A beginners look into the big ocean of Surround Sound - Blu-ray Forum

Blu Ray · 07-07-2012, 06:12 AM

Hi guys, I decided to just make a little thread about a first time (or a newer) person interested in home theater. I know there are tons of posts all over here, but I kinda want to get an idea of what everyone's personal suggestions starting out with a home theater system for the first time. I will pick some that I like, and throw them in place of this so people have an idea of what to get with their budget. I want some focus on music, and some on movies.

Some of us are completely new to this, so layman's terms are necessary for this thread.

Most importantly, include what you think they should purchase first, and what they would probably be able to hold off on for now. Say someone has a budget and they come here thinking "I have 500 bucks, what should I get"? What would you tell them to get?

Please make your posts informative, with info about why you should spend more on a certain part first, or why someone would or wouldn't want an all in 1 box system. Since everyone's setup does vary slightly, let's make the suggestions as "universally friendly" as possible, mention if your ideal starter is more worthy of movies or music, or any other special needs such as "better for a smaller room" or "you can play this system so loud you would shatter glass".

Why don't we say price points of:

~$300

~$500

~$1000

~$1500

An example of what I was hoping for would be -

"$699.99"
"You get 3.1 Surround from X company"
"This will be good for a person who is wanting to upgrade later, but wants to hear the roaring sounds of the theater in their living room, with the option to add more later".
"This style sticks out more, and may not be effective in a tight living space, especially if you upgrade".

OR

(Company stands for - XXXX, maybe even link to a purchase page)

"$1,400"
"Receiver - XXXX for $199.99"
"Front L and R - XXXX for 399.99"
"Sub - XXXX for 299.99"
"Surround's - XXXX for 299.99"
"Center - XXXX for 199.99"
"Description goes here on what it will sound like in a certain setup".

Help me and others browsing this find the perfect system for their smaller, or larger budget to start a home theater!

Blu-Dog · 07-07-2012, 01:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blu Ray

Most importantly, include what you think they should purchase first, and what they would probably be able to hold off on for now. Say someone has a budget and they come here thinking "I have 500 bucks, what should I get"? What would you tell them to get?

Before discussing money, it's best to start at the end, not the beginning, of the process. A person needs to find the equipment for the end result, or they'll buy everything twice. Here are the factors that go into that decision:

Esthetics. Is the look important? Do you want to hide the gear, have the gear dominate the room, or blend into architecture or a particular styie of furniture? Is it a room dedicated to audio, or a common, multipurpose room?
Room size. Is it small enough for small speakers and a modestly sized subwoofer to deliver good results, or is it a large area where bigger speakers and a more powerful amp are required?
Listening requirements. Is bombastic sound for animated movies the goal, or perfect reproduction of classical music at modest listening levels?

Before getting into budget, it's best to determine those factors. While everyone will have recommendations about brands and types of speakers, at various price levels, they may not fit the actual listening requirements or lifestyle of the owner.

I've spent many thousands on equipment, and built my own speakers at very efficient cost, too. All were with an eye to these factors - and I've wound up with JL Audio, Sonus Faber, Definitive Mythos, Vienna Acoustics, Pioneer Elite, and other brands that are known for quality and esthetics. It's possible to get the same level of sound quality at much lower cost, though not with the same look.

I've also built speakers and subwoofers that far exceed the visuals and performance of commercial equipment costing thousands more, so I know it's possible. it depends on what the ultimate goal is, and where it will be used.

callas01 · 07-07-2012, 04:12 PM

Its a very interesting discussion that you brought up.

I will say that blu-dog brings up very valid issues. But not everyone will want to build their own speakers, but you have to take into consideration room size, WAF and how you like to listen, or your sound preferences; do you like brighter/louder or something more warm or neutral.

I think in most cases, if you are discussing a very budget system, you would be best served to buy just a receiver and a pair of l/r speakers and avoid the htib setup. While it might be nice to have all the speakers at once and get some level of surround sound, that level of surround sound is so poor that you will eventually want to upgrade anyways. Why waste the money, youd be better off with a refurb receiver of mid-range quality and a good set of monitor speakers on stands to start. Then add to the setup as funds become more available.

