Blu-rays are 8 years old and DVDs still cling to them like a cancerous tumor. Why?

[AnamorphicWidescreen]

IMHO, some of us on this thread may have tunnel vision when it comes to Blu; i.e., we're huge fans of the format and expect others to feel the same way - note that I'm very much including myself in this category.

That being said, there are still quite a few people out there who don't have Blu players; Hell, I know some relatives that just got a regular DVD player for the first time 2 years ago....

Also, note that sometimes it takes a long time for a technology to become mainstream. For example, I got my first regular DVD player in 2003, and at that point the technology was 6 years old - and, even at that time there were still quite a few people who hadn't made the transition from DVD to VHS.

Sure, the Blu format is now 8 years old but IMHO some people don't see the need to upgrade; they may have older TV sets (IMHO, your set would need to be both HD set & somewhat large to be able to appreciate the difference between DVD & Blu); they may not want to shell out more money for a Blu player; they also may feel that regular DVD's are good enough for them, etc..

And, you know - there are still some people out there that don't know that Blu players are backwards compatible with DVD's (i.e., they don't know you can play a regular DVD on a Blu player). Hard to believe for us, I know, but, again, if you're not an aficionado like we are you may not realize this...

[Scarface32]

Originally Posted by AnamorphicWidescreen

I know some relatives that just got a regular DVD player for the first time 2 years ago....

Odd they'd wait so long for an optical disc player, and they'd choose the DVD route.

Two years ago, I bought my parents their second Blu-ray Disc player, so they could have one upstairs and downstairs.

[rdodolak]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

Aliens also benefits hugely. The grain is a mess on the DVD, on Bluray it is handled much better and the picture is more organic.

It's not being dismissive of budgets, people can afford what they can afford. But let's call a spade a spade and not try to justify reasons why it is acceptable to watch a DVD when a bluray is available. If people can't afford it then they should just come out with the truth rather than making up false reasons such as 'no difference in quality' or 'it's the story that counts' (speaking in general not quoting anyone) We all know it's a lesser experience watching a muddy, soft picture compared to bluray.

It doesn't surprise me a bit as a lot of people, and probably some of the same people, said the same things about VHS when DVD first came out. Those of us that were early adopters enjoyed DVD during its heyday and have most likely moved on to Blu-ray where as the rest are just now supporting DVD, and now saying the same about Blu-ray, because they transitioned to it not that long ago and it's the cheaper version. If DVD were to disappear tomorrow those same people would migrate to Blu-ray without a fuss if it was the only available option.

[Blu-ray Neo]

Interesting debate so far...

<<Popping Pop Corn>>

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by rdodolak

It doesn't surprise me a bit as a lot of people, and probably some of the same people, said the same things about VHS when DVD first came out. Those of us that were early adopters enjoyed DVD during it's heyday and have most likely moved on to Blu-ray where as the rest are just now supporting DVD, and now saying the same about Blu-ray, because they transitioned to it not that long ago and it's the cheaper version. If DVD were to disappear tomorrow those same people would migrate to Blu-ray without a fuss if it was the only available option.

Agree.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Blu-ray Neo

Interesting debate so far...

<<Popping Pop Corn>>

That reminds me, someone was debating a point on the forum a while back and used the phrase "as sure as microwaves have a popcorn button" I'm envious! We don't have that on our microwaves in the Uk but I love popcorn lol!

[pentatonic]

Wow, this is like reliving 2007-2008

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by scorpiontail60

Blech....

Scorpion , get your tail in here and say something! Don’t let everyone else have all the fun. And have that belch checked, could be related to a GE junction tumor.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by pentatonic

Wow, this is like reliving 2007-2008

Earlier, give me a few moments to do some 2006 archival internet searching in other domains.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by scorpiontail60

...4K home video is almost here, Blu-ray is already beginning to feel obsolete...

You’re telling me…as well as 50 GB dual layer Blu-ray discs. Almost 8 years ago in 2006, I leaked the first BD50 title on another forum starting here…http://www.avsforum.com/t/708533/int...0#post_8183217 about 2 months before the official announcement…

http://www.prnewswire.com/news-relea...-56066012.html

Dual layer is starting to feel obsolete or else I’m getting long in the tooth with all this Blu-ray support over the years.

