The how to guide to getting banned at Amazon

[rdodolak]

Alright, almost everyone is chomping at the bit to know what you need to do to get a lifetime ban from Amazon. Well now you know.

http://www.msn.com/en-us/money/compa...cid=spartanntp

Originally Posted by MarketWatch

By Barbara Kollmeyer

Want to get banned from shopping at Amazon? Do this

Making a habit of returning unwanted items to Amazon.com appears to have a hidden cost: a lifetime ban.

Case in point: Greg Nelson, who returned 37 items and apparently found himself barred from shopping at Amazon, according to an article published Friday in the Guardian. The computer programmer, described in the Guardian story as a “self-confessed Amazon addict,” said he has bought 343 items in total.

Nelson reportedly maintained that the items he returned were faulty or damaged or fell short of their descriptions but said Amazon hasn’t given him a chance to explain. He said he was told he has lost his unspent gift-card balance, as it cannot be transferred.

“I could understand if there were evidence that I had somehow tried to abuse the system, but I haven’t,” Nelson told the newspaper, adding that he’s been a loyal customer of Amazon’s since 2002.

In a form letter, Amazon refused to reopen his account. In a statement to MarketWatch, the company said: “In a tiny fraction of cases we are forced to close accounts where we identify extreme account abuse. This decision is only taken after we have reviewed the account carefully and tried to work with the customer over an extended time period to resolve any issues.”

What’s the policy on returns?

As the Guardian pointed out, nowhere in Amazon’s return policy does it speak of the risk that a customer might be blacklisted for initiating too many returns. There is an entire section on returns and refunds, how to do them, returning gifts and return policies under every category of goods that Amazon offers. The Guardian said Amazon refused to divulge how many returns get a customer banned.

Personal-finance news site MoneyTalksNews referenced Amazon’s apparently unspoken policy of banning repeat returners in a February 2015 article, and it mentioned other retailers that track returns to determine whether individuals are abusing their return policies. Such tracking was also addressed in an article in DailyTech in 2013.

But retailers have also their share of complaints about the money drain that can result from customers who overuse return policies. According to a survey by IHL Group in May 2015, retailers worldwide lose around $1.75 trillion annually from the cost of items that are overstocked or out of stock and from what they referred to as “needless returns.” The survey said those three factors can mean up to 1.7% in lost revenue for the majority of retailers.

Outdoor-sports-gear maker REI Inc. reined in its no-questions-asked returns policy in 2013, allowing returns for items only within a year of purchase. REI said it had had problems with large numbers of returns from a “small group of members,” according to The Wall Street Journal, which cited one customer who returned a backpack he had bought in 2004 because “it was getting old and dirty and I didn’t like it anymore.”

The Guardian said that it had heard from more than 200 readers in response to its Amazon story and that in some cases a high return rate doesn’t appear to have affected shoppers’ access to the website. A reader identified as OldJacobi said returning 10 out of 139 items — a return rate of just over 7%, compared with Nelson’s reported 11% — hasn’t earned a ban.

Bans on repeat returners, though, appear to be anything but a new development. Google “Amazon ban” and plenty of discussions and individual cases appear, dating as far back as 2008, detailed on such sites as MacRumors.

Tuan Do, the founder and chief executive officer of technology news website TechWalls, shared his experience of a temporary ban from Amazon in a post on Monday. He said he received a warning letter after returning two or three items over a two-month span: “We’re writing to apologize for the number of issues you’ve experienced with your shipments. Your correspondences with us indicate you’ve required refunds on a majority of orders for a number of reasons,” said the letter.

In an update, Do said his account and that of his wife was subsequently canceled after she returned a bicycle purchased in her account.

“All open orders were canceled, I just could access digital content purchased in the account. I had over $100 in my gift card balance and Amazon agreed to send me the refund, I received a check in my mailbox after 1 week,” wrote Do, who calculated that his rate of return for Amazon is about 17% — ordering 104 items and returning 18.

