Blu-rays are 8 years old and DVDs still cling to them like a cancerous tumor. Why?

[growler]

I see many ads for watching movies on one TV, pausing & resuming on either a different (smaller) TV or on a tablet or on a phone. Much of the digital copy info promotes watching movies on phones or tablets. Many people (when they NEED a new TV) buy HDTVs now (since that is virtually all that is available) yet, have absolutely no HD content, they still watch SDTV programming. People often watch incorrect aspect ratios, edited for TV films, chopped up or Stretch-O-Vision if they have a 16x9 TV. Also, many people do not understand that they can play their existing DVDs on a BD player. Many people watch TVs at too far a distance for BD vs. DVD to be quite as impressive. Many use the crap TV speakers/amps or if they get external speakers, buy a cheap home theater in a box or a cheap sound bar. It is not merely lack of money, it is ignorance about what is possible with PQ/AQ with a better setup. Oh, what percent make any attempt to calibrate their new HDTV picture?

So given the above, why would the average person care about BD vs DVD? Even with DVD quality, who wants to watch a film on their phone? And those that do, do not care at all about PQ/AQ.

How many people, decades ago, never set up their VCRs to record? They had a VCR yet, watched TV live & sat through commercials despite actually owning the technology to allow then to time shift, archive programs & skip commercials.

With prices dropping each year hopefully, BD will continue to grow in popularity.

[mredman]

Well Hunger Games catching fire sold and impressive 3.9 million units in its first week of release. Incredibly strong sales for Game of Thrones S3 and Thor 2. Then there is the juggernaut Frozen it sells like hot cakes and Breaking all kind of records. In its first day it sold 3.2 million units. Keep in mind these sales are only for US sales. Then add the sales in foreign countries to. Physical Media incl Blu Ray is stronger than ever. And these juggernaut numbers for these popular titles proves that and all of them sold more units in blu ray than DVD in their first release week.

Just wait for Cap 2 to come out i bet everyone want to own that movie on blu ray

[Steedeel]

Why doesn't everyone on this forum with a Facebook account make a note on their profile page stating that DVDs play in bluray players! . Would be a start.

[Steel Panther]

I get your complaint about the aspect ratio, calibration, etc... that bugs me to no end.

You can feel free to get off your audio high horse and crying because people don't spend $3000 on a sound system to make you happy. I have a "cheap crappy sound bar" because a) I live in an apartment b) I don't have $3000 to piss away on a sound system I can't fully use in said apartment. c) nothing pisses me off more here, than *******s blaring subwoofers as they think they're entitled to it, as they own them.

[wormraper]

Many of us DID use our ht systems in an apt. I used full Polk towers and bookshelf surrounds with TWIN SVS sub's. Many of us do. Heck tomcat has FOUR DVS sub's in his apt. You don't have to blast everything to get good sound.

Just because you don't have the money or inclination to get one doesn't mean we shouldn't be concerned about it. Were enthusiasts and the elite for a reason

[Cevolution]

Originally Posted by Steel Panther

I get your complaint about the aspect ratio, calibration, etc... that bugs me to no end.

You can feel free to get off your audio high horse and crying because people don't spend $3000 on a sound system to make you happy. I have a "cheap crappy sound bar" because a) I live in an apartment b) I don't have $3000 to piss away on a sound system I can't fully use in said apartment. c) nothing pisses me off more here, than *******s blaring subwoofers as they think they're entitled to it, as they own them.

The masses usually purchase cheaper poor quality sound systems including subwoofers, so if you have a high end audio system you will likely have the best in the building, and believe me then you don't have to worry about this. If someone is listening to something loud where it bothers me, I just turn my system on for a couple minutes, and play it louder than theirs, and they turn theirs off pretty quick. Best way to get peace and quiet I guarantee it.

Originally Posted by wormraper

Many of us DID use our ht systems in an apt. I used full Polk towers and bookshelf surrounds with TWIN SVS sub's. Many of us do. Heck tomcat has FOUR DVS sub's in his apt. You don't have to blast everything to get good sound.

