Helldivers 2

[Nunab18]

So, I haven't seen anyone talking about Helldivers 2, but I've been having a BLAST. Don't get me wrong, it's got the typical launch period matchmaking issues, but man... as a Starship Troopers fan This game has serious long term potential as well. This dev stuck with Helldivers 1 for a long time.

If you want to add me and play some time, feel free.

PSN - SanjuroSniper

[NARMAK]

I saw a review up on Eurogamer and it does look like it would make for a great four man co-op gaming experience or teamed up with random people as long as they don't constantly kill you with the friendly fire lol.

[Nunab18]

Originally Posted by NARMAK

I saw a review up on Eurogamer and it does look like it would make for a great four man co-op gaming experience or teamed up with random people as long as they don't constantly kill you with the friendly fire lol.

Lol, friendly fire definitely happens, but respawning is pretty quick and painless. Plus you can smash big enemies with your landing pod if aim carefully

[LIONSFAN20]

I AM LOVING THIS GAME!! I even double dipped and got it on pc, but it does NOT have cross progression. BOO!!!

[Steelmaker]

Surprised this thread didn't start sooner! I bought it a couple of days ago but will play it for the first time tonight. I'm looking forward to it!

[NARMAK]

I laughed when Phil Spencer had a dig at Sony not releasing this on Xbox after announcing a paltry 4 games and not actually naming them all

I do think though if Sony did wish to also extend partly to Xbox, this game would do well for the community long term if there's X Play online but the lack of PS5/PC Cross Progression is a big wrench in the work. Also not to mention that apparently the servers getting hammered are said to be a big concern for the studio with how much positive news this games been getting

[QuasidodoJr]

Originally Posted by NARMAK

I laughed when Phil Spencer had a dig at Sony not releasing this on Xbox after announcing a paltry 4 games and not actually naming them all

I do think though if Sony did wish to also extend partly to Xbox, this game would do well for the community long term if there's X Play online but the lack of PS5/PC Cross Progression is a big wrench in the work. Also not to mention that apparently the servers getting hammered are said to be a big concern for the studio with how much positive news this games been getting

Here’s where we’re at. Exclusives suck. But, unfortunately, still, in 2024, exclusives are seen as a gaming console’s only valuable commodity. Nintendo and Sony both operate with exclusives as their primary business model. Which is why Phil Spencer has now said in multiple interviews, while he would love to open the door up for more Xbox games to come to other console platforms, they have to consider what games, if given away, would currently hurt the Xbox brand based on public perception when it comes to exclusive games.

At this point, Sony is not even relying on their OWN exclusives made by development teams under the Sony banner. They don’t have anything ready to release. Possibly not even this entire year. And they only released one game last year. Arrowhead Game Studios - the makers of THIS game - is not a Sony owned studio. Sony agreed to publish Helldivers 2 to maintain exclusivity. Rise of the Ronin and Stellar Blade are both studios not owned by Sony, but Sony has taken on publishing rights in order to secure exclusivity. On top of consistently making exclusivity deals with other publishers, like Square-Enix with the Final Fantasy 7 Remakes and FF16. We all know this, but for whatever reason, Sony is always given a pass when they practice this method.

[LIONSFAN20]

Originally Posted by QuasidodoJr

Here’s where we’re at. Exclusives suck. But, unfortunately, still, in 2024, exclusives are seen as a gaming console’s only valuable commodity. Nintendo and Sony both operate with exclusives as their primary business model. Which is why Phil Spencer has now said in multiple interviews, while he would love to open the door up for more Xbox games to come to other console platforms, they have to consider what games, if given away, would currently hurt the Xbox brand based on public perception when it comes to exclusive games.