Ultimately, he said, the account was reopened after he sent a letter to an Amazon account specialist pleading his case. Several readers responded with “banned” stories of their own, along with some sellers who complained of the difficulty of dealing with repeat returners.

[Groot]

I buy hundreds of items online and rarely, if ever, return anything. There has to be more to it, either electronic purchases which lower value or they are buying and returning expensively shipped items.

In all my 13 years of using Amazon regularly I have returned two items, one arrived broke and the other was the wrong item.

[AgentOrange]

Originally Posted by Groot

I buy hundreds of items online and rarely, if ever, return anything. There has to be more to it, either electronic purchases which lower value or they are buying and returning expensively shipped items.

In all my 13 years of using Amazon regularly I have returned two items, one arrived broke and the other was the wrong item.

It probably depends, somewhat, on what type of items you buy.

I've used Amazon to order hundred (perhaps thousands) of "media items" over the years (going back to books, CD's, DVD's, and now mostly blu-rays). I have never had to request a single return for one of those. I had a couple digibooks that were dinged slightly, but I didn't even bother returning since they were very low priced. I did once have a blu-ray that was stuck "in limbo" for weeks in the shipping system. I finally had to contact them, they sent me a replacement, and oddly when that happened the other one finally moved in the system and got "returned". I have no idea if that counts as a "return" or not, but it doesn't really matter in my case.

HOWEVER, as many successes as I've had for buying media items on Amazon, I've found them mixed at best for purchasing anything else. I once tried ordering a fan from them. They sent it in the retail box with no other packaging or protection. Top was smashed and broken. I ordered a Microsoft Wireless Mouse. Arrived D.O.A (replacement worked fine, maybe a faulty transmitter). Ordered a Salad Spinner, again... smashed to bits. $100 Bose headphones, earpiece broken.

I honestly have no idea how a person can have a high return rate for physical media. BUT as less and less people buy physical media and instead buy other electronic/household goods, I could see it being more of an issue. I've still only had a handful of returns, but it's a far more noticable % if I'm just looking at my non-media purchases.

[Strapped4Cash]

Originally Posted by AgentOrange

I honestly have no idea how a person can have a high return rate for physical media.

My return (really exchange) rate isn't too high, but I've seen all kinds of crazy stuff, and sometimes it seems to happen all at once. Where I've gone for months and dozens of orders where everything's fine and then bad luck/fraudulent advertising occurs.

- Like an order being completely lost by the carrier undelivered and never being heard from again.
- A brand new dvd sold by Amazon with no shrink of any kind, the cardboard (snapcase?) packaging looks like it was dragged across gravel and the disc inside looking almost as bad.
- A "Brand new factory sealed" dvd sold by a marketplace person with no shrink or cellophane of any sort and the security stickers slashed.
- Another "Brand new factory sealed" dvd sold by a different market seller where the cellophane was sliced from top to bottom, the booklet inside heavily thumbed through, and lots of scratches and thumbprints on the disc itself.
- A book order where significant water damage occurred and not only the ink from the cover ran, but the book warped and curled and part of it looked more than anything like a gnarled tree.
- Another 3rd party seller sent a book very lovingly packaged against water damage, with several layers of tissue paper too, but with no support and the poor book looked like it was beat to hell.

I don't even try to return stuff that is somewhat suspicious, like I recently ordered a Blu-ray from a market seller who sent the Canadian version instead of the U.S. one I ordered, which was in shrinkwrap with a weird sort of texture, and then a few suspicious looking fibers on the disc itself. But I definitely wanted an exchange/return on the stuff I listed above.

[Groot]

Originally Posted by AgentOrange

It probably depends, somewhat, on what type of items you buy.

