Star Wars Wars the UOT Strikes Back and OTHER PEZ dispensers

[Moviefan2k4]

If the folks who want the UOT spent half the time and energy complaining directly to Lucasfilm as they do ranting on here, we'd probably have a press release about it by now.

[Blu-man08]

Well after a five day suspension for posting off-topic comments (apologies to mods), I'm back! Pity that Beast seems to have been suspended for a much longer period of time. His opinions are always interesting (even though he's out of his freaking mind... ) and the ensuing debates are most entertaining. But before I get off-topic yet again...

It's always been curious to me that the OUT DVD included the original 1977 scroll (No Episode IV A New Hope) despite Lucas' repeated claims that the "workprints" are in no shape to strike a properly remastered (read: Anamorphic widescreen, 16:9) DVD. But this new-old scroll had to come from somewhere. In fact the footage found its way into the "Empire of Dreams" doc which was anamorphic.

Question for all us OUT purists: Would you be satisfied with the OUT remastered in anamorphic widescreen, but only on DVD? Of course, if the powers that be went to the trouble of striking a proper 16:9 transfer, how difficult would it be to slap that on a blu-ray. But given that Lucas' preferred versions are the versions du jour AND given that the last time the OUT was made available they were haphazardly slapped onto a "Bonus Features" DVD, how realistic is it to think that Lucas would go blu for the Classic Versions?

Discuss!

[Dotpattern]

Originally Posted by Blu-man08

Well after a five day suspension for posting off-topic comments (apologies to mods), I'm back! Pity that Beast seems to have been suspended for a much longer period of time. His opinions are always interesting (even though he's out of his freaking mind... ) and the ensuing debates are most entertaining. But before I get off-topic yet again...

It's always been curious to me that the OUT DVD included the original 1977 scroll (No Episode IV A New Hope) despite Lucas' repeated claims that the "workprints" are in no shape to strike a properly remastered (read: Anamorphic widescreen, 16:9) DVD. But this new-old scroll had to come from somewhere. In fact the footage found its way into the "Empire of Dreams" doc which was anamorphic.

Question for all us OUT purists: Would you be satisfied with the OUT remastered in anamorphic widescreen, but only on DVD? Of course, if the powers that be went to the trouble of striking a proper 16:9 transfer, how difficult would it be to slap that on a blu-ray. But given that Lucas' preferred versions are the versions du jour AND given that the last time the OUT was made available they were haphazardly slapped onto a "Bonus Features" DVD, how realistic is it to think that Lucas would go blu for the Classic Versions?

Discuss!

I always assumed the scroll seen in Empire of Dreams was recreated digitally specifically for the documentary.

[KubrickFan]

Originally Posted by Blu-man08

Well after a five day suspension for posting off-topic comments (apologies to mods), I'm back! Pity that Beast seems to have been suspended for a much longer period of time. His opinions are always interesting (even though he's out of his freaking mind... ) and the ensuing debates are most entertaining. But before I get off-topic yet again...

It's always been curious to me that the OUT DVD included the original 1977 scroll (No Episode IV A New Hope) despite Lucas' repeated claims that the "workprints" are in no shape to strike a properly remastered (read: Anamorphic widescreen, 16:9) DVD. But this new-old scroll had to come from somewhere. In fact the footage found its way into the "Empire of Dreams" doc which was anamorphic.

Question for all us OUT purists: Would you be satisfied with the OUT remastered in anamorphic widescreen, but only on DVD? Of course, if the powers that be went to the trouble of striking a proper 16:9 transfer, how difficult would it be to slap that on a blu-ray. But given that Lucas' preferred versions are the versions du jour AND given that the last time the OUT was made available they were haphazardly slapped onto a "Bonus Features" DVD, how realistic is it to think that Lucas would go blu for the Classic Versions?

Discuss!

I think the biggest priority is that the original versions need to be restored and preserved for future generations. Blu-rays would be nice, but if they're the same Laserdisc masters put onto a single disc (I actually can see Lucas do this), then it's obviously not worth it. The best scenario would be for George to come to his senses and release the original versions of all the movies he directed, but for some reason I think that hell will freeze over earlier than that. Lucas is a fine film preservationist, indeed.

[Blu-man08]

Originally Posted by Dotpattern

I always assumed the scroll seen in Empire of Dreams was recreated digitally specifically for the documentary.

