Parasite 4K UHD (2019) February 27th, 2020

[Klaustrofobia]

Originally Posted by FragnitoM

There is no region locking for UHD anywhere, so I don’t think this has anything to do with there being no UHD yet. For them I think it’s all about the bottom line and the logistics of releasing a third format type alongside dvd/bluray

That is what Dubstar points out as the problem, Criterion have to region lock everything they release on DVD and BluRay and if they where to release a UHD they can not lock it.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by Dubstar

as well as the Soderberg mention that "Sex, Lies and Videotape' had a HDR pass/grading , me thinks it all boils down to the fact UHD's are region free and I think Criterion has to region lock their titles to region A or they break other territorial exclusivities - this sounds like the obvious reason, but I have no idea why Jon Mulvaney just doesn't clear the air and explain this as a reason.

Yes but why then are other indie labels having to region lock their BDs as per the licensing agreement yet can put a region free UHD inside the same package? This happened with Kino's Hannibal and is happening with Turbine's version of Crash in Germany. Turbine even said that they tried to get around it for the BD but nope, they have to lock it to B. So how come the exact same rights holder - I mean the people who own the content, not the label releasing it - is dead set on locking one version but is happy to let another region free version out there? I aksed this same question in the Crash thread but I don't think turbine understood what I was talking about, either that or they're not allowed to say.

Makes no sense to me, so when people assume that the region coding is the issue with Criterion then I don't think it's a problem at all because it's not their decision to make. And they don't region lock as a matter of course, as proved by their BD of Roma. Yes, Netflix have the rights the world over so producing a 'one size' Criterion disc makes sense, unlike with all these other smaller films where the rights are scattered to the wind, but again that comes back down to my first question as to why X version is locked as per a legally binding contractual agreement while under that same agreement an inherently region free version is also included.

[Liersi]

The only obvious reason I can think of is a relatively more limited user base for UHD compared to BD. Isn't this kind of thing usually done to split markets and multiply licensees? Guess there's no market worth splitting for UHD when you factor in what all of us enthusiasts here are talking about: subtitles. Just make them leave off the subtitles, it's like a soft region lock. Much less hassle.

[FragnitoM]

Originally Posted by Klaustrofobia

That is what Dubstar points out as the problem, Criterion have to region lock everything they release on DVD and BluRay and if they where to release a UHD they can not lock it.

But with UHD they don’t. It’s just speculation. Shout and KINOs Blu-ray’s are region locked but their UHDs are not. Why are people assuming Criterion is the only boutique label that would be forced to lock UHDs?

[Doctorossi]

Originally Posted by FragnitoM

Why are people assuming Criterion is the only boutique label that would be forced to lock UHDs?

People are assuming it means they can't release them. Criterion can't be forced to lock UHDs because UHDs can't be locked.

[Geoff D]

But it's not Criterion's decision to lock them, it's entirely down to what the rights holders specify and if they're offering up UHD rights like candy - as KLI said about MGM flaunting their wares to Kino - then UHD's inherent region freedom is implicit to those rights being offered in the first place.

I dunno, maybe there's a kind of "all bets are off" approach when it comes to the UHD, that because it inherently sidesteps the question of region coding then the pre-existing covenants that the rights holders have with their global partners to lock Blus and protect local markets are also sidestepped. And Liersi is spot on about language support or the lack thereof acting as a 'soft' region lock anyway, I've thought the same thing before.

[FragnitoM]

Originally Posted by Doctorossi

People are assuming it means they can't release them. Criterion can't be forced to lock UHDs because UHDs can't be locked.

Again, other labels have released UHD so the logic that this is why Criterion hasn’t released Uhd doesn’t make sense

[Doctorossi]

Originally Posted by FragnitoM

Again, other labels have released UHD so the logic that this is why Criterion hasn’t released Uhd doesn’t make sense

… though it could very well be that it was an option for those other distributors' titles, but it wasn't for the specific titles we've speculated about Criterion releasing.