I've used Amazon to order hundred (perhaps thousands) of "media items" over the years (going back to books, CD's, DVD's, and now mostly blu-rays). I have never had to request a single return for one of those. I had a couple digibooks that were dinged slightly, but I didn't even bother returning since they were very low priced. I did once have a blu-ray that was stuck "in limbo" for weeks in the shipping system. I finally had to contact them, they sent me a replacement, and oddly when that happened the other one finally moved in the system and got "returned". I have no idea if that counts as a "return" or not, but it doesn't really matter in my case.

HOWEVER, as many successes as I've had for buying media items on Amazon, I've found them mixed at best for purchasing anything else. I once tried ordering a fan from them. They sent it in the retail box with no other packaging or protection. Top was smashed and broken. I ordered a Microsoft Wireless Mouse. Arrived D.O.A (replacement worked fine, maybe a faulty transmitter). Ordered a Salad Spinner, again... smashed to bits. $100 Bose headphones, earpiece broken.

I honestly have no idea how a person can have a high return rate for physical media. BUT as less and less people buy physical media and instead buy other electronic/household goods, I could see it being more of an issue. I've still only had a handful of returns, but it's a far more noticable % if I'm just looking at my non-media purchases.

Absolutely.

I buy mostly: Movies, Books, Pencils, Office Supplies, Action Figures and Funko Products from them.

I have bought: TV's, gaming systems, video games, vacuum cleaner, speakers, heat press, blanks for work, sports equipment etc.

I've still lucked out and managed to only return/exchange a low number of times after being on there for more than a decade.

In general I have a low return/exchange rate anywhere.

[Hellhound]

Amazon's service used to be great, but I admit it's becoming worse and worse all the time. Nobody there seems to give a damn about packaging things so they don't get damaged anymore. I also tend to mostly avoid third party sellers now even if it's fulfilled by Amazon because the descriptions of most such items seem to be overly generous or flat out wrong.

It seems like there must be more to this guy's story than just returning stuff. He must have done the majority of the returns within a short span of time or something and I find it hard to believe he didn't get any warning before the ban.

[Abby is Q]

After my issues with Amazon last evening and for the past few months, it's painfully clear that Amazon has abhorrent customer service or, at best, customer service unlike any major retailer in history. The motto "the customer is always right" is replaced with "our system shows you're full of s***." Even if the system they have in place were actually at fault, it's then left to up to the consumer to prove their case.

I wonder if Amazon's policy on multiple returns/lifetime bans is considered when dealing with clothing purchases. It's nearly impossible to get sizing right (especially when some vendors aren't clear that items are made in China with insanely different sizing) and returns are inevitable.

I understand the other side of the argument too. I worked in retail and I remember we accepted a return on a kitchen utensil that clearly had food on it. I went to my managers and said, "Really? We accept this?" Some customers do in fact take advantage of return policies. But none of this excuses bad customer service. You have to come up with solutions to keep customers happy and returning while not violating policy. Lifetime bans basically shows how petty and pathetic Amazon is as a retailer. They have complete disregard for their customers and value absolutely no one.

I'm not completely anti-Amazon, but mostly because there are no other viable options. They do have some very good qualities (prices, selection, and convenience), but the way they deal with customers is almost disgusting. If a true online competitor ever rises, Amazon will learn how much of a mistake it is to piss off customers.

[neoz]

Yeah just saw that on my feed as well.

http://www.newser.com/story/222323/b...m_campaign=syn

[evoll]

I am about done with amazon also, I dropped prime a month ago but needed to order a blender from them and it said 4 days to get it it. I waited a week and no package yet so I called them since it showed they had them in stock and it they said they would look into it. Another couple of days go by so I hit the cancel button in my orders and then I get a email that said it could not be canceled since they was shipping it that day. So after a week and a half and trying to cancel the order they decide to ship it??

[Strapped4Cash]

There was a story about this on my local news too, KTLA Channel 5 in the Los Angeles area.

I don't doubt the story, and there's some good info there, but I do wish that there was more than one example. Also, was he strictly returning, or doing exchanges too? I would expect more understanding if someone's just exchanging, and have done a fair number myself, but never any returns.