Could be. The dirt and overall softness of the footage made me think it was original footage. You could be right. ILM can do some pretty spectacular stuff with them thar 'puters.

[shelldweller]

I think the basic problem is that some people want to belong to the group that have known and liked Star Wars from the beginning. By enhancing the effects and thereby making the sequels more accessible to new audiences, those conservative people suddenly don´t feel so special anymore since Star Wars is suddenly also liked by new people who haven´t known it since the beginning.
That´s actually the only reasonable explanation for the conservative and unreasonable attitude of these people who don´t understand that Star Wars is ultimately a six part Saga.

[kpkelley]

Originally Posted by shelldweller

I think the basic problem is that some people want to belong to the group that have known and liked Star Wars from the beginning. By enhancing the effects and thereby making the sequels more accessible to new audiences, those conservative people suddenly don´t feel so special anymore since Star Wars is suddenly also liked by new people who haven´t known it since the beginning.
That´s actually the only reasonable explanation for the conservative and unreasonable attitude of these people who don´t understand that Star Wars is ultimately a six part Saga.

Some people like Coca-Cola Classic, New Coke sux.

Just because something is newer, doesn't mean it's better. Newer special effects don't necessarily improve upon the original special effects. In fact they can often distract.

[horizonline]

Originally Posted by kpkelley

Some people like Coca-Cola Classic, New Coke sux.

Just because something is newer, doesn't mean it's better. Newer special effects don't necessarily improve upon the original special effects. In fact they can often distract.

So it does not catter to fans. Good.

[Cowboy]

Originally Posted by shelldweller

I think the basic problem is that some people want to belong to the group that have known and liked Star Wars from the beginning. By enhancing the effects and thereby making the sequels more accessible to new audiences, those conservative people suddenly don´t feel so special anymore since Star Wars is suddenly also liked by new people who haven´t known it since the beginning.
That´s actually the only reasonable explanation for the conservative and unreasonable attitude of these people who don´t understand that Star Wars is ultimately a six part Saga.

Umm some of us have been in the group since the begining. Some of us were actually in the theater in 1977 watching with amazment.

[Cowboy]

Originally Posted by shelldweller

This is just ridiculous! Are you actually saying that worse effects make the story better?

No what I am saying is that great effects dont make a story better.....

[Dynamo of Eternia]

Originally Posted by shelldweller

I think the basic problem is that some people want to belong to the group that have known and liked Star Wars from the beginning. By enhancing the effects and thereby making the sequels more accessible to new audiences, those conservative people suddenly don´t feel so special anymore since Star Wars is suddenly also liked by new people who haven´t known it since the beginning.
That´s actually the only reasonable explanation for the conservative and unreasonable attitude of these people who don´t understand that Star Wars is ultimately a six part Saga.

I think the issue isn't that people don't want newer generations to like the movies. It's that those people would prefer them to like the movies as they existed back at that time, and not need the new effects in order for them to appreciate these movies.

Your explanation here is actually not 'reasonable' at all.

[whbinder]

Originally Posted by shelldweller

This is just ridiculous! Are you actually saying that worse effects make the story better?

I don't believe that is what he is saying. I believe he is saying adding more special effects when the story does not call for them takes emphasis away from the story.

If Annie Hall had new Avatar level CGI explosions, I would find that takes emphasis away from the story.

If Lucas had simply improved some of the existing special effects, people may still prefer the original but I don't believe that would be taking away from the story.

For example. In Empire, Lucas fixed the transparency of the control panels. That did not distract me. It did not take emphasis away from the story in the same way Mos Eisley did.

That is simply my opinion. I don't begrudge you your opinion that the added effects did not distract you from the story.

[shelldweller]

Originally Posted by Cowboy

Umm some of us have been in the group since the begining. Some of us were actually in the theater in 1977 watching with amazment.

I don´t say you weren´t. I grew up on the Sequels and loved them. But I can also remember how amazed I was watching the Special Edition and the Prequels in theaters. Just amazing! Why can´t you see the six Movies as one Saga which will be completed as a whole. Besides I thought every change and enhancement made was very good. Jabba´s band could´t be done better but it was a vast improvement over the muppets. Just imagine the whole saga came out this year with the best possible Video, Audio and CGI-effects... what would be so bad about that?

For example... "Once upon a time in the West" is one of the best movies ever made in my opinion. The story would not be better if it was in black & white because color is so distracting.