[coljohnmatrix]

Speaking as a former Blockbuster manager - DVD was an important stepping stone from VHS, but it is an awful format overall and there is no earthly reason why anyone shouldn't upgrade to blu-ray. It is no longer cost prohibitive and most blu-rays come with DVDs for just a few more dollars. If you can't afford a $40 blu-ray player, why are you buying physical media at all?? For God's sake, feed your children!

Blu-Ray is unquestionably a superior improvement in resolution and more importantly, reliability. DVD is at least partially responsible for the downfall of the videostore, in my opinion. We had to re-shape our entire business strategy around damaged discs. Kids movies? Forget it. Parents apparently couldn't be bothered to make sure their kids didn't use DVDs as toys, dinner plates or chew toys for their dog. If we got 20 copies of say, Wall-E, by the end of the first month, we'd lose 15-20% of those discs to damage. AT LEAST. Not light scratches - cracks, discs broken in half, deep scratches everywhere. And those are just ones we noticed. On average, 5-6 times per day customers would bring back damaged DVDs they rented and demand a refund. So they paid roughly $4 and had to make 2 trips to a store that could conceivably be 10-15 minutes away, just to rent a movie they couldn't watch, or got halfway through and had to stop and explain to their kids why they couldn't finish it. Yeah, what a wonderful technology and sustainable business model!

Our store adopted blu-ray about 2 years before I quit. Over the course of those 2 years, we lost exactly 1 blu-ray to damage. The customer accidentally ran it over with their car. But, people weren't willing to adopt it. Blu-ray users were a small fraction of our customer base. I have sold all of my DVDs, since even compressed Netflix looks better for most titles now. As soon as streaming can offer uncompressed 1080p video, lossless sound, and all commentary tracks and supplements for a comparable price, I will *maybe* consider dropping bluray. Until then, it remains the superior format available. DVD is a joke - a seriously flawed stepping stone to better formats, if anything.

[SammymeBlu]

Originally Posted by coljohnmatrix

Speaking as a former Blockbuster manager - DVD was an important stepping stone from VHS, but it is an awful format overall and there is no earthly reason why anyone shouldn't upgrade to blu-ray. It is no longer cost prohibitive and most blu-rays come with DVDs for just a few more dollars. If you can't afford a $40 blu-ray player, why are you buying physical media at all?? For God's sake, feed your children!

Blu-Ray is unquestionably a superior improvement in resolution and more importantly, reliability. DVD is at least partially responsible for the downfall of the videostore, in my opinion. We had to re-shape our entire business strategy around damaged discs. Kids movies? Forget it. Parents apparently couldn't be bothered to make sure their kids didn't use DVDs as toys, dinner plates or chew toys for their dog. If we got 20 copies of say, Wall-E, by the end of the first month, we'd lose 15-20% of those discs to damage. AT LEAST. Not light scratches - cracks, discs broken in half, deep scratches everywhere. And those are just ones we noticed. On average, 5-6 times per day customers would bring back damaged DVDs they rented and demand a refund. So they paid roughly $4 and had to make 2 trips to a store that could conceivably be 10-15 minutes away, just to rent a movie they couldn't watch, or got halfway through and had to stop and explain to their kids why they couldn't finish it. Yeah, what a wonderful technology and sustainable business model!

Our store adopted blu-ray about 2 years before I quit. Over the course of those 2 years, we lost exactly 1 blu-ray to damage. The customer accidentally ran it over with their car. But, people weren't willing to adopt it. Blu-ray users were a small fraction of our customer base. I have sold all of my DVDs, since even compressed Netflix looks better for most titles now. As soon as streaming can offer uncompressed 1080p video, lossless sound, and all commentary tracks and supplements for a comparable price, I will *maybe* consider dropping bluray. Until then, it remains the superior format available. DVD is a joke - a seriously flawed stepping stone to better formats, if anything.