[apollo828]

Originally Posted by FragnitoM

Again, other labels have released UHD so the logic that this is why Criterion hasn’t released Uhd doesn’t make sense

Criterion is full of luddites, straight up. As others have pointed out, it took them ~1 1/2 years after DVDs came out in the US to put out DVDs (and another year, IIRC, before they stopped recycling masters and started creating proper anamorphic masters, with the lame excuse that anamorphic masters wouldn't look good on 4x3 TVs), and ~2 1/2 years before they started putting out Blu-Rays. We're now at four years, with nothing to show other than a very vague (AFAIK) rumor or two. They know what they're doing. They simply don't think the 4K market is worth their while.

I will grant them that, for whatever reasons, they did fund at least some of the work required to get the x264 video encoder certified for Blu-Ray releases. (Why they did this instead of using another package, I'll never know.) Still, they just aren't cutting-edge techies. Unless a director they care about forces them to get on the boat (possibly Wong Kar-Wai, if the rumors are true), I'm starting to wonder if they'll ever bother with 4K releases. Maybe they'll finally hop on board when the PS5 comes out??? If not, well, they've made their decision. I could deal with high-bitrate downloads if they were offered, but as is, I think a majority of their fans are content with subpar releases (including Blus), and they don't feel the need to improve. Very sad.

(Regarding fans, go on YouTube and watch Amoeba Records's "What in My Bag?" series. There are several musicians and filmmakers who show up there. Sometimes, they'll buy Criterion stuff. A shocking number of them pick up DVDs. If the damn filmmakers are happy with DVDs, 4K owners are doomed.)

Getting back on track, yay German release! Looking forward to seeing how it stacks up against the French release, which I must say sets the bar pretty damn high.

[Doctorossi]

Originally Posted by apollo828

Criterion is full of luddites, straight up.

Every time I remind myself of this reality, I just think about the past... long before DVD... when Criterion not only weren't luddites, they were just about the only ones on the forefront. What a frustrating fall.

BTW, please don't get my hopes up about a UHD Wong Kar-Wai box set; my heart can't take it.

[Geoff D]

Yep, and from listening to Lee Kline - Criterion's main technical guy - say in a podcast that he thinks that 4K is only worth it for people using projektors and implying that HDR is something that most filmmakers don't give a damn about, or at least the kind of filmmaker circles that Criterion move in (which is most probably true, occasional techy Soderbergh type aside), then I think they feel it's this esoteric format that simply isn't worth the time and expense of bothering with. And I reckon Arrow feel much the same way.

[ZombAid]

Originally Posted by apollo828

Criterion is full of luddites, straight up. As others have pointed out, it took them ~1 1/2 years after DVDs came out in the US to put out DVDs (and another year, IIRC, before they stopped recycling masters and started creating proper anamorphic masters, with the lame excuse that anamorphic masters wouldn't look good on 4x3 TVs), and ~2 1/2 years before they started putting out Blu-Rays. We're now at four years, with nothing to show other than a very vague (AFAIK) rumor or two. They know what they're doing. They simply don't think the 4K market is worth their while.

I will grant them that, for whatever reasons, they did fund at least some of the work required to get the x264 video encoder certified for Blu-Ray releases. (Why they did this instead of using another package, I'll never know.) Still, they just aren't cutting-edge techies. Unless a director they care about forces them to get on the boat (possibly Wong Kar-Wai, if the rumors are true), I'm starting to wonder if they'll ever bother with 4K releases. Maybe they'll finally hop on board when the PS5 comes out??? If not, well, they've made their decision. I could deal with high-bitrate downloads if they were offered, but as is, I think a majority of their fans are content with subpar releases (including Blus), and they don't feel the need to improve. Very sad.

(Regarding fans, go on YouTube and watch Amoeba Records's "What in My Bag?" series. There are several musicians and filmmakers who show up there. Sometimes, they'll buy Criterion stuff. A shocking number of them pick up DVDs. If the damn filmmakers are happy with DVDs, 4K owners are doomed.)