I think once you get to the $1k range, you can get a really nice 3.1 setup that will keep you happy for a while, and typically the build quality to stand many years.

As your budget increases, you can get better quality products and more of them at once. Id say that for a good setup, you should look at $500 for a sub and $1k for 5speakers, and for moderately sized rooms, good quality bookshelfs will be a better purchase then lower quality towers. If its a larger sized room, then scrap either the center and run phantom for a while, or wait on the surrounds and get the higher quality towers.

Blu Ray · 07-07-2012, 05:55 PM

I guess my biggest purpose of this thread is to get some people speakers that have no idea where to start.

What I was imagining we could do with this is come up with a variety of "bundles" or "options" for people to purchase, who may be willing to build onto their purchase later, but for now want a surround sound system.

Can you guys recommend a "starter package" for someone with those budgets, and just pick your own style. I would say for this thread let's assume the people purchasing first time home theater are not going to have an exclusive "audio room" but more or less use it in their living area (or bedroom).

An example of what I was hoping for would be -

"$699.99"
"You get 3.1 Surround from X company"
"This will be good for a person who is wanting to upgrade later, but wants to hear the roaring sounds of the theater in their living room, with the option to add more later".
"This style sticks out more, and may not be effective in a tight living space, especially if you upgrade".

OR

(Company stands for - XXXX, maybe even link to a purchase page)

"$1,400"
"Receiver - XXXX for $199.99"
"Front L and R - XXXX for 399.99"
"Sub - XXXX for 299.99"
"Surround's - XXXX for 299.99"
"Center - XXXX for 199.99"
"Description goes here on what it will sound like in a certain setup".

That is what I was hoping to get from you guys that are all-knowing in audio. From what I can tell by the # of views, this info may be very helpful to a lot of people browsing on here. Thanks guys.

Blu-Dog · 07-07-2012, 09:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blu Ray

What I was imagining we could do with this is come up with a variety of "bundles" or "options" for people to purchase, who may be willing to build onto their purchase later, but for now want a surround sound system.

I'm betting that's what a lot of people have done, and regretted it.

In 2006, I began building a new home theater from pieces I had - front speakers from X, rears from Y, various receivers I had - and tossed the whole mess out. None of it matched my new environment, rooms that were two to three times the size of my old areas, and didn't match the decor.

I wound up spending quite a bit, to put it mildly, but our equipment will be passed on to our children. It's that good, and that universal.

For people without that kind of budget, the best all-around starter home theater equipment - that is readily available, comes from Klipsch.

At the low end, there is this:

http://www.klipsch.com/home-theater-systems?n=1

At higher prices, there's this:

http://www.klipsch.com/home-theater-systems

This is without a receiver, and I highly recommend Pioneer above all others:

VSX Series (Lower End):

http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/PU...neer+Receivers

Elite Series (Higher End)

http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/PU...lite+Receivers

These are brands, without prices, because price and availability is very fluid. I also would recommend that if someone is planning to start out with light expenditure and add as they go, start only with a 2.0 (two small front speakers, which can later become surround or rear speakers, and no subwoofer) and a good receiver.

If someone purchases a full surround package, and find it to be in some way inadequate, they have to dispose of something and replace it. Money will be spent and discarded, not a good method.

The first thing measure those three requirements, and fit the purchase of ANY equipment to those. That allows more care in the purchase, and folks in this group can give very solid recommendations that won't mean trying to resell or discard substandard gear.

BIslander · 07-08-2012, 04:39 PM

Personal preference plays such a large role in speaker selection that it is rather difficult to say one set of speakers is better than another at the same price point. With receivers, a person's specific needs come into play. A feature on an AVR that's important to me may be inconsequential for you. Given all those variables, plus price fluctuations, I don't know that it's possible to come up with the kind of meaningful starter packages you'd like to see in this thread.