Just because you don't have the money or inclination to get one doesn't mean we shouldn't be concerned about it. Were enthusiasts and the elite for a reason

+1

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Cevolution

The masses usually purchase cheaper poor quality sound systems including subwoofers, so if you have a high end audio system you will likely have the best in the building, and believe me then you don't have to worry about this. If someone is listening to something loud where it bothers me, I just turn my system on for a couple minutes, and play it louder than theirs, and they turn theirs off pretty quick. Best way to get peace and quiet I guarantee it.



+1

Where's the fun in 'the masses' that's what I always say. Life's too short to be a sheep.

[HD Goofnut]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

Where's the fun in 'the masses' that's what I always say. Life's too short to be a sheep.

+1. I'm probably only person on my street with a lossless 7.1 system. Stinks for the masses doesn't it?

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by HD Goofnut

+1. I'm probably only person on my street with a lossless 7.1 system. Stinks for the masses doesn't it?

It certainly does. I never got the whole 'blend in' thing. I'm told its human nature so I must be a alien!

[Steel Panther]

Originally Posted by wormraper

Many of us DID use our ht systems in an apt. I used full Polk towers and bookshelf surrounds with TWIN SVS sub's. Many of us do. Heck tomcat has FOUR DVS sub's in his apt. You don't have to blast everything to get good sound.

Just because you don't have the money or inclination to get one doesn't mean we shouldn't be concerned about it. Were enthusiasts and the elite for a reason

I've never heard a radio, stereo, music or anything in this apartment... it's always bass like I'm at a rave or some shit. You should come show people how to set their shit up. If I had the cash, I'd get better than a soundbar, but wouldn't use the subwoofer, as I don't currently, mine's sitting packed away.

IF I were to use it, it wouldn't be until I got an auralex pad.

[wormraper]

Originally Posted by Steel Panther

I've never heard a radio, stereo, music or anything in this apartment... it's always bass like I'm at a rave or some shit. You should come show people how to set their shit up. If I had the cash, I'd get better than a soundbar, but wouldn't use the subwoofer, as I don't currently, mine's sitting packed away.

IF I were to use it, it wouldn't be until I got an auralex pad.

lol, yeah, it's usually that stupid punk who wants to break 140 db's with midbass

subdudes and auralex type pads do wonders as well. don't even have to buy them.. making them is easy with some wood and and foam and carpet

[growler]

Originally Posted by Steel Panther

You can feel free to get off your audio high horse and crying because people don't spend $3000 on a sound system to make you happy. I have a "cheap crappy sound bar" because a) I live in an apartment b) I don't have $3000 to piss away on a sound system I can't fully use in said apartment.

I tried to be clear, many people have junk sound NOT due to lack of $$$, rather due to ignorance. It just is not important to them & they have no idea that sound contributes to the enjoyment of film. For example I know some who have decent stereo systems but, they don't even hook those speakers & amp up to their new 50" LCD! Instead, they use the crap amp & speakers inside the TV with 10% THD!

My main message was that one reason BD has not taken off as rapidly as DVD, is that many people are ignorant of many aspects of the HD/BD experience & don't care to learn about it.

[AnamorphicWidescreen]

Originally Posted by Whiplash27

It's all about money IMO. DVDs are just cheaper.

I personally wait until movies drop to $10 or less before I pull the trigger except on rare occasions (Disney movies, new movies, etc). If your average blu ray movie was $5-10 each, it would sell much better. To me buying a new movie for more than $15 is crazy. Also, buying a movie that came out 30 years ago for more than $10 is insanity.

Well, Blu's used to be a LOT more expensive then they are now. In fact, I specifically waited until Blu's went down in price before I got my first Blu player about 1 1/2 years ago. I then went out and promptly bought The Crow for $8 at Target (on sale, of course). Since then, I've found some great prices on Blu, though they're sometimes few & far between; I got Jackie Brown & Ronin for $5 each on Blu @ Wal-mart about a year ago...