The effects are just tools to tell the Story and that´s what Lucas does best.

[chip75]

Originally Posted by shelldweller

The effects are just tools to tell the Story and that´s what Lucas does best.

My head just exploded.... luckily the message from my brain to my fingertips was quick enough to type a response....

[KrugStillo]

Apparently there's a lot of debate here on Special Editions vs. Original Versions of Episodes 4-6 (I actually hate referring to them that way but I guess it's the easiest way to do it). Honestly I think what's being missed here is that regardless of how cool the movies are they are just science fiction adventures. I love them but I also have no alusions of them being the greatest films ever made or anything. That being said there is a certain charm to old school effects that is lost in the digital age. Rubber puppets looked cool, we all knew they were fake but they still looked great. Just how people watch Flash Gordon and stuff like that for the camp value of the sometimes cheesy effects, that's how we should view these movies. I think over the years these films have tried way too hard to be more than they were. That doesn't make them bad. I love Xanadu with Olivia Newton John because I grew up with it but I still wouldn't want to see an updated version because what I love about it is it brings me back to that era. Look at E.T. as fake as that puppet can look in the original version it's still better than any digital lifeless version. I fell in love E.T. the puppet and the story not whether he looked 100% authentic or not. Whatever that's my rant, I'll buy the blu-ray set for Star Wars and I will enjoy the movies and bonus material. I can't guarantee that I won't be seeing the original versions in my head when the changes come on. It really has nothing to do with digital vs. practical effects it has to do with taking something with a certain charm and blanding out for the masses. I don't think anyone would complain about these movies had they never been altered, people would just watch them and enjoy them for what they are, cool 70's and 80's sci-fi movies.

[jala12]

I think for the most part, the changes were a good thing. For comparisons, take a look at this site: http://www.dvdactive.com/editorial/a...-part-one.html

It begins with episode IV and at the end links you to the comparisons of the other two movies. It goes from the theatrical versions to the VHS special editions and then to the 2004 dvds. Makes me wonder even more what the blu-ray could be like...

[kpkelley]

Originally Posted by KrugStillo

Apparently there's a lot of debate here on Special Editions vs. Original Versions of Episodes 4-6 (I actually hate referring to them that way but I guess it's the easiest way to do it). Honestly I think what's being missed here is that regardless of how cool the movies are they are just science-fiction adventures. I love them but I also have no illusions of them being the greatest films ever made or anything.

I think you meant Oscar-winning science-fiction adventures.

[Beast]

Originally Posted by kpkelley

I think you meant Oscar-winning science-fiction adventures.

Winning an Oscar means very little in the longrun. A lot of terrible and forgotten films have won Oscars.

In the end they're still just fun popcorn films. Hell, even Lucas was surprised at the popularity of the films from the start.

[kpkelley]

Originally Posted by Beast

Winning an Oscar means very little in the longrun. A lot of terrible and forgotten films have won Oscars.

In the end they're still just fun popcorn films. Hell, even Lucas was surprised at the popularity of the films from the start.

My point was more that the original cuts/editions of these films are historic in the industry, regardless of one's opinion of the Oscars. Dismissing them as merely science-fiction adventures, is insulting to the Star Wars franchise as well as the genre of science-fiction adventures. Great movies can be great regardless of what genre they may happen to be classified under.

[Cowboy]

Originally Posted by shelldweller

I don´t say you weren´t. I grew up on the Sequels and loved them. But I can also remember how amazed I was watching the Special Edition and the Prequels in theaters. Just amazing! Why can´t you see the six Movies as one Saga which will be completed as a whole. Besides I thought every change and enhancement made was very good. Jabba´s band could´t be done better but it was a vast improvement over the muppets. Just imagine the whole saga came out this year with the best possible Video, Audio and CGI-effects... what would be so bad about that?

For example... "Once upon a time in the West" is one of the best movies ever made in my opinion. The story would not be better if it was in black & white because color is so distracting.

The effects are just tools to tell the Story and that´s what Lucas does best.

Hmmm...because of time my friend...because of time. 16 years is a long time between trilogies. Things have changed, times have changed, Lucas has changed, I have changed...blah blah blah...and then you expect them to be cohesive? And the only way to get them that way is change film history and change the originals to fit around the new films? As I said....16 years is your problem with these films.