If someone is interested in putting together a system that meets his needs, there's really no substitute for doing basic research and listening to equipment before making a purchase.

callas01 · 07-08-2012, 08:09 PM

It is personal when it comes to setting up a system. I would never buy klipsch speakers, I don't like them. So I won't recommend them either. I don't like polk either so I won't recommend them either. For something a little more aggressive sounding I'd go with monitor audio or paradigm. They're able to reach up and be a little more forward sounding with making your ear tired like klipsch does for me. Something a little warm, b&w, PSB or energy. Something more neutral, dynaudio, focal, dali. Something more laidback, Wharfedale or Epos.

I don't like pioneer receivers personally, so I'd recommend marantz, denon, onkyo.

Subs, you have to go with ID brands to get the best bang for buck performance, Hsu, svs, outlaw, Emotiva, lava subs are good performers with entry to mid level pricing.

Imo, you shouldn't jump into ht for cheap, you should build slowly and have a system that when your done, you will keep for a while. If you buy at the peak of your budget, you're less likely to upgrade, cause you will enjoy what you have longer, and you'll know that the upgrade will cost even more.

BillCinLR · 07-09-2012, 04:23 PM

OR ... you might try looking here:
http://www.avsforum.com/t/809777/off...natives-thread

Bill C

onyxbfly · 07-11-2012, 03:38 PM

Every speaker is not for everybody. Sound is relative. Take the advice that was given here and build upon it. Id suggest going to a HT dealer. Let them demo their goodies. Some sales men are good and laid back and let you do your thing. Some will beat you in your head.

Get a feel for what you like compile a list and make your decisions. If you can afford to go with them then do so. If not take your list and hunt around. Often HT dealers can and will work with you on the price.

In my mind nothing beats DIY. There are several DIY packages one can go with. Even if you do not have the knowledge and the tools, there are people who will build them and ship them for you. That is the best bang for the buck.

This way you can have what you want the way you want it. Perfectly matched to your taste etc.

Another way to save on equipment that is light yrs beyond entry level is to buy it used. Peep audiogon.com

Fors* · 07-11-2012, 04:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by onyxbfly

Every speaker is not for everybody. Sound is relative. Take the advice that was given here and build upon it. Id suggest going to a HT dealer. Let them demo their goodies. Some sales men are good and laid back and let you do your thing. Some will beat you in your head.

Get a feel for what you like compile a list and make your decisions. If you can afford to go with them then do so. If not take your list and hunt around. Often HT dealers can and will work with you on the price.

In my mind nothing beats DIY. There are several DIY packages one can go with. Even if you do not have the knowledge and the tools, there are people who will build them and ship them for you. That is the best bang for the buck.

This way you can have what you want the way you want it. Perfectly matched to your taste etc.

Another way to save on equipment that is light yrs beyond entry level is to buy it used. Peep audiogon.com

+1...I got my speakers from a member there, and they still look and sound incredible. Pics are in my gallery for those interested.

troyus · 08-29-2012, 12:52 AM

PC's have things like this ie: http://whirlpool.net.au/wiki/rmp_sg_whirlpoolpcs

Self installation is a given. Could have diff groups like above. All the price points + groups;

Normal Hifi sytem
500
1000
1500

Discrete hifi system
500
1000
1500

self made hifi (create speakers)
500
1000
1500

Etc
Those titles and headings are just random made up on the spot stuff. But you get the idea.
Biggest issue is that speakers are diff to everybody. Its a personal thing, but at this level people can take the recommendation and be happy.

troyus · 08-29-2012, 01:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BillCinLR

OR ... you might try looking here:
http://www.avsforum.com/t/809777/off...natives-thread

Bill C

Yea like that. good thread there.