At this point, Sony is not even relying on their OWN exclusives made by development teams under the Sony banner. They don’t have anything ready to release. Possibly not even this entire year. And they only released one game last year. Arrowhead Game Studios - the makers of THIS game - is not a Sony owned studio. Sony agreed to publish Helldivers 2 to maintain exclusivity. Rise of the Ronin and Stellar Blade are both studios not owned by Sony, but Sony has taken on publishing rights in order to secure exclusivity. On top of consistently making exclusivity deals with other publishers, like Square-Enix with the Final Fantasy 7 Remakes and FF16. We all know this, but for whatever reason, Sony is always given a pass when they practice this method.

I see your point, I really do, but Sony has to sell console to make money. MS can afford to lose money on consoles and still be okay financially. Not saying they do, but they can if they choose to. Sony relies on that profit. Granted they have sold consoles for a loss, but later reiterations of that same console are profitable for them.
Just for fun, what would consoles be like IF every game was everywhere? Would you get a new more powerful console with every year? Would Sony and MS just make them like PCs with upgradable components?
But all this takes the talk away from an AMAZING game! I am LOVING HD2

[dyne]

According to Tweets from Wario64 this game has reached 318k concurrent users on Steam beating out Destiny 2 for all time peak concurrent users (316k).

THIS is why putting your games in more places is important instead of the fanboy only on MY console mentality. The bottom line of the developers is what needs to be maintained and that only happens when games aren't shackled to a platform. Those clamoring for more exclusives are only hastening more consolidation.

And now beat Starfield for the 28th spot.

[NARMAK]

Originally Posted by dyne

According to Tweets from Wario64 this game has reached 318k concurrent users on Steam beating out Destiny 2 for all time peak concurrent users (316k).

THIS is why putting your games in more places is important instead of the fanboy only on MY console mentality. The bottom line of the developers is what needs to be maintained and that only happens when games aren't shackled to a platform. Those clamoring for more exclusives are only hastening more consolidation.

And now beat Starfield for the 28th spot.

Correct me if i am wrong here, but Steam is the only platform that lists the active player numbers. No consoles do as far as i'm aware so you could hypothetically have that many or more players on consoles concurrently and it's never mentioned. So why is it that you think this is the reason we should use to move away from having console exclusives?

The opposite argument is that if i built a platform and literally had no content for it that's exclusively there as a selling point, what reason would consumers have to bother buying my product?

Xbox still works because they know they need to provide exclusive content in the console space. Down the line maybe 3 or so years post launch, maybe they could start releasing on PlayStation and vice versa but funnily enough PC releases are seen as a somewhat indirect rival and can launch sooner.

I think we need console exclusives still IF the platforms were going to try keep gamers interested to their specific IPs on consoles they make, but it seems the PC space is where they both think they can get away with releases without much blowback for that sweet additional revenue. So that status quo will stay a while.

Nintendo is the only platform at present i see having successfully carved out their niche to remain exclusively where they are and be highly profitable under the noses of Sony and MS duking it out at the "Big Boy" table. They played it really smart, missed step of Wii U an all.

[heyadol]

I thought the first Helldivers looked cool. Presentation/art style reminded me a bit of Halo: Spartan Assault but the gameplay looked more intense like Total Carnage or other old school twin-stick shooters. It’s still on my PS Vita wishlist, I wonder if it’s worth picking up after all these years?

[ratandjmt]

Originally Posted by heyadol

I thought the first Helldivers looked cool. Presentation/art style reminded me a bit of Halo: Spartan Assault but the gameplay looked more intense like Total Carnage or other old school twin-stick shooters. It’s still on my PS Vita wishlist, I wonder if it’s worth picking up after all these years?

I had a blast with the first one but it's been a few years since I've played it.