Typically these days, I don't see Blu's (at least films on Blu) that much more than regular DVD's....

What's interesting is how much I have also changed as a consumer due to these better prices; back in the height of my DVD collecting, I remember buying both Casino Royal & The Departed on DVD for about $15-20 each...these days, paying $20 for a regular Blu would be stretching it for me...

[ZoetMB]

Originally Posted by eiknarf

oh man.
jeez. so even though bluray disc sales are up, it was still a down year?

Especially for large publicly-traded companies, business doesn't just have to be up. It has to be up higher than Wall Street's expectations or the stock price falls. The primary mandate for any CEO today (whether one believes it should be or not) is to "increase shareholder value."

Given the choice to invest in two different areas of the business, a company like Sony is going to choose the one with the highest upside potential. And unfortunately, Blu-ray no longer looks like it's going to be it. There are many reasons for this, including, but not limited to, a poor economy; a lack of understanding of the benefits of Blu-ray; a trend, especially for younger people towards watching media on small, portable screens; a lack of caring about PQ and AQ; ever increasing time spent on non-theatrical media, such as YouTube and the like; the decline of physical retail; alternative ways to view media (streaming, VOD, etc.); the fact that with short theatrical windows, so many retreads and very low prices, movies don't have the cultural cache they once had, as well as many other factors.

Through 4/19 in the U.S. (cumulatively for the calendar year), Blu-ray is up 5.84% in units but only 1.66% in dollars. Last year at the same time, BD was up 24.88% in dollars. While it's natural for the rate of growth to decline as a business matures, this is too big a falloff.

I've been heavily criticized in the past for stating that Blu-ray had to grow quickly or the studios would lose interest. More recently, I get criticized because people who love Blu-ray don't want to hear any bad news. But the facts are the facts and the numbers are the numbers. I might love my vinyl record collection, but the reality is that in spite of all the hype, vinyl is less than 2% of the recorded music market and I recognize that.

There is an advantage to the masses not adopting Blu-ray: in most cases, when the masses go for something, it means it's trash. Not everyone drives a BMW or Mercedes.

It's not that they're going to stop making Blu-rays. It's that we'll see less of an investment in catalog material, restorations, extras, special features and deluxe packaging. They'll continue to put out the big movie hits just as the record labels still release all the big artists on CD, even though the music business is less than half of its 1999 peak. Sony's announcement was to the Street. They're basically issuing a warning saying, "don't expect any more big growth in Blu-ray."
If it turns out that there is growth (with a great holiday season, say) that Wall Street wasn't expecting, that can up the stock price of companies in the business. So Sony's announcement is just a bit of a game that may not actually mean much. Last year, they announced they were seriously considering getting out of the consumer TV business, but that didn't happen either.

[eiknarf]

Originally Posted by ZoetMB

Especially for large publicly-traded companies, business doesn't just have to be up. It has to be up higher than Wall Street's expectations or the stock price falls. The primary mandate for any CEO today (whether one believes it should be or not) is to "increase shareholder value."

Given the choice to invest in two different areas of the business, a company like Sony is going to choose the one with the highest upside potential. And unfortunately, Blu-ray no longer looks like it's going to be it. There are many reasons for this, including, but not limited to, a poor economy; a lack of understanding of the benefits of Blu-ray; a trend, especially for younger people towards watching media on small, portable screens; a lack of caring about PQ and AQ; ever increasing time spent on non-theatrical media, such as YouTube and the like; the decline of physical retail; alternative ways to view media (streaming, VOD, etc.); the fact that with short theatrical windows, so many retreads and very low prices, movies don't have the cultural cache they once had, as well as many other factors.

Through 4/19 in the U.S. (cumulatively for the calendar year), Blu-ray is up 5.84% in units but only 1.66% in dollars. Last year at the same time, BD was up 24.88% in dollars. While it's natural for the rate of growth to decline as a business matures, this is too big a falloff.

