Oppo BDP-83 Blu-ray Player Thread

[Alan A]

Originally Posted by oppopioneer

Just email Oppo right now and tell them this, they will update it send a firmware update out. They're excellent with quick replies to customer questions and requests. They're amazing. Make sure you use the CD or USB method to update.

why not update over internet? it has worked for me.

[ShockWave]

Is it better to use the video processor over my kuro? If it's better to let the kuro do the work . Shouldn't I just get a 80?

[oppopioneer]

Originally Posted by ShockWave

Is it better to use the video processor over my kuro? If it's better to let the kuro do the work . Shouldn't I just get a 80?

Only people who hate Pioneer Kuro's should answer this.

I have a Pio Elite Kuro Pro-151FD and you can either set the player to "Source Direct" to pass along all info on the disc untouched and let the Kuro's processor to the processing or you can let the player do the processing by setting it to 1080p/24fps.

I personally set my bd player to Source Direct and let my Kuro display do all the scaling. The Kuro will achnowledge a 1080p/24 signal and upconvert it to 1080p/72. Those who don't have a Pioneer Kuro display should let the bd player do the work.

[ShockWave]

Thanks! Same response I got from Oppo CS for the most part.

[micks_address]

it does now play back mpeg TS streams which is fantastic... has a slight issue with some audio track.. Oppo have asked me to send on a sample file.. and the player isnt as responsive as say the ps3 when pausing/rewinding etc.. but its nice to be able to use it to watch films from my hard disk instead of using the wind blowing ps3..

Originally Posted by micks_address

i wonder does this firmware allow the playback of mpeg ts (transport stream) files? i had sent a samle file to Oppo a couple of months ago and they said they hoped to include it in a future update..

[un4gvn94538]

alright this is now getting annoying. not sure if this was discussed or not but it seems that the oppo is not sending dts ma 5.1es signal correctly. first it was T2 skynet which i let pass and just shrugged my shoulders. but now its lord of the rings. my ps3 can decode and send the 5.1es (and shows 6.1) signal but the oppo cant send it bitstreamed or as lpcm. unless im mistaken, i heard nothing from my rear centers. is this something can be fixed via firmware or is it hardware?

[Astrakan]

Originally Posted by un4gvn94538

alright this is now getting annoying. not sure if this was discussed or not but it seems that the oppo is not sending dts ma 5.1es signal correctly... is this something can be fixed via firmware or is it hardware?

Considering Oppo has the best customer support in the business, I'll give you the same advice I give everyone else who has any kind of problem or question about an Oppo product:

Contact Oppo

They're quick to reply and more often than not they have a solution to your problem. If they don't, they will at least tell you that much.

Next to sheer product quality, customer support is the main reason I recommend Oppo to anyone who wants to listen.

[un4gvn94538]

Originally Posted by Astrakan

Considering Oppo has the best customer support in the business, I'll give you the same advice I give everyone else who has any kind of problem or question about an Oppo product:

Contact Oppo

They're quick to reply and more often than not they have a solution to your problem. If they don't, they will at least tell you that much.

Next to sheer product quality, customer support is the main reason I recommend Oppo to anyone who wants to listen.

already did and that would be the obvious first move. i figured i could get an answer from someone in the know quicker here.

[gonk]

Originally Posted by un4gvn94538

but now its lord of the rings. my ps3 can decode and send the 5.1es (and shows 6.1) signal but the oppo cant send it bitstreamed or as lpcm. unless im mistaken, i heard nothing from my rear centers. is this something can be fixed via firmware or is it hardware?

I haven't tried these discs yet, but I have them at home now. What does your receiver report when you bitstream over HDMI? In that configuration, the player isn't altering the signal at all - if the receiver gets the bitstream, it should be the same no matter what player it comes from.

I'm still not really up to speed on what DTS-HD is doing with the ES format (sort of a hybrid of new and old formats). That being said, the BDP-83 (like just about every other player in existence that isn't a PS3) includes DTS decoders that support everything except the ES extensions. The same is true for the Dolby decoders (no EX). According to Blu-ray.com's LOTR page, the audio track is a "DTS-HD Master Audio 5.1 ES" track - which suggests to me that, when decoding internally, the BDP-83 will provide 5.1 output due to hardware limitations rather than any sort of bug. I could be wrong, though, as I wasn't even aware that DTS was co-mingling the old ES encoding with Master Audio until fairly recently.