[InuYashaCrusade]

I've been ordering from Amazon since 2010 and I've only had to return 1 order off the top of my head. Despite how bad their packaging is normally, I somehow get lucky.

[Nuck Horris]

I've returned quite a lot of items... I have a lot of bad luck with used stuff. Just this week I got a DVD listed as like new by Amazon Warehouse and they send me an ex-rental with typical damage, no chapter menu, and stickers.

I had to look at this year so far:

DVD had water damage - partial refund
Ordered a 3 Season package, only got one - returned for refund
Ordered a DVD from Germany and it was missing the slipcase (which I asked if it had before they shipped it) and artwork was peeling off the DVD all over inside the case - refund after a months wait
Ordered 1 box set and they mail me 2 of them the same week on different days... - returned one for a refund

I guess that's it for this year...so far.

That being said, they have thrown a lot of free money at me over the years and let me keep some items that were not as described. Most of the problems come from third party sellers but Amazon is still no saint.

[Abby is Q]

Originally Posted by Nuck Horris

I've returned quite a lot of items... I have a lot of bad luck with used stuff. Just this week I got a DVD listed as like new by Amazon Warehouse and they send me an ex-rental with typical damage, no chapter menu, and stickers.

I had to look at this year so far:

DVD had water damage - partial refund
Ordered a 3 Season package, only got one - returned for refund
Ordered a DVD from Germany and it was missing the slipcase (which I asked if it had before they shipped it) and artwork was peeling off the DVD all over inside the case - refund after a months wait
Ordered 1 box set and they mail me 2 of them the same week on different days... - returned one for a refund

I guess that's it for this year...so far.

That being said, they have thrown a lot of free money at me over the years and let me keep some items that were not as described. Most of the problems come from third party sellers but Amazon is still no saint.

This sort of thing has happened to me too. I ordered a blu-ray that was supposed to be brand new and it was clearly a pre-owned, repackaged. They just refunded without having to return. I was actually happy with their customer service, but I've since learned that that was more of an anomaly. However, in that instance I emailed them and normally I do direct chat. So maybe email is the way to go when dealing with Amazon.

[rdodolak]

Originally Posted by Nuck Horris

I've returned quite a lot of items... I have a lot of bad luck with used stuff. Just this week I got a DVD listed as like new by Amazon Warehouse and they send me an ex-rental with typical damage, no chapter menu, and stickers.

Amazon Warehouse item aren't necessarily new (retail) items though and are made up of the following ...

warehouse-damaged, returned, open-box, and pre-owned items.

[Kellz]

37 damaged slipcovers? that's crazy

[strumdogg]

Originally Posted by Kellz

37 damaged slipcovers? that's crazy

But seriously, I order around once-a-week from Amazon. Only a few times have I had to *exchange* stuff for legitimate damage, and it's always been a breeze.

This last month* , however, I've had to *exchange* two separate items from two separate orders, but it still went fine. No harm done.


The key is distinguishing between return and *exchange*...If you're exchanging due to damage, I'd assume they'd be more accepting than for credit returns.


* Amazon has started to use USPS more and more, and what do you know? Two of my packages came damaged. My packages always used to come via UPS, and I rarely had a problem. My last three packages came via UPS, and there wasn't a single ding in the bunch!

I hope Amazon learns, and goes back to UPS for Prime customers.



(Not mine)

[ArmyOfDarknessAW]

Some people have different standards to what the buy. I personally think I've returned 2 items to Amazon over the past 10 years and that was because they were actually broken. The people that have the constant issues should just shop at a brick and mortar store so they can see the item before they buy it.

[spiritfox]

I love Amazon and had zero problems in the 16 or so years I've been a customer. I have bought hundreds of items and returned maybe 3 or 4. Prime shipping never fails to impress me. I can't believe I am somehow so much luckier than the rest of amazons customers. [emoji849]