I've been heavily criticized in the past for stating that Blu-ray had to grow quickly or the studios would lose interest. More recently, I get criticized because people who love Blu-ray don't want to hear any bad news. But the facts are the facts and the numbers are the numbers. I might love my vinyl record collection, but the reality is that in spite of all the hype, vinyl is less than 2% of the recorded music market and I recognize that.

There is an advantage to the masses not adopting Blu-ray: in most cases, when the masses go for something, it means it's trash. Not everyone drives a BMW or Mercedes.

It's not that they're going to stop making Blu-rays. It's that we'll see less of an investment in catalog material, restorations, extras, special features and deluxe packaging. They'll continue to put out the big movie hits just as the record labels still release all the big artists on CD, even though the music business is less than half of its 1999 peak. Sony's announcement was to the Street. They're basically issuing a warning saying, "don't expect any more big growth in Blu-ray."
If it turns out that there is growth (with a great holiday season, say) that Wall Street wasn't expecting, that can up the stock price of companies in the business. So Sony's announcement is just a bit of a game that may not actually mean much. Last year, they announced they were seriously considering getting out of the consumer TV business, but that didn't happen either.

Pretty excellent-ly written.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by eiknarf

Pretty excellent-ly written.

Why is it? It's just speculation for the most part. As for the bluray sales figures, it's incredible that bluray is up YOY considering the bad start it had this year. All the blockbusters have started to rear their heads and the figures are starting to improve. In my opinion, Zoetmb has been a bit too ready to offer negatives even when bluray has shown record weeks and very encouraging sales figures. It's almost as if bluray can't do anything right in his eyes!

[eiknarf]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

Why is it? It's just speculation for the most part. As for the bluray sales figures, it's incredible that bluray is up YOY considering the bad start it had this year. All the blockbusters have started to rear their heads and the figures are starting to improve. In my opinion, Zoetmb has been a bit too ready to offer negatives even when bluray has shown record weeks and very encouraging sales figures. It's almost as if bluray can't do anything right in his eyes!

I mean, Zoetmb wrote it very clearly, and didn't post a surface opinion. He wrote reasons for everything he said. In other words, Zoet backed up what he thought with data.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by eiknarf

I mean, Zoetmb wrote it very clearly, and didn't post a surface opinion. He wrote reasons for everything he said. In other words, Zoet backed up what he thought with data.

Data that completely ignores the lack of blockbusters in Q1 of this year. As soon as the likes of Frozen and Hunger games came along, bluray hit it out of the park.

[Hypnosifl]

Originally Posted by ZoetMB

It's not that they're going to stop making Blu-rays. It's that we'll see less of an investment in catalog material, restorations, extras, special features and deluxe packaging.

Hopefully even if you're right about this, they'll still invest a reasonable amount in restoring catalog titles for the sake of cable and streaming, even if the other stuff falls by the wayside for most titles. I don't know what the financial arguments for and against releasing a blu ray would be if they already have a high-definition master, but even if there's not so much incentive with niche titles now, couldn't that change if blu ray print-on-demand technology gets cheaper?

[Blu-Dog]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

Data that completely ignores the lack of blockbusters in Q1 of this year. As soon as the likes of Frozen and Hunger games came along, bluray hit it out of the park.

That's not an indicator. You mentioned the two large successes so far this year, and both are for the younger demographic that isn't the same one that buys players, televisions, or are calling out for the movie in Blu, 4K, or anything else.

The problem is demographics. The content producers either have to have big sales across the spectrum of the full consumer base, or more very large sales within a specific demographic, week after week. Two hits don't make a trend, and we didn't see a trend with those two films.

They need more content, and since they've decided to make that seasonal (summer and the holiday season), there will be huge peaks and valleys. "Hit it out of the park" doesn't win the game. It has to be more steady, or the nervous types will be sweating for at least half of every year.