07-07-2012, 06:12 AM	#1
Blu Ray Active Member Member since:Feb 2010 Location:Saint Cloud, MN Home Theater Gallery:5 Blu-ray collection:172 DVD collection:6 Trading Score:4	A beginners look into the big ocean of Surround Sound Hi guys, I decided to just make a little thread about a first time (or a newer) person interested in home theater. I know there are tons of posts all over here, but I kinda want to get an idea of what everyone's personal suggestions starting out with a home theater system for the first time. I will pick some that I like, and throw them in place of this so people have an idea of what to get with their budget. I want some focus on music, and some on movies. Some of us are completely new to this, so layman's terms are necessary for this thread. Most importantly, include what you think they should purchase first, and what they would probably be able to hold off on for now. Say someone has a budget and they come here thinking "I have 500 bucks, what should I get"? What would you tell them to get? Please make your posts informative, with info about why you should spend more on a certain part first, or why someone would or wouldn't want an all in 1 box system. Since everyone's setup does vary slightly, let's make the suggestions as "universally friendly" as possible, mention if your ideal starter is more worthy of movies or music, or any other special needs such as "better for a smaller room" or "you can play this system so loud you would shatter glass". Why don't we say price points of: ~$300 ~$500 ~$1000 ~$1500 An example of what I was hoping for would be - "$699.99" "You get 3.1 Surround from X company" "This will be good for a person who is wanting to upgrade later, but wants to hear the roaring sounds of the theater in their living room, with the option to add more later". "This style sticks out more, and may not be effective in a tight living space, especially if you upgrade". OR (Company stands for - XXXX, maybe even link to a purchase page) "$1,400" "Receiver - XXXX for $199.99" "Front L and R - XXXX for 399.99" "Sub - XXXX for 299.99" "Surround's - XXXX for 299.99" "Center - XXXX for 199.99" "Description goes here on what it will sound like in a certain setup". Help me and others browsing this find the perfect system for their smaller, or larger budget to start a home theater! Last edited by Blu Ray; 07-07-2012 at 05:57 PM.

07-08-2012, 04:39 PM	#6
BIslander Blu-ray Samurai Member since:Sep 2008 Location:Bainbridge Island, WA	Personal preference plays such a large role in speaker selection that it is rather difficult to say one set of speakers is better than another at the same price point. With receivers, a person's specific needs come into play. A feature on an AVR that's important to me may be inconsequential for you. Given all those variables, plus price fluctuations, I don't know that it's possible to come up with the kind of meaningful starter packages you'd like to see in this thread. If someone is interested in putting together a system that meets his needs, there's really no substitute for doing basic research and listening to equipment before making a purchase. Last edited by BIslander; 07-08-2012 at 04:42 PM.

07-07-2012, 04:12 PM	#3
callas01 Blu-ray Prince Top contributor Member since:Jun 2008 Location:Riverside, CA Home Theater Gallery:42 Blu-ray collection:230 DVD collection:47	Its a very interesting discussion that you brought up. I will say that blu-dog brings up very valid issues. But not everyone will want to build their own speakers, but you have to take into consideration room size, WAF and how you like to listen, or your sound preferences; do you like brighter/louder or something more warm or neutral. I think in most cases, if you are discussing a very budget system, you would be best served to buy just a receiver and a pair of l/r speakers and avoid the htib setup. While it might be nice to have all the speakers at once and get some level of surround sound, that level of surround sound is so poor that you will eventually want to upgrade anyways. Why waste the money, youd be better off with a refurb receiver of mid-range quality and a good set of monitor speakers on stands to start. Then add to the setup as funds become more available. I think once you get to the $1k range, you can get a really nice 3.1 setup that will keep you happy for a while, and typically the build quality to stand many years. As your budget increases, you can get better quality products and more of them at once. Id say that for a good setup, you should look at $500 for a sub and $1k for 5speakers, and for moderately sized rooms, good quality bookshelfs will be a better purchase then lower quality towers. If its a larger sized room, then scrap either the center and run phantom for a while, or wait on the surrounds and get the higher quality towers.

