Blood And Black Lace (1964) (VCI Entertainment) - October 23, 2018

[hanshotfirst1138]

What happened with Hellraiser 3?

[DR Herbert West]

Originally Posted by hanshotfirst1138

What happened with Hellraiser 3?

The entire film is horribly misframed on the Arrow release.

[Albie989]

Originally Posted by DR Herbert West

The entire film is horribly misframed on the Arrow release.

Well, it looks like Arrow also scanned the area covered by the soundtrack, thus the off-center framing as seen on caps-a-holic.

[Keyser Soze.]

Well this thread was an interesting read.

Looks like I'll have to keep an eye out for reviews of this disc once it drops.

[whysleep]

Apparently, unlike the initially released specs suggested, Studiocanal's release uses Arrow's master, maintaining the 1.66:1 aspect ratio. It looks like VCI will be our only hope for a proper 1.85:1 release, somehow it has come to this...

[NLScavenger]

Looks like a review is imminent; a score of 3.5/5 has been added to the entry.

[NLScavenger]

Originally Posted by NLScavenger

Looks like a review is imminent; a score of 3.5/5 has been added to the entry.

Review is up: https://www.blu-ray.com/movies/Blood...207308/#Review

[JohnCarpenterFan]

Hell, I'll still take this over the Arrow. Arrow could have corrected this themselves but they didn't, or even better, they could have consulted someone such as Bob Furmanek for guidance so we wouldn't be forced to settle for this just to see Bava's proper compositions in the first place.

Will definitely be buyibg this disc, it may be technically inferior when it comes to clarity, detail and the like but I bet it'll be a lot less distracting than looking at Arrow's bastardized cropjob.

[DR Herbert West]

Originally Posted by JohnCarpenterFan

Hell, I'll still take this over the Arrow.

Ditto.

[Brian81]

I'll likely still pick it up for the different aspect ratio, but what a blown opportunity.


It's still a better presentation of 1.85:1 than the DVDs. Hopefully not too ugly in motion. Hope it just looks "soft" and not "smeary".



Outside of Dark Night of the Scarecrow, has VCI done anything right on BD?

[Brian81]

Was Furmanek involved in production of this film? Lucas has been known for a long time as an expert on Bava. Arrow consulted him, and it was probably a mistake in this case.


Wasn't this one shown in both ratios theatrically? Europe the Arrow ratio due to older screens in place in most cases? Whereas in North America screens were generally the wider ratio?

[PowellPressburger]

Image quality on the VCI looks drab. Doffering aspect ratios or not the Arrow looks incredible.

The only reason to buy the VCI is for the Kat Ellinger commentary.
I love her commentaries. And for the other commentary but hers is the reason I will buy it at a price drop or wait till the used copies start floating about.

[JohnCarpenterFan]

Originally Posted by PowellPressburger

Image quality on the VCI looks drab. Doffering aspect ratios or not the Arrow looks incredible.

The only reason to buy the VCI is for the Kat Ellinger commentary.
I love her commentaries. And for the other commentary but hers is the reason I will buy it at a price drop or wait till the used copies start floating about.

So preserving logos that appear before and after the film begins is important but preserving the original ratio and compositions which affects the whole film is no big deal?

[PowellPressburger]

Originally Posted by JohnCarpenterFan

So preserving logos that appear before and after the film begins is important but preserving the original ratio and compositions which affects the whole film is no big deal?

It is but each release has it's own issue.

You either get gorgeous color/ transfer with the bad aspect ratio or you get the correct aspect ratio with the blah color .... less be honest did anyone actually think a VCI blu-ray transfer would be an ARROW

There is no perfect option but as far as how much better the image is the winner is ARROW.

[whysleep]

Originally Posted by PowellPressburger

It is but each release has it's own issue.

You either get gorgeous color/ transfer with the bad aspect ratio or you get the correct aspect ratio with the blah color .... less be honest did anyone actually think a VCI blu-ray transfer would be an ARROW

There is no perfect option but as far as how much better the image is the winner is ARROW.

I agree. Inferior PQ was to be expected from VCI, but I'd accept the idea of it being a small price to pay for the proper aspect ratio. The lack of Italian audio however seals it for me.

[JohnCarpenterFan]

Furmanek wasn't involved in the film's production, he just has a lot of worldwide aspect ratio documentation.

If you look at his research you'll see that 1.66:1 was never really a common ratio, even in Europe. Also people who know more about the technical specifications of the film have confirmed that it played in 1.85 in Europe too.

Clearly no legitimate research was performed before Arrow decided on going with 1.66:1. Not only that but a 1.66 crop of the 1.85 framing which shows a complete misunderstanding of proper framing on Arrow's part.

[Ruined]

Originally Posted by JohnCarpenterFan

Fu If you look at his research you'll see that 1.66:1 was never really a common ratio, even in Europe. Also people who know more about the technical specifications of the film have confirmed that it played in 1.85 in Europe too.

Clearly no legitimate research was performed before Arrow decided on going with 1.66:1. Not only that but a 1.66 crop of the 1.85 framing which shows a complete misunderstanding of proper framing on Arrow's part.

ACKTUALLY

In the early 60s there were films that were shown in in 1.66:1 in Europe and 1.85:1 in the USA - but often they were shot primarily with 1.85:1 in mind since more money was to be made in the US market at the time. An example of this is CITY OF THE DEAD (HORROR HOTEL) - which Arrow also framed at 1.66:1 and VCI framed at 1.78:1 (looks better with the tighter matte IMO). City of the Dead has been restored in both 1.66:1 and 1.85:1, with the euro companies doing 1.66:1 and US companies doing 1.85:1.

Maybe this is a case of Arrow trying to be accurate to Euro at the time as Arrow did with City of the Dead even though both appear significantly inferior to the US 1.85:1 framing?

[DJR662]

Shame about the aspect ratio but apart from that, I think the Arrow looks great though.

Do they still have the rights to it? And did they ever give an explanation as to why theirs was framed differently?

[ravenus]

Originally Posted by DJR662

And did they ever give an explanation as to why theirs was framed differently?

From what I recall they consulted Bava expert Tim Lucas who advised them to adopt 1.66:1 as the preferred ratio. What I don't understand is why the 1.66:1 ratio is a crop of the wider ratio instead of having more vertical area.

[cakefactory]

Well, color me surprised. This doesn’t look like a disaster. If the Arrow didn’t exist, it looks like I’d be fairly content with it. Nothing special, but at least on par with that Bird with the Crystal Plumage disc.

It’s too bad the screenshots are all dull scenes. I’m curious what it looks like in the scenes with all the colored lighting.