[Steelmaker]

I vehemently disagree that exclusives suck. They may suck for YOU because you're either on a platform that has terrible or no exclusives or you're an entitled PC gamer who thinks everything should just come to you, regardless. But as a console gamer, I know that exclusives bring great value to your platform because optimization is essential with console games! Unlike PC where you can just go out and spend a thousand bucks on a graphics card to brute force a game to 4K/60, console gamers must rely on developers to properly optimize their hardware to ensure the best experience possible. When a developer only has to worry about one platform, their games tend to look better and run better because they had the time to maximize the capabilities of that platform. When they have to worry about 4 platforms to develop for, in a lot of cases you end up with poor optimization which is part of the reason why 1st party games are typically of higher quality 3rd party games. I'm glad Sony is not doing day one on PC and instead porting later because if they were co-developing both versions simultaneously, I belive it could compromise optimization on console.

[dyne]

Originally Posted by Steelmaker

I vehemently disagree that exclusives suck. They may suck for YOU because you're either on a platform that has terrible or no exclusives or you're an entitled PC gamer who thinks everything should just come to you, regardless. But as a console gamer, I know that exclusives bring great value to your platform because optimization is essential with console games! Unlike PC where you can just go out and spend a thousand bucks on a graphics card to brute force a game to 4K/60, console gamers must rely on developers to properly optimize their hardware to ensure the best experience possible. When a developer only has to worry about one platform, their games tend to look better and run better because they had the time to maximize the capabilities of that platform. When they have to worry about 4 platforms to develop for, in a lot of cases you end up with poor optimization which is part of the reason why 1st party games are typically of higher quality 3rd party games. I'm glad Sony is not doing day one on PC and instead porting later because if they were co-developing both versions simultaneously, I belive it could compromise optimization on console.

I'm preserving all of this. :chefskiss:

[NARMAK]

Originally Posted by Steelmaker

I vehemently disagree that exclusives suck. They may suck for YOU because you're either on a platform that has terrible or no exclusives or you're an entitled PC gamer who thinks everything should just come to you, regardless. But as a console gamer, I know that exclusives bring great value to your platform because optimization is essential with console games! Unlike PC where you can just go out and spend a thousand bucks on a graphics card to brute force a game to 4K/60, console gamers must rely on developers to properly optimize their hardware to ensure the best experience possible. When a developer only has to worry about one platform, their games tend to look better and run better because they had the time to maximize the capabilities of that platform. When they have to worry about 4 platforms to develop for, in a lot of cases you end up with poor optimization which is part of the reason why 1st party games are typically of higher quality 3rd party games. I'm glad Sony is not doing day one on PC and instead porting later because if they were co-developing both versions simultaneously, I belive it could compromise optimization on console.

What's also funny is that Horizon Zero Dawn launched with great performance on PS4 but then on PC launched with a lotta issues and basically crashed down in price.

That said, we can also look at how a game like Crysis which became part of the meme "Can it run Crysis?" for PCs was optimised so badly that even years later with significantly better GPUs and CPUs, the game wouldn't be able to brute force as good as newer games that were better optimised on a general basis.

PCs just to put it out there are a great playground for the people who can and i have no issues with PlayStation or Xbox games releasing 1+ year down the line, but i think an optimised gaming experience of closed systems has worked better overall. I guess though with the potential for an all digital future, i see myself leaving gaming behind on consoles with how they've constantly shown themselves to keep prices significantly higher than say on the PC market side due to only one storefront selling games. Hopefully in time the laws will force them to open it up and cheapen things, but not without a huge and prolonged legal battle. On the other hand, with PC i can go a bit grey market and buy at a huge discount whilst feeling like i still contribute to the devs

[Steelmaker]

Originally Posted by NARMAK

What's also funny is that Horizon Zero Dawn launched with great performance on PS4 but then on PC launched with a lotta issues and basically crashed down in price.

That said, we can also look at how a game like Crysis which became part of the meme "Can it run Crysis?" for PCs was optimised so badly that even years later with significantly better GPUs and CPUs, the game wouldn't be able to brute force as good as newer games that were better optimised on a general basis.