07-07-2012, 05:55 PM	#4
Blu Ray Active Member Member since:Feb 2010 Location:Saint Cloud, MN Home Theater Gallery:5 Blu-ray collection:172 DVD collection:6 Trading Score:4	I guess my biggest purpose of this thread is to get some people speakers that have no idea where to start. What I was imagining we could do with this is come up with a variety of "bundles" or "options" for people to purchase, who may be willing to build onto their purchase later, but for now want a surround sound system. Can you guys recommend a "starter package" for someone with those budgets, and just pick your own style. I would say for this thread let's assume the people purchasing first time home theater are not going to have an exclusive "audio room" but more or less use it in their living area (or bedroom). An example of what I was hoping for would be - "$699.99" "You get 3.1 Surround from X company" "This will be good for a person who is wanting to upgrade later, but wants to hear the roaring sounds of the theater in their living room, with the option to add more later". "This style sticks out more, and may not be effective in a tight living space, especially if you upgrade". OR (Company stands for - XXXX, maybe even link to a purchase page) "$1,400" "Receiver - XXXX for $199.99" "Front L and R - XXXX for 399.99" "Sub - XXXX for 299.99" "Surround's - XXXX for 299.99" "Center - XXXX for 199.99" "Description goes here on what it will sound like in a certain setup". That is what I was hoping to get from you guys that are all-knowing in audio. From what I can tell by the # of views, this info may be very helpful to a lot of people browsing on here. Thanks guys.

07-08-2012, 08:09 PM	#7
callas01 Blu-ray Prince Top contributor Member since:Jun 2008 Location:Riverside, CA Home Theater Gallery:42 Blu-ray collection:230 DVD collection:47	It is personal when it comes to setting up a system. I would never buy klipsch speakers, I don't like them. So I won't recommend them either. I don't like polk either so I won't recommend them either. For something a little more aggressive sounding I'd go with monitor audio or paradigm. They're able to reach up and be a little more forward sounding with making your ear tired like klipsch does for me. Something a little warm, b&w, PSB or energy. Something more neutral, dynaudio, focal, dali. Something more laidback, Wharfedale or Epos. I don't like pioneer receivers personally, so I'd recommend marantz, denon, onkyo. Subs, you have to go with ID brands to get the best bang for buck performance, Hsu, svs, outlaw, Emotiva, lava subs are good performers with entry to mid level pricing. Imo, you shouldn't jump into ht for cheap, you should build slowly and have a system that when your done, you will keep for a while. If you buy at the peak of your budget, you're less likely to upgrade, cause you will enjoy what you have longer, and you'll know that the upgrade will cost even more.

07-09-2012, 04:23 PM	#8
BillCinLR Member Member since:Sep 2008	OR ... you might try looking here: http://www.avsforum.com/t/809777/off...natives-thread Bill C

07-11-2012, 03:38 PM	#9
onyxbfly Blu-ray Guru Member since:Feb 2009 Blu-ray collection:780 DVD collection:29 Trading Score:47	Every speaker is not for everybody. Sound is relative. Take the advice that was given here and build upon it. Id suggest going to a HT dealer. Let them demo their goodies. Some sales men are good and laid back and let you do your thing. Some will beat you in your head. Get a feel for what you like compile a list and make your decisions. If you can afford to go with them then do so. If not take your list and hunt around. Often HT dealers can and will work with you on the price. In my mind nothing beats DIY. There are several DIY packages one can go with. Even if you do not have the knowledge and the tools, there are people who will build them and ship them for you. That is the best bang for the buck. This way you can have what you want the way you want it. Perfectly matched to your taste etc. Another way to save on equipment that is light yrs beyond entry level is to buy it used. Peep audiogon.com

08-29-2012, 12:52 AM	#11
troyus Active Member Member since:Jan 2010 Blu-ray collection:248	PC's have things like this ie: http://whirlpool.net.au/wiki/rmp_sg_whirlpoolpcs Self installation is a given. Could have diff groups like above. All the price points + groups; Normal Hifi sytem 500 1000 1500 Discrete hifi system 500 1000 1500 self made hifi (create speakers) 500 1000 1500 Etc Those titles and headings are just random made up on the spot stuff. But you get the idea. Biggest issue is that speakers are diff to everybody. Its a personal thing, but at this level people can take the recommendation and be happy.

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