Physical & Digital EST: The Future of Home Video Discussion Thread

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by alchav21

Now it's all Digital VoIP. The Internet Of Things, like I said, it will be all Networks and Servers.

VOIP sucks; when either the power or the internet goes out, you lose your phone service, too.

No thanks.

You can still get traditional wall jack phone service where I live, but I have decided to just have my cell phone. It has been surprisingly reliable. It works when VOIP doesn't.

If I wanted a "landline" phone, it sure as hell would not be VOIP. I had that with AT&T U-Verse when I lived in California. It should have been called U-Curse. Lose your internet service and you lose your phone. And usually your TV service, too.

U-Curse bundles were great; if one service failed, then they all did. If U-Curse wasn't down, San Diego Gas & Electric was; it was like they were a tag team of incompetence.

[Groot]

Originally Posted by Vilya

It is just an opinion, nothing "asinine" about it.

Considering the large amount of money spent by the consumer, I just feel that the manufacturers should support what they sell us for a longer period of time.

Sure, technology evolves, but a lot of it is also backwards compatible, like with our 4k disc players that still support all the formats that came before.

In the case of 3D, the TV manufacturers deliberately killed it even though we know 4K TVs are capable of supporting it. I own one of the last models that does so. Retaining 3D functionality was not cost intensive for the TV makers, either. The 4K models that had 3D were not more expensive than many of today's models that come without it. The LG OLED 6 series that had 3D was comparably priced to today's LG OLED 8 series without 3D.

As I have spent a considerable amount of money on 3D discs, a 3D capable player, and a 3D TV, it is particularly aggravating to know that the exclusion of 3D from today's TV models was an arbitrary decision. Its inclusion did not prevent 4K functionality nor was it expensive to include it.

Even though my 4K 3D TV has an extended warranty, if it falters it probably will not get repaired. TVs that fail are generally replaced with something new and available today, which means no more 3D TV.

While new tech comes out constantly, many of us do not run out and buy the latest while our existing products still work perfectly. Many of us upgrade only when our stuff begins to fail or when there is truly a major break through.

8K TVs may be here soon, but I doubt many of us plan to chuck our 4K sets to race out and get one.

I am still using my "ancient" 5 year-old Samsung Note 3; I do not see smartphones as the status symbol that many people do. I do not need the latest forward facing selfie camera to plaster my grinning mug all over farcebook.

If we were talking about $15 toasters here, I would not be bothered by the lack of commitment by manufacturers to the products they sell. But when I am spending in four figures, I would like them to support the stuff they sell for at least as long as its operational lifespan. I am not saying it should be warranted for that long, but supported for that long.

There was a time when you could get that toaster repaired, too. Today, we just throw things away and buy a new one. They have us well trained.

It's no different than the current market of washing machines, dryers, refrigerators, dish washers, etc all getting WIFI and tech updates. Should the warranty be longer given the tech is so different (and evolving) vs original standard machines? Absolutely. But they hope when the tech breaks down after the standard 5/10 yrs you have to buy new products that will have completely different feature sets. Same thing here, they don't want to support something that wasn't terribly profitable and want you to buy something else. It's the way of the tech world. They'll reintroduce 3D (maybe) and get people to buy again. It's a terrible tactic but that's how they operate. Phones...ugh, they're the worst offenders.

[Steedeel]

https://www.theverge.com/2017/5/24/1...thrones-mobile

Was reading about GOT and was reminded of this. This is the future of content and the reason everyone of us should be sticking with disc.

[Groot]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

https://www.theverge.com/2017/5/24/1...thrones-mobile

Was reading about GOT and was reminded of this. This is the future of content and the reason everyone of us should be sticking with disc.

It wouldn't be the fact that shows are on Sunday nights and people work and watching an abridged version while at their desk or on their commute wouldn't be another stream of revenue for HBO? So people who can't watch the full version for a few days won't be left out on what's going on during the quote unquote watercooler talk?

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Groot

It wouldn't be the fact that shows are on Sunday nights and people work and watching an abridged version while at their desk or on their commute wouldn't be another stream of revenue for HBO? So people who can't watch the full version for a few days won't be left out on what's going on during the quote unquote watercooler talk?

And that’s a good thing? I don’t think the guy was thinking of that lol. More like the attention spans of younger people (in general) is somewhat lacking. The reasons are irrelevant anyway. It’s the idea they will probably do this. I mean HBO!

This is conditioning younger folk to watch short form content more than they already do. That is NOT a good thing for the future of entertainment, trust me.

