don't say were going to do something and then make you wait for it, we deliver" talking at the CES key note for the HD-DVD promotion group. Well if your going to deliver get those damn studio's delivering then. What's up with Warner Bros holding back releases and Paramounts seemingly lack luster release schedule and Universals 100 titles yet there mostly high priced combo's and even then theres no mention of a release date any time soon for anything really good like the Jurassic park films or the Back to the Future films or anything else we could throw in the face of the BD fanboys. Wheres the really aggressive advertising and massive money spending for really good space at major and smaller retailers you do know you have to spend money to make money wright? 150 million and all I see are scarce advertisements that do not really say much and a dumb truck which no doubt took up most of the money. AACS problems and lack of official release dates on the level we had during the late summer and early winter months is needed. Aggressively maintaining Joe publics interest and getting there support is key. You realize how many times I've gone to BEST BUY AND CIRCUIT CITY and seen old people I mean seniors for crying out loud buying Blu-ray titles 3 and 6 at a time. I was shocked. Amir credited the "blogers" and the "professional reviewers" alike for the early success of the format because of all the positives we had to say about our experience with HD-DVDS but what about now? What do you have to say about what were saying now???? Picture quality is for the most part no longer an issue with BD and theres is greater studio support so HD-DVD Group GET OFF YOUR COLLECTIVE BUTTS AND DO WHATS NEEDED!!!!!!! Your losing our confidence big time and theres is no room in war for patients, it's killed or be killed and HD-DVD may not survive. I have over 92 HD-DVD's in my collection and both an HD-A1 and an Xbox 360 HD player. Yes I also have an PS3 with no games just a few BD titles so I have a reason to turn on the damn thing. I continue to resist the urges to buy BD's but HD-DVD group is making it easier to give in to those urgies. Come on Amir on behalf of all of us who need and want info answer our call.

[JTK]

I honestly have been laughing nonstop with glee reading this thread.

[Blu-Light]

That thread is gone.

[JTK]

Originally Posted by Blu-Light

That thread is gone.

Pity. Ah well...we'll be seeing more where that came from.

"The natives are getting restless."

[WriteSimply]

Originally Posted by Blu-Light

That thread is gone.

That is rather absurd. It shows really how far gone AVSF is.


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