[un4gvn94538]

Originally Posted by gonk

I haven't tried these discs yet, but I have them at home now. What does your receiver report when you bitstream over HDMI? In that configuration, the player isn't altering the signal at all - if the receiver gets the bitstream, it should be the same no matter what player it comes from.

I'm still not really up to speed on what DTS-HD is doing with the ES format (sort of a hybrid of new and old formats). That being said, the BDP-83 (like just about every other player in existence that isn't a PS3) includes DTS decoders that support everything except the ES extensions. The same is true for the Dolby decoders (no EX). According to Blu-ray.com's LOTR page, the audio track is a "DTS-HD Master Audio 5.1 ES" track - which suggests to me that, when decoding internally, the BDP-83 will provide 5.1 output due to hardware limitations rather than any sort of bug. I could be wrong, though, as I wasn't even aware that DTS was co-mingling the old ES encoding with Master Audio until fairly recently.

the receiver shows dts ma 5.1. no es showing at all. the same for the player. its the same for lpcm. both show 5.1.

T2 skynet does the same thing, whats really the point in saying that its dts ma 6.1 when no other player out there supports it (except the ps3)? imo it makes no sense to even call it 6.1 if it isnt descrete. sure this site now lists it as 5.1 es (could have sworn it said 6.1 yesterday), but the back of the box itself doesnt.

edit: can bitstreaming be fixed with firmware or is it in the hardware?

edit edit: come to think of it, i think wall e had the same extension
edit edit edit: it was the lossy track that had the extension on wall e, the lossless only listed 5.1.

[gonk]

Originally Posted by un4gvn94538

the receiver shows dts ma 5.1. no es showing at all. the same for the player. its the same for lpcm. both show 5.1.

That sounds like an issue at the receiver, not the player.

Originally Posted by un4gvn94538

T2 skynet does the same thing, whats really the point in saying that its dts ma 6.1 when no other player out there supports it (except the ps3)? imo it makes no sense to even call it 6.1 if it isnt descrete. sure this site now lists it as 5.1 es (could have sworn it said 6.1 yesterday), but the back of the box itself doesnt.

It's not uncommon for labeling on this sort of stuff to be problematic.

I can't explain why DTS has started furnishing authoring tools that create DTS-HD MA 5.1 tracks with ES encoding to embed a mono rear surround instead of doing DTS-HD MA 6.1 or even DTS-HD MA 7.1 with both rear channels getting the same (mono) signal. There's probably a reason for it from a programming or bit budget perspective, but I haven't try to dig it up. As for the other part, both DTS ES and Dolby EX are processor-intensive functions. The DSP chip in a surround receiver is built to handle it, but the audio DSP chips in disc players are actually integrated into the "System-on-Chip" (SoC) chips and don't have nearly as much CPU horsepower dedicated to audio processing. My understanding is that it has never been cost effective to integrate either DTS ES or Dolby EX processing into these products, especially since DVD players relied so heavily on the coaxial and optical outputs (allowing the receiver DSP's to do the decoding). With Blu-ray, the SoC's got bigger and better, but they also had to handle the significantly higher workload of decoding HD video and the new audio formats. Trying to do matrix surround processing like DTS ES or Dolby EX in addition to decoding TrueHD or DTS-HD MA is still not practical. The PS3 is an exception that proves the rule, as the Cell processor is overkill for DVD and Blu-ray duties and can afford to do this extra processing.

Originally Posted by un4gvn94538

edit: can bitstreaming be fixed with firmware or is it in the hardware?

I'm not sure how bitstreaming could be broken in the first place.

Originally Posted by un4gvn94538

edit edit: come to think of it, i think wall e had the same extension

If I remember correctly, Wall-E is one of a series of Disney discs that do something even stranger: the lossless track was DTS-HD MA 5.1, but the lossy core track was DTS-ES. I can't explain why. It confused the beta testers when it was released, and it still doesn't make a lot of sense to me.

[un4gvn94538]

Originally Posted by gonk

That sounds like an issue at the receiver, not the player.

If I remember correctly, Wall-E is one of a series of Disney discs that do something even stranger: the lossless track was DTS-HD MA 5.1, but the lossy core track was DTS-ES. I can't explain why. It confused the beta testers when it was released, and it still doesn't make a lot of sense to me.

seems to me that the player should show either 6.1 or 5.1 dts ma es then, it doesnt. like you said, when bitstreaming, it doesnt alter the audio, just sends it. so it should show the extentions.

about wall e , yeah i edited my post yet again.

anyway, i heard from oppo. the asked a question and well see....