[Groot]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

And that’s a good thing? I don’t think the guy was thinking of that lol. More like the attention spans of younger people (in general) is somewhat lacking. The reasons are irrelevant anyway. It’s the idea they will probably do this. I mean HBO!

This is conditioning younger folk to watch short form content more than they already do. That is NOT a good thing for the future of entertainment, trust me.

The article is a year old and we haven't heard of any condensed content being made. This is just a musing about a ploy to make money off of fans of the hour long shows, not cut them down completely should they attempt it.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Groot

The article is a year old and we haven't heard of any condensed content being made. This is just a musing about a ploy to make money off of fans of the hour long shows, not cut them down completely should they attempt it.

You haven’t heard because the merger is still going through various processes. It isn’t in place yet.

[Groot]

AT&T and HBO already have a deal setup, merger or not. They could offer content without being merged if they wanted to. Just like right now, my AT&T package includes free HBO.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Groot

AT&T and HBO already have a deal setup, merger or not. They could offer content without being merged if they wanted to. Just like right now, my AT&T package includes free HBO.

They could but they obviously want to launch this service (amongst others) as and when the merger is cleared. They clearly have designs (imo) on pushing the mobile aspects. That much is very obvious.

[Steedeel]

I think we are at the beginning of what I have been talking about for some time, the short form content and all the rest of it. For years some people on here have said that mobile is just another convenience. Well, all signs are pointing to a new way of consuming stuff, with short bursts being the order of the day. They are pretty much dividing things into mobile and big screen with a shift in the way mobile video is offered and consumed. It's hardly the foundation for promoting long form, rich content. As I have said all along, mobile is morphing into short form, quick fix content.

[Vilya]

Remember those Reader Digest Condensed Books? They were greatly shortened versions of classic and contemporary literature.

I recall some of my grade school and high school teachers fearing that these would replace the full versions. They would not allow any of them to be read for book reports.

Well, the full unabridged books remain and where are those Reader Digest condensed books now? I have not seen one in decades.

I am not worried about Game Of Thrones Lite, either. Just seeing how people here get excited over every extended cut of any movie that comes along reassures me that people want the full versions and the still longer ones even more.

As for sticking with disc, I think I am as stuck as I can be. I bought 32 titles this month already.

I am returning to my mid morning daydreams now. Wake me if anything substantive happens.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Vilya

Remember those Reader Digest Condensed Books? They were greatly shortened versions of classic and contemporary literature.

I recall some of my grade school and high school teachers fearing that these would replace the full versions. They would not allow any of them to be read for book reports.

Well, the full unabridged books remain and where are those Reader Digest condensed books now? I have not seen one in decades.

I am not worried about Game Of Thrones Lite, either. Just seeing how people here get excited over every extended cut of any movie that comes along reassures me that people want the full versions and the still longer ones even more.

As for sticking with disc, I think I am as stuck as I can be. I bought 31 titles this month already.

I am returning to my mid morning daydreams now. Wake me if anything substantive happens.

It already is happening.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by Groot

It's no different than the current market of washing machines, dryers, refrigerators, dish washers, etc all getting WIFI and tech updates. Should the warranty be longer given the tech is so different (and evolving) vs original standard machines? Absolutely. But they hope when the tech breaks down after the standard 5/10 yrs you have to buy new products that will have completely different feature sets. Same thing here, they don't want to support something that wasn't terribly profitable and want you to buy something else. It's the way of the tech world. They'll reintroduce 3D (maybe) and get people to buy again. It's a terrible tactic but that's how they operate. Phones...ugh, they're the worst offenders.

I realize that 3D did not take the home video market by storm, but it is just a feature on a TV among many others. It could easily have been retained on TVs for those of us who do enjoy it and have spent a lot of money on content for it.

As I pointed out, the new LG OLEDs without 3D cost almost exactly the same as the 2016 models that had 3D. Retaining this capability clearly had no major cost impact on the TVs.

My 4K disc player still supports SACD and DVD Audio as niche as these formats are now. Why remove a previous capability even if only a comparatively small number of people still use it? It has no major impact on the cost of the product to retain the functionality in these instances.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

It already is happening.

I can't begin to panic until I have had more caffeine.

I'll get back to you.

[octagon]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

And that’s a good thing?

Maybe it's not a good thing or a bad thing. Maybe it's just a thing.

I hear tell of people in Europe who put mayo on fries. That's both completely disgusting and completely irrelevant. It's not a good thing. It's not a bad thing. It's just a thing.