PCs just to put it out there are a great playground for the people who can and i have no issues with PlayStation or Xbox games releasing 1+ year down the line, but i think an optimised gaming experience of closed systems has worked better overall. I guess though with the potential for an all digital future, i see myself leaving gaming behind on consoles with how they've constantly shown themselves to keep prices significantly higher than say on the PC market side due to only one storefront selling games. Hopefully in time the laws will force them to open it up and cheapen things, but not without a huge and prolonged legal battle. On the other hand, with PC i can go a bit grey market and buy at a huge discount whilst feeling like i still contribute to the devs

I truly believe that a huge reason why Xbox 1st party games have struggled is because those developers are having to account for not only a weak Series S, but also the myriad of PC configurations their games have to run on day and date. The Series X hardware is great! But it will NEVER be properly optimized for those reasons and that's a shame!

[QuasidodoJr]

Originally Posted by Steelmaker

I vehemently disagree that exclusives suck. They may suck for YOU because you're either on a platform that has terrible or no exclusives or you're an entitled PC gamer who thinks everything should just come to you, regardless.

While we’re in a thread for a game that launched simultaneously on PC. They suck because we should be able to choose WHERE we want to play a game. I have a PS5, a Series X and a Switch. I can buy most games that release (I’m not a PC gamer at all), but I don’t really care for the Switch, and I prefer playing games on the Series X to the PS5. For controller reasons, ease of use, etc. I will probably pick this game up however I can in the next couple days, but, yeah, I’d prefer it on Xbox.

And it’s looking like I’ll have to go digital. Physical copes are sold out everywhere around me.

[Steelmaker]

Originally Posted by QuasidodoJr

While we’re in a thread for a game that launched simultaneously on PC.

Awww, damnit! I KNEW I should've put in the caveat of live service games because I knew you were going to point that out! . Yes, I agree that live service games SHOULD be on as many platforms as possible day one because they depend so heavily on active players to thrive. Sony already stated that live service games were going day and date on PC, and I understand why that is. However, that really isn't what I am talking about. I'm talking about the AAA tentpole graphical showpiece types of games. Those I do NOT think should just be everywhere. Exclusives are what give a platform its identity. It provides gamers an incentive to actually buy that hardware which, if you're Sony or Nintendo, that's what your whole business model is based on. If you're not going to provide incentives for consumers to buy your product, what are we doing then? They are in the business of selling hardware, not publishing. Plus, as I said before, exclusive games typically look the best, play the best, are of the highest flagship quality in the industry and I absolutely believe that is because studios can do better work when they only have to focus on one platform.

Originally Posted by QuasidodoJr

They suck because we should be able to choose WHERE we want to play a game.

Sorry, but that just wreaks of entitlement to me. I don't know where the mentality comes from that you just think all things should be available to you, because, well, because that's what you want and that's how it should be. You either accept the buy in to play Sony's and Nintendo's games or you don't. To me this is kind of the equivalent of walking into Burger King and being upset that you can't order a Big Mac.

Originally Posted by QuasidodoJr

I have a PS5, a Series X and a Switch. I can buy most games that release (I’m not a PC gamer at all), but I don’t really care for the Switch, and I prefer playing games on the Series X to the PS5. For controller reasons, ease of use, etc. I will probably pick this game up however I can in the next couple days, but, yeah, I’d prefer it on Xbox.

Dude, the controller argument is ridiculous. If you are so married to the offset stick configuration, there are an absolute SHIT TON of PS5 controllers on the market that have the same layout as Xbox controllers. Personally, I don't get the dogmatic preference of one or the other. I play both configurations and I do well with both. I can put one down and pick the other up and not miss a beat. I think both configurations are fine. But as I said, if asymmetric is your thing, there are options out there.

Originally Posted by QuasidodoJr

And it’s looking like I’ll have to go digital. Physical copes are sold out everywhere around me.

It's the inevitable reality of the biz. I hate it for those like you who want to stick with physical. I really do. I went digital last gen and I've not regretted it at all. I love having my entire library at my fingertips and not having to create physical space in my home to store games (my wife appreciates it too). Going back to physical now for me would be like getting rid of the TV remote and going back to changing channels on the set itself.

