Why nobody can equal the Pioneer Elite KURO plasmas yet?

[oppopioneer]

Nicolidakies, if you find a Kuro it will be anywhere from $6000 to $11,000. Is it really worth it? That's your call. I would first focus on your budget and what you can afford, if you're financially set and easily affording your mortgage, health insurance, all other bills easily then good luck finding one.

What I would do if I was you is buy a cheaper tv, you can get a 60" plasma or led/lcd now for under $1000 or a 50" or smaller for even cheaper at any one of the stores, enjoy it and wait for the newer tv's to come out, just be patient.

Last December I had to spend a lot for my Pioneer Elite Kuro PRO-151FD, it was sort of hard to find, they were sold out nation wide, and the one I did find was a open box that was around 2 weeks old, the previous owner bought it, had it installed, he went out of town so it didn't get much use, only a few days worth, he and his wife were very sensitive to the plasma "buzz" so they told the store to take it back, they delivered it to my house.

We are very fortunate we found it and have it and hopefully it lasts many many years with no problems.

Do what's best for you and your family.

Merry Christmas everyone and Happy Safe Holidays everyone

[Nicolidakies]

I'm finding a few over here for 2.500€ (about 2.700 Us Dollars). Are there so many different models Kuro? I know the sensible thing to do is what you posted but it's hard for a perfectionist like me to settle for less. Anyway,i'll see what comes up.. Happy holidays

[wafi]

Originally Posted by Nicolidakies

I'm finding a few over here for 2.500€ (about 2.700 Us Dollars). Are there so many different models Kuro? I know the sensible thing to do is what you posted but it's hard for a perfectionist like me to settle for less. Anyway,i'll see what comes up.. Happy holidays

Nico, $2700 is a steal as long as its a gen 9 model. I say go for it! Do you know the model #? My money is on the fact that we will not see anything like the Kuros for another 2-3 years. And if you are anything like me second best will never ever do!

[saprano]

For me, its not just about matching the kuro. I want to see a TV that surpasses it 10x over. If panny has kuro performance in 2011 thats not going to make me want to replace my TV for something similar. Makes no sense.

0 black, improved gamma, color, grayscale, motion resolution, 24p output(can that even be improved further?) ect. These things and more is what i want to see panasonic have before i even think about buying another TV.

Still, i cant wait to see what panny has for us in january .

[wafi]

Originally Posted by saprano

For me, its not just about matching the kuro. I want to see a TV that surpasses it 10x over. If panny has kuro performance in 2011 thats not going to make me want to replace my TV for something similar. Makes no sense.

0 black, improved gamma, color, grayscale, motion resolution, 24p output(can that even be improved further?) ect. These things and more is what i want to see panasonic have before i even think about buying another TV.

Still, i cant wait to see what panny has for us in january .

I know what you mean, but lets have em match the many splendored thing we call Kuro before they surpass em. I foresee the former happening sooner than the latter. I for one, am in no rush to upgrade!

[lghaze42]

Originally Posted by Nicolidakies

I guess this belongs here. Didn't know where to ask and don't wanna make a new topic about it. I've been in the market for a plasma television since half a year now. After joining here and another forum,I decided to go with the Panasonic 50G20 (which I returned after 2 days). I was warned about the floating blacks and this would be the only issue for me so I decided to check for myself what the fuss was about. The fact I saw them was reason enough to return it because i'm very sensitive to these things. The black level itself was also not what I expected. The fact a guy I know suddenly told me he owned a Kuro and let me watch some bd content on it didn't help either to say the least. I just couldn't live with the fact I was spending 1500€ (about 1700 us dollars) on a tv that wasn't even close to equaling/surpassing a product that was available years ago. Reading about Panasonic maybe equaling the Kuro's in the future made me decide to eventually wait for this to happen or find myself a Kuro. Is it advised to buy a 2nd hand tv? I'm really not sure. I'm kinda lost now. I need a tv as fast as possible but with the way things looking (Nobody knowing for sure if Panasonic is working on implementing the Kuro tech) i really don't know what to do,what to buy.. What are my alternatives? Buy something cheaper for now and maybe take the deep plunge when Panasonic is spot on? I really want a plasma so the choices are pretty minimal. Any advice would be much appreciated :-).