Originally Posted by Steedeel

More like the attention spans of younger people (in general) is somewhat lacking.

Do you have any data to support this claim. For that matter, does anybody have any data to support this claim.

Is there some scientifically objective measure of attention spans and has anybody applied this objective measure of attention span to different age cohorts?

Or is this just another case of people muttering 'these damn kids today'?

Originally Posted by Steedeel

...trust me.

[octagon]

Originally Posted by Vilya

Considering the large amount of money spent by the consumer, I just feel that the manufacturers should support what they sell us for a longer period of time.

How would that even work though?

If Warner sells me a 3D disc would LG be obligated to keep selling me 3D TVs? That doesn't seem very...practical.

And how/where would this cycle end?

Warner sells me a disc in 2010 so LG has to keep selling me TVs until 2020. And if I buy a new 3D set in 2020 does that mean Warner has to keep selling me 3D discs until 2030? At which point LG would be back on the hook until 2040?

Lather, rinse, repeat until the end of time?

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by octagon

Lather, rinse, repeat until the end of time?

Well, that would be fine by me.

The 3D blu-ray format dates back to 2010. By 2013, Vizio dropped 3D support on their TVs. By, 2015 Samsung did the same. In 2016, LG was the last to offer 3D; it was the final year they did.

3D is simply a single feature on a TV; it is not some radically different creature from a non 3D TV. Retaining it adds no significant cost to the TV. On a passive 3D set, it involves little more than attaching a polarization filter to the screen itself. Today's non-3D 4K OLEDs cost the same as 2016's 4K OLEDs with 3D.

I feel the TV manufacturers should support this feature for as long as the movie studios produce and sell us 3D discs, here or abroad, or at the minimum until the 3D blu-ray format turns 10 years-old in 2020. Cue the song Feelings here.

Removing the 3D feature was unnecessary. I believe TVs should be every bit as backwards compatible as the 4K disc players sold today. Many of those players play every disc format since the compact disc.

4K players could have just as easily dropped DVD support and saved the money from having to have two different color lasers, one for DVDs and the other for blu-rays and 4K discs. But the players retained a red laser for DVDs and a blue-violet laser for blu-rays and 4K discs. They remain backwards compatible.

I know that DVD is immeasurably more popular than 3D blu-ray ever was, but the point is still there. My Oppo 203 even supports SACD and DVD Audio and that is about as niche as you can get.

TVs could very easily continue to support 3D, just as most of today's 4K disc players have and virtually all modern blu-ray players have done. The home theater hardware should support all of the disc formats (software) that the industry has sold us, over the last decade at least, unless there is a compelling cost related reason not to continue doing so.

Thus concludes my two day rant where I hijack this thread and pontificate about 3D atop my soapbox.

We may now return to worrying about the dystopian future of TV disappearances, mobile device usage by young people with their allegedly shorter attention spans, and interactive/ edited film content.

I still have not had enough caffeine to work up a panic, but maybe soon?

[octagon]

Originally Posted by Vilya

3D is simply a single feature on a TV; it is not some radically different creature from a non 3D TV. Retaining it adds no significant cost to the TV.

Given how cut-throat TV pricing is these days I suspect the bar for 'significant costs' is pretty low these days. TCL is about to release a 65" UHD with 120 local dimming zones with a retail price tag of just under a grand.

In that environment I would think any additional costs look pretty significant.

Originally Posted by Vilya

I still have not had enough caffeine to work up a panic, but maybe soon?

Try this...

They're Already Here! You're Next! - YouTube

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by octagon

Given how cut-throat TV pricing is these days I suspect the bar for 'significant costs' is pretty low these days. TCL is about to release a 65" UHD with 120 local dimming zones with a retail price tag of just under a grand.

In that environment I would think any additional costs look pretty significant.



Try this...

They're Already Here! You're Next! - YouTube

Yeah, because short form isn’t the biggest growth area in video at the moment. I just imagined it.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by octagon

Given how cut-throat TV pricing is these days I suspect the bar for 'significant costs' is pretty low these days. TCL is about to release a 65" UHD with 120 local dimming zones with a retail price tag of just under a grand.

In that environment I would think any additional costs look pretty significant.



Try this...

They're Already Here! You're Next! - YouTube

Love that movie and the clip from it. I need to rewatch it now. Thanks! The scientist at the very start looks like Richard Deacon who played Fred Rutherford on the TV series Leave It To Beaver.