Getting back on track, yay German release! Looking forward to seeing how it stacks up against the French release, which I must say sets the bar pretty damn high.

According to first reviews it seems to be a dud.
No Atmos, No HDR and all on a BD-66...
https://blu-ray-rezensionen.net/para...ngling-4k-uhd/

[BigNickUK]

Originally Posted by ZombAid

According to first reviews it seems to be a dud.
No Atmos, No HDR and all on a BD-66...
https://blu-ray-rezensionen.net/para...ngling-4k-uhd/

Erm nope:

"The UHD provides absolute reference values in terms of fine lines, subtleties in fonts and representation of details on faces and hair. In addition, the grain is visibly finer, which in sum is quieter and even quieter. Due to the approximately 2/3 higher data rate compared to the Blu-ray, this quality is permanently maintained.
At the moment, this is the level by which other films have to be measured in terms of resolution. The rating is correspondingly high. The fact that HDR and extended color space are not on board does NOT flow into the evaluation at this point"

No HDR does not make a bad 4K disc

[ZombAid]

Originally Posted by BigNickUK

Erm nope:

"The UHD provides absolute reference values in terms of fine lines, subtleties in fonts and representation of details on faces and hair. In addition, the grain is visibly finer, which in sum is quieter and even quieter. Due to the approximately 2/3 higher data rate compared to the Blu-ray, this quality is permanently maintained.
At the moment, this is the level by which other films have to be measured in terms of resolution. The rating is correspondingly high. The fact that HDR and extended color space are not on board does NOT flow into the evaluation at this point"

No HDR does not make a bad 4K disc

But no Atmos for the Original Language is a big faux pas.

[andreasy969]

Originally Posted by BigNickUK

No HDR does not make a bad 4K disc

It makes it false advertising at any rate. And in the comments it says that Capelight (in a first response) appear to be confused about the lack of HDR themselves.

I have the German steel pre-ordered, which also clearly states HDR on the cover, so this might become interesting. Good thing is, I still have time till April to figure out WTF is going on with this release.

EDIT: Maybe it's just a setup problem. Midsommar just came to my mind, where some guy just didn't get the HDR passed to his TV.

[FragnitoM]

Originally Posted by BigNickUK

Erm nope:

"The UHD provides absolute reference values in terms of fine lines, subtleties in fonts and representation of details on faces and hair. In addition, the grain is visibly finer, which in sum is quieter and even quieter. Due to the approximately 2/3 higher data rate compared to the Blu-ray, this quality is permanently maintained.
At the moment, this is the level by which other films have to be measured in terms of resolution. The rating is correspondingly high. The fact that HDR and extended color space are not on board does NOT flow into the evaluation at this point"

No HDR does not make a bad 4K disc

To be honest HDR is not the selling point of UHD for me. For me it’s more about minimizing compression/higher data rate. If say Criterion releases UHD with no HDR, I would be totally fine with that

[bytor]

Originally Posted by BigNickUK

No HDR does not make a bad 4K disc

It does when the digital and French release DO have it.

[nekromantik]

has Criterion said they wont be releasing it in UHD?

[Mobe1969]

Originally Posted by apollo828

Yeah, Criterion waited ~18 months to put out their first DVD (and about another 12 more months before they took advantage of anamorphic masters), and ~24 months for their first Blu. It's been ~36 months and still no signs of UHDs, other than a vague rumor about possible Wong Kar-Wai UHDs at some point. They may very well put out UHDs eventually. I'm just not going to wait for them to get around to it, if they ever do.

Stuff them. All their failure to adopt means to me is whenever now see a critereon release announcement I don't even bother reading it.

If it wasn't for Lionsgate, we probably wouldn't see anything non blockbuster released...

[andreasy969]

SDR has been confirmed by others as well now, but it's an error and there will be a replacement:

https://www.facebook.com/capelightpi...57230565688020