Panasonic will equal or better the Kuro.The thing is they will do it a little at a time to make people keep upgrading to new Tv.It's all bout the money.

[js666]

Originally Posted by lghaze42

Panasonic will equal or better the Kuro.

Sure, eventually.

[saprano]

Originally Posted by wafi

I know what you mean, but lets have em match the many splendored thing we call Kuro before they surpass em. I foresee the former happening sooner than the latter. I for one, am in no rush to upgrade!

I also would like a better design. The current VT25 looks like shat. But word is panasonic changed the look of their whole line so thats good news.

Hopefully is a simple rectangular design.

Yeah i won't be upgrading anytime soon either, but i just want the future to look good for my purchasing desitions.

Originally Posted by lghaze42

Panasonic will equal or better the Kuro.The thing is they will do it a little at a time to make people keep upgrading to new Tv.It's all bout the money.

All manufacturers will eventually better the kuro. Even vizio.

Might take vizio longer than the rest though .

[Nicolidakies]

It's nice to hear those things but so frustrating that all of whom commented already have their own little bundle of joy and are in no hurry for obvious reasons .J/k,hehe. Anyway if it's that certain that Panasonic or whoever will equal or surpass them one day then i have no ambition to buy something used right now for that money. I guess i'll just have the patience and buy something cheaper for now..

[saprano]

Hey if you can find a good deal on a 9G model i would buy it. Don't over pay for it though.

If not then yes you should wait till 2011 for the new panasonics.

[Nicolidakies]

I guess the best thing to do is just wait. A used item is always tricky to buy. If i know for a fact that they will equal the kuro's i have no problem at all waiting. But since opinions are divided on this matter,i'm not sure. To me the most logic thing is that technology has to push forward. As it does with everything else. Why would the plasma game not keep up?

[lghaze42]

Originally Posted by saprano

I also would like a better design. The current VT25 looks like shat. But word is panasonic changed the look of their whole line so thats good news.

Hopefully is a simple rectangular design.

Yeah i won't be upgrading anytime soon either, but i just want the future to look good for my purchasing desitions.



All manufacturers will eventually better the kuro. Even vizio.

Might take vizio longer than the rest though .

If the best tv of 2010(as picked by cnet) looks like shat then what does Sony,Samsung,and LG look like....what is worse than shat?

[ZoetMB]

Originally Posted by Nicolidakies

I guess the best thing to do is just wait. A used item is always tricky to buy. If i know for a fact that they will equal the kuro's i have no problem at all waiting. But since opinions are divided on this matter,i'm not sure. To me the most logic thing is that technology has to push forward. As it does with everything else. Why would the plasma game not keep up?

Some people have predicted that the 2011 Pannys will only incorporate minor upgrades to the 2010 line. But even if they're substantially better, I don't think anyone believes that they will match the Kuro line anytime in the next few years. I used to think this was b.s. and that once they understood the design via the Kuro engineers they hired, they would simply do some new IC fabrication and incorporate the technology, but what I missed was that there was substantial engineering and expensive manufacturing of the Kuro screens themselves (the details of which are posted on the web somewhere). That's what made them so expensive to manufacture.

The fact is that quality doesn't always win. FM radio had better quality than AM radio, but it didn't start to win until the FCC (in 1966) forbid stations in large cities from simulcasting their AM on FM. Reel-to-reel tape was far better than cassettes. For awhile, 8-tracks actually outsold cassettes even though it was terrible technology. Betamax had better quality, but VHS won because Sony wouldn't license Beta to other manufacturers. High resolution audio formats (SACD and DVD-A) have failed completely. CDs are now failing in favor of digital downloads, almost all of which have inferior compressed audio format.

Sony's XBR-8 line, with the tri-illuminous back lighting, was also a far superior set, but Sony hasn't used the technology since.

Most people care primarily about the price. Most people are not willing to pay the price for advanced and superior technology. The Kuro line was very expensive and Pioneer is a mass-market manufacturer as is Panasonic. That's why Pioneer got out of the business.

So will sets improve each year? For the most part, yes. Will Panny (or Sony for that matter) match Kuro quality in 2011 or even 2012? No way. But will the new Panny be a very good set with a really good picture? Most likely, since the 2010 TC-PnnVT25 is already a set with a great picture (once calibrated).