I have to disagree with your last comment about streaming,i would never drop a physical format for a streaming/digital one and i highly doubt we will see streaming 1080p,lossless and all the features you ask for that are already on a Bluray for along,long time if any,there is not enough demand and like many have said before,most people do not care about picture and sound,you would also have to have a extremely expensive broadband /fiber optic connection for those to stream all that which most cities are lucky to have a 12 megabit line,the U.S. ranks 35th in worldwide internet speed which is sad so i doubt we will see full HD streaming,maybe in limited areas but who can afford a 100 megabit+ line.

I personally do not see 4k making mainstream on the masses,we should be able to tell judging by the amount of U.S. homes that own a Bluray player and sales compared to DVD after 8 years now.Even if they decide to let DVD go when 4K is released than DVD owner's will have no choice but to convert to Bluray,they will not goto 4K because of price,simple economics.Bluray will be here i say for at least 10 more years.

I am not dissing 4K,heck i would have it when the prices are low but do you think most catalog titles will be worth upgrading again to 4K? newer release for sure but it would not be with my time to watch 4k content on nothing less than a 75' + screen and that will not happen for me for a very,very long time.


.

[coljohnmatrix]

Originally Posted by SammymeBlu

I have to disagree with your last comment about streaming,i would never drop a physical format for a streaming/digital one and i highly doubt we will see streaming 1080p,lossless and all the features you ask for that are already on a Bluray for along,long time if any,there is not enough demand and like many have said before,most people do not care about picture and sound,you would also have to have a extremely expensive broadband /fiber optic connection for those to stream all that which most cities are lucky to have a 12 megabit line,the U.S. ranks 35th in worldwide internet speed which is sad so i doubt we will see full HD streaming,maybe in limited areas but who can afford a 100 megabit+ line.

I personally do not see 4k making mainstream on the masses,we should be able to tell judging by the amount of U.S. homes that own a Bluray player and sales compared to DVD after 8 years now.Even if they decide to let DVD go when 4K is released than DVD owner's will have no choice but to convert to Bluray,they will not goto 4K because of price,simple economics.Bluray will be here i say for at least 10 more years.

I am not dissing 4K,heck i would have it when the prices are low but do you think most catalog titles will be worth upgrading again to 4K? newer release for sure but it would not be with my time to watch 4k content on nothing less than a 75' + screen and that will not happen for me for a very,very long time.


.

That was kind of my point. Streaming will take years if not decades to reach the quality of bluray, if ever. I find it pretty unlikely it will ever get there. But there will probably always be a customer base who wants the best - and right now that's bluray. I don't see it going anywhere for quite a while. Call me when 4k TVs and projectors aren't cost prohibitive, and there is actual 4k content to be had, apart from a few demo discs. We are years away from a 4k setup being plausible for your average videophile, much less your average consumer.

[Krelldog1977]

Originally Posted by SammymeBlu

I have to disagree with your last comment about streaming,i would never drop a physical format for a streaming/digital one and i highly doubt we will see streaming 1080p,lossless and all the features you ask for that are already on a Bluray for along,long time if any,there is not enough demand and like many have said before,most people do not care about picture and sound,you would also have to have a extremely expensive broadband /fiber optic connection for those to stream all that which most cities are lucky to have a 12 megabit line,the U.S. ranks 35th in worldwide internet speed which is sad so i doubt we will see full HD streaming,maybe in limited areas but who can afford a 100 megabit+ line.

I personally do not see 4k making mainstream on the masses,we should be able to tell judging by the amount of U.S. homes that own a Bluray player and sales compared to DVD after 8 years now.Even if they decide to let DVD go when 4K is released than DVD owner's will have no choice but to convert to Bluray,they will not goto 4K because of price,simple economics.Bluray will be here i say for at least 10 more years.

I am not dissing 4K,heck i would have it when the prices are low but do you think most catalog titles will be worth upgrading again to 4K? newer release for sure but it would not be with my time to watch 4k content on nothing less than a 75' + screen and that will not happen for me for a very,very long time.


.

I think Blu-ray will be here for quite some time...hopefully more than 10 years.

If 4k becomes a viable option in the near future, it will still retain the exact same audio quality as we currently have on Blu-ray( DTS-MA). IF that is true then 4k will be a failure. ( to audiophiles )

Why upgrade if the only advantage is picture quality? 1080p is fine for me....and most people on this site. Unless of course you have a pricey projector with a 100" screen. ( which most people do not have )

4k will most likely follow the same path as laserdisc players....but who knows.