[un4gvn94538]

oppo said that the player doesnt support dd ex and dts es when decoding which seems kinda weak. they also said that when bitstreaming the player wont show the extensions. but at least these are matrixed codecs so its not that big a deal. they also said theyre gonna duplicate what i told them and i also asked if they can test on a more recent model receiver.

Originally Posted by gonk

It's not uncommon for labeling on this sort of stuff to be problematic.

this shouldnt be the case though. labeling on dvds (the ones i have anyway) do say wether the 6.1 channels are es discrete or matrixed. did studios all of a sudden get stupid? or just lazy?

[EWL5]

Originally Posted by un4gvn94538

T2 skynet does the same thing, whats really the point in saying that its dts ma 6.1 when no other player out there supports it (except the ps3)? imo it makes no sense to even call it 6.1 if it isnt descrete. sure this site now lists it as 5.1 es (could have sworn it said 6.1 yesterday), but the back of the box itself doesnt.

The Skynet issue is a known snafu. Read this post I made in another thread:

Originally Posted by EWL5

I don't think Dolby EX 6.1 is even possible. DD maxes out at 5.1 for the DVD format. Concerning T2:Skynet:

Straight from the horse's mouth:

http://www.hometheaterforum.com/foru...0#post_3573839

"So when I was doing the menus and asking about the wording, DTS said it should be called 6.1. When I questioned that (since I was going to call the Dolby version 5.1), they said that all of the receivers and players that read it would display "6.1" on their LED panels, so we shouldn't confuse them by calling it 5.1. I acquiesced, and so of course half of the players we later tested the disc on displayed "5.1"... DTS says that older players will likely do that, but the newer equipment should correctly display it as "6.1". My PS3 displays it as 5.1 as well.

Go figure,

V"

Details concerning the audio tracks are confirmed in the post below:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...4#post16491074

I hope this closes the subject on this whole T2:Skynet DTS-ES 6.1/5.1 debacle!

[gonk]

Originally Posted by un4gvn94538

oppo said that the player doesnt support dd ex and dts es when decoding which seems kinda weak. they also said that when bitstreaming the player wont show the extensions. but at least these are matrixed codecs so its not that big a deal. they also said theyre gonna duplicate what i told them and i also asked if they can test on a more recent model receiver.

I disagree that the lack of EX and ES support is "weak." Occasionally inconvenient, yes, but not unusual. As I explained earlier, it is a limitation of almost every standalone player ever built. The SoC's that these players are built around simply can't handle both the decoding and the subsequent matrix processing required to support these two modes.

Originally Posted by un4gvn94538

this shouldnt be the case though. labeling on dvds (the ones i have anyway) do say wether the 6.1 channels are es discrete or matrixed. did studios all of a sudden get stupid? or just lazy?

I agree that it shouldn't, but there has been some confusion about a few of these 6.1 and 7.1 discs. I don't think it's an epidemic, and some of it may be a result of discs (such as those from Disney) that have different configurations on the lossless track and its lossy core. As for why? I don't know - could be laziness, could be sloppiness, could be a combination of factors.

[solarrdadd]

Originally Posted by un4gvn94538

the receiver shows dts ma 5.1. no es showing at all. the same for the player. its the same for lpcm. both show 5.1.

T2 skynet does the same thing, whats really the point in saying that its dts ma 6.1 when no other player out there supports it (except the ps3)? imo it makes no sense to even call it 6.1 if it isnt descrete. sure this site now lists it as 5.1 es (could have sworn it said 6.1 yesterday), but the back of the box itself doesnt.

edit: can bitstreaming be fixed with firmware or is it in the hardware?

edit edit: come to think of it, i think wall e had the same extension
edit edit edit: it was the lossy track that had the extension on wall e, the lossless only listed 5.1.

these movies are mastered like toy story movies (audio that is) and i have the 83 oppo and the 5507 onkyoi and when using the display button on the oppo it said 5.1 DTS, but the screen display on my 5507 said ES Audio and when i hit the display button for it, it said DTS HD MA ES in 6.1 out 7.1 (it matrixed it to both my back surrounds) so, i'll give it a try tonight and see what i get. i use to have the 805 and in that menu there was somewhere you could set a feature to auto or manual and in auto if it was a 6.1 ES (not discrete) it would play 6.1 but if it was manual, it would play 5.1 and not matrix it unless you changed the listening mode manually. i'll put LOTR on tonight and let you know what i get.