[saprano]

Originally Posted by lghaze42

If the best tv of 2010(as picked by cnet) looks like shat then what does Sony,Samsung,and LG look like....what is worse than shat?

Im talking about the look of the TV, not the PQ.

And since you mentioned those others, they all look better than panasonics ugly design. No fancy stupid shape for the bezel and stand.

[saprano]

Originally Posted by ZoetMB

Some people have predicted that the 2011 Pannys will only incorporate minor upgrades to the 2010 line. But even if they're substantially better, I don't think anyone believes that they will match the Kuro line anytime in the next few years. I used to think this was b.s. and that once they understood the design via the Kuro engineers they hired, they would simply do some new IC fabrication and incorporate the technology, but what I missed was that there was substantial engineering and expensive manufacturing of the Kuro screens themselves (the details of which are posted on the web somewhere). That's what made them so expensive to manufacture.

The fact is that quality doesn't always win. FM radio had better quality than AM radio, but it didn't start to win until the FCC (in 1966) forbid stations in large cities from simulcasting their AM on FM. Reel-to-reel tape was far better than cassettes. For awhile, 8-tracks actually outsold cassettes even though it was terrible technology. Betamax had better quality, but VHS won because Sony wouldn't license Beta to other manufacturers. High resolution audio formats (SACD and DVD-A) have failed completely. CDs are now failing in favor of digital downloads, almost all of which have inferior compressed audio format.

Sony's XBR-8 line, with the tri-illuminous back lighting, was also a far superior set, but Sony hasn't used the technology since.

Most people care primarily about the price. Most people are not willing to pay the price for advanced and superior technology. The Kuro line was very expensive and Pioneer is a mass-market manufacturer as is Panasonic. That's why Pioneer got out of the business.

So will sets improve each year? For the most part, yes. Will Panny (or Sony for that matter) match Kuro quality in 2011 or even 2012? No way. But will the new Panny be a very good set with a really good picture? Most likely, since the 2010 TC-PnnVT25 is already a set with a great picture (once calibrated).

This is true for every form of entertainment medium. Mass market always wins. Be it movies, games, music, ect. It's all the same. Quality stuff, as you said, harldy succeeds.

The people that don't care about HQ stuff outnumbers the people that do (me, you).

[Nicolidakies]

This was the model i'm talking about..

Pioneer KURO Plasma PDP-LX5090

Build date is January 2009. Still has guarantee up till January 2012.
Comes with DIVWVK sidespeakers,and wall mounting..The guy wants roughly 2500€ for it. About 2700 Us Dollars. The thing the tv has been used almost 2 years concerns me though. He said he only ''watched'' tv in the evening but is there any way to see exactly how many playing hours it has? What would be another thing to take into consideration?

[ZoetMB]

Originally Posted by Nicolidakies

This was the model i'm talking about..

Pioneer KURO Plasma PDP-LX5090

The guy wants roughly 2500€ for it. About 2700 Us Dollars.

That's actually about USD $3850.

[Nicolidakies]

I was just in a local media store on the hunt for another tv and my girlfriend flat out screams through the entire compartment. " They have a kuro''.. I couldn't believe it and went for a closer inspection. They have a PDP-LX5090 for the price of 1500€ (which is 1900 Us Dollars). It's the very last one.I was almost handing over the cash but then i slightly hesitated because it was a floor model. It is supposed to be from 2008 but the guy could not tell me how many hours it has performed there. He said not so many but is there any way for me too find out? Through the service menu or something? I know i'm not buying an entirely new set but if it lasts me for a coupe of years untill the plasma game is spot on,I would definately buy it. What do you guys think? Isn't 1900 Dollars with 5 year full guarantee and speaker set of choice a steal? Help me out because i'm afraid someone will beat me to it..

[ZoetMB]

Once again, you're calculating GBP to USD incorrectly.
1 GBP = USD$1.54.
1 $USD = .65 GBP

[Nicolidakies]

GBP stand for Great Britain Pound. I'm from Belgium (Euro currency),so in my book my calculation serves me correct .. Anyway,besides from the fact you're so concerned with the financial side of things. What am I looking at here regarding the Kuro?