[Funcha]

Originally Posted by Krelldog1977

I think Blu-ray will be here for quite some time...hopefully more than 10 years.



If 4k becomes a viable option in the near future, it will still retain the exact same audio quality as we currently have on Blu-ray( DTS-MA). IF that is true then 4k will be a failure. ( to audiophiles )



Why upgrade if the only advantage is picture quality? 1080p is fine for me....and most people on this site. Unless of course you have a pricey projector with a 100" screen. ( which most people do not have )



4k will most likely follow the same path as laserdisc players....but who knows.

So if 4K releases have DTS-MA, the format will be a failure to audiophiles? Explain please.

[Tekka]

Originally Posted by Funcha

So if 4K releases have DTS-MA, the format will be a failure to audiophiles? Explain please.

Lossless audio is about perfect. The only real area of improvement is to go for even higher sampling rates like what was done for the Akira bluray. The 192khz/24 bit audio is nuts, its bit rate is actually higher than the video bitrate.

[bruceames]

Originally Posted by coljohnmatrix

DVD is a joke - a seriously flawed stepping stone to better formats, if anything.

And yet after all these years it remains the format of choice for most consumers. It must be doing something right.

[bruceames]

Originally Posted by Krelldog1977

I think Blu-ray will be here for quite some time...hopefully more than 10 years.

Blu-ray will certainly be around for more than 10 years down the road. So will DVD. Both formats actually complement one another and have their strengths.

[coljohnmatrix]

Originally Posted by bruceames.

And yet after all these years it remains the format of choice for most consumers. It must be doing something right.

Most consumers aren't tech savvy enough to understand how to do things like upgrade the firmware to their blu-ray player, or even know what firmware is.

They just want to pop in a movie and watch it. They don't care about AV quality or blu-ray live or lossless audio or special features. When I worked at Blockbuster, I had numerous customers who were renting PS3 games ask for a blu-ray player recommendation, and I had to explain to them that they already had one. See also: people not understanding that blu-ray players play DVDs, not understanding that they won't get 1080p picture on an old CRT television, not understanding that HDMI sends video and audio, etc. etc.

I understand consumer ignorance towards new technology, but reading is easy and information is free.

DVD pales in every measurable way to blu-ray in quality and reliability,but it's cheaper and simpler (its ONLY positives). Why do you think people spend $100s of extra dollars on poorly-integrated SMART tvs instead of hooking up a $49 Roku?

[Chiefy]

I for one like having a DVD and UV/iTunes packaged with my Blu-rays. If a family member or friend wants to borrow a movie, I can lend them the DVD and keep my Blu-ray from being damaged or lost. Most of them have not yet gone the Blu-ray route anyways. As for digital copies, I like them for what they are; convenience for when traveling. Do I want them to replace physical media? No way. I just recently started adding to my UV collection. It came in quite handy when I visited family over the holidays. The quality can be damned fine if you have a fast enough connection. I guess based on someone's reply earlier that stated the average US internet speed as 12mbps; mine being at 30mbps, it must make just enough of a difference.

As history has shown again and again, studios are in the business of making money by reselling the same content, repackaged, remastered, etc., etc. They benefit from making formats obsolete, then reselling the same stuff to you and me. REPEAT, REPEAT, etc. Do I believe UV will be around for ever? Not a chance. The studios will at some point no longer support it, and will move onto something else, much like Microsoft no longer will support Windows XP. "We no longer will be supporting Ultraviolet, but will instead be moving to a new and more exciting format.....blah, blah, blah.

The one thing I have trouble with is double, triple or quadruple dipping for movies I own or have owned. I'm sure we've all "upgraded" some DVD's on Blu-ray, watched them, and thought to ourselves, "that looks the same as the DVD or only marginally better". "What the hell was I thinking"? I have a great deal of movies I'd love to upgrade from DVD, but I also need to balance the cost/benefit to doing so. How often am I seriously going to watch it for it to be worth it? I still have number of DVD's I bought years ago that are still unopened. After what point is it nothing other than just hoarding? Enough is enough.