[solarrdadd]

ok un4gvn94538, i just put on the LOTR on my system. the oppo display says DTS-HD-MA 5.1 the 5507 input says DTS-ES 5.1/DTS-HD-MA output it says ES-MATRIX/DTS-HD-MA 7.1

on the static screen of my 5507 it says in big letters, ES-MATRIX in smaller red letters next to it is dts-hd-ma/es

so that is either the limitation of the receiver you have or you need to change a setting somewhere on the receiver you have.

i hope this helped.

[EWL5]

Originally Posted by solarrdadd

ok un4gvn94538, i just put on the LOTR on my system. the oppo display says DTS-HD-MA 5.1 the 5507 input says DTS-ES 5.1/DTS-HD-MA output it says ES-MATRIX/DTS-HD-MA 7.1

on the static screen of my 5507 it says in big letters, ES-MATRIX in smaller red letters next to it is dts-hd-ma/es

so that is either the limitation of the receiver you have or you need to change a setting somewhere on the receiver you have.

i hope this helped.

Now I'm wondering if some receivers only had the DTS-HD Essentials decoder vs the DTS-HD MA decoder. DTS branding has been awful the last couple of years and caused massive confusion.

un4gvn94538, your 705 Onkyo was a first gen HDMI 1.3 receiver, if I'm not mistaken...

[un4gvn94538]

Originally Posted by solarrdadd

ok un4gvn94538, i just put on the LOTR on my system. the oppo display says DTS-HD-MA 5.1 the 5507 input says DTS-ES 5.1/DTS-HD-MA output it says ES-MATRIX/DTS-HD-MA 7.1

on the static screen of my 5507 it says in big letters, ES-MATRIX in smaller red letters next to it is dts-hd-ma/es

so that is either the limitation of the receiver you have or you need to change a setting somewhere on the receiver you have.

i hope this helped.

thanks for the confirmation. yes i have an older 705. but ive never seen a reason to upgrade and i still dont. not for matrixed signals and not for 3-d. at least now i know its the codec is supported with newer receiver models. dont think i read that anywhere.

GONK:
i read the entire post from your link. if dts is indeed "rounding up", then they changed since the dvd days. also, it was said that when the disc is played, it would show up as 6.1 on the players and receivers. well, it doesnt on the player. and the player was released publicly about the same time as that post was made, so what does dts mean by newer players and receivers (mainly players in this case)? also the post mentions that the ps3 shows the playback as 5.1. it doesnt. my ps3 does in fact show it as dts ma 6.1 just like lord of the rings. the last update concerning the audio was a couple years ago when they fixed a decoding error in 7.1 discs. seems with lotr release, dts is not going to stop "rounding up" and until most early adopters upgrade thier equipment, then the confusion will continue.

[solarrdadd]

Originally Posted by un4gvn94538

thanks for the confirmation. yes i have an older 705. but ive never seen a reason to upgrade and i still dont. not for matrixed signals and not for 3-d. at least now i know its the codec is supported with newer receiver models. dont think i read that anywhere.

GONK:
i read the entire post from your link. if dts is indeed "rounding up", then they changed since the dvd days. also, it was said that when the disc is played, it would show up as 6.1 on the players and receivers. well, it doesnt on the player. and the player was released publicly about the same time as that post was made, so what does dts mean by newer players and receivers (mainly players in this case)? also the post mentions that the ps3 shows the playback as 5.1. it doesnt. my ps3 does in fact show it as dts ma 6.1 just like lord of the rings. the last update concerning the audio was a couple years ago when they fixed a decoding error in 7.1 discs. seems with lotr release, dts is not going to stop "rounding up" and until most early adopters upgrade thier equipment, then the confusion will continue.

i suspect that while oppo doesn't support the decoding of the ES or EX matrix flags, if bitstreamed, they will pass it through despite that the display says the straight codec with no mention of the suffix flag. this is so proven with my setup. it won't display it but it did in fact pass it on so that my pre-amp (which supports it) could decode it.

interesting enough, i also have an oppo 80 in my home office area in the basement, and it's connected to a 5.1 receiver via analog cables. the oppo display also says 5.1 (codec) but since i only have 5 channels i wonder if it will decode it onboard LPCM and send it out via analog. i do have the analog speaker set-up to downmix to 5.1 so perhaps if i had one or two more channels, it would in fact matrix that/those channels out to the one or two extra channels if i had them. of coarse, i won't know that answer since i don't!