[QuasidodoJr]

Originally Posted by Steelmaker

Awww, damnit! I KNEW I should've put in the caveat of live service games because I knew you were going to point that out! .

Exclusives still suck. When you buy hardware of ANY kind, it should be the features, the functionality and the capabilities of the hardware selling itself. Not the specific software that goes on it. This is why with every other form of media, we settle on a software format. Like blu-ray against HD-DVD. Blu-ray was the better product. And now you can pick from plenty of different blu-ray players that all run the same movies and discs. Hence, why it’s not entitlement wanting to play where I prefer. Gatekeeping specific games to your hardware with a $500 price tag is a prime example of being bad for the consumer. If I want a Big Mac, I can just go to McDonald’s and order one and it doesn’t cost me $500 up front to get one. This was a terrible analogy by the way.

It’s also bad for the developers. Their product is locked to a specific audience, giving it less potential for sales. Final Fantasy XV sold over 5 million copies on its first day, and topped out around 10 million copies sold. It released simultaneously on PS4, Xbox One and PC. Final Fantasy 16 has yet to even sell 4 million copies and it’s been out for over 8 months. It was locked to PS5.

As for my controller preference, it’s not just the sticks. It’s the feel, it’s the design, the shape, the size, the triggers - everything. I prefer using it. I do not use the haptics. I severely damaged my middle finger on my right hand years ago, and it hurts my fingers to work against the resistance, so I turn that feature off completely on my PS5. I also ONLY buy first party controllers, as I’ve never found a third party controller that I’ve liked. And I own plenty of games digitally. That’s not a big deal to me. I always check for a physical copy first. If I can’t find it or the digital is cheaper, I go digital.

[NARMAK]

Originally Posted by QuasidodoJr

Exclusives still suck. When you buy hardware of ANY kind, it should be the features, the functionality and the capabilities of the hardware selling itself. Not the specific software that goes on it. This is why with every other form of media, we settle on a software format. Like blu-ray against HD-DVD. Blu-ray was the better product. And now you can pick from plenty of different blu-ray players that all run the same movies and discs. Hence, why it’s not entitlement wanting to play where I prefer. Gatekeeping specific games to your hardware with a $500 price tag is a prime example of being bad for the consumer. If I want a Big Mac, I can just go to McDonald’s and order one and it doesn’t cost me $500 up front to get one. This was a terrible analogy by the way.

It’s also bad for the developers. Their product is locked to a specific audience, giving it less potential for sales. Final Fantasy XV sold over 5 million copies on its first day, and topped out around 10 million copies sold. It released simultaneously on PS4, Xbox One and PC. Final Fantasy 16 has yet to even sell 4 million copies and it’s been out for over 8 months. It was locked to PS5.

As for my controller preference, it’s not just the sticks. It’s the feel, it’s the design, the shape, the size, the triggers - everything. I prefer using it. I do not use the haptics. I severely damaged my middle finger on my right hand years ago, and it hurts my fingers to work against the resistance, so I turn that feature off completely on my PS5. I also ONLY buy first party controllers, as I’ve never found a third party controller that I’ve liked. And I own plenty of games digitally. That’s not a big deal to me. I always check for a physical copy first. If I can’t find it or the digital is cheaper, I go digital.

Specific industries have their own "rules" if you will and if you sorta want an example of gaming with another industry that has popped up as tech advanced, loom no further than streaming. Amazon, Netflix, Disney and almost every single other big name make content for their own services almost exclusively even internationally. Where they don't directly produce the content they will licence it out for exclusivity a la 3rd party exclusives for consoles over a set period.

So whilst it's great to think regardless of what hardware you use the content should be available like DVD, Blu-Ray etc. we are seeing how content from many big names isn't even given a physical release anymore. It's gated to specific streaming services and arbitrarily yanked forever a la Discovery/WB never to be seen again as a tax write off.

Your PC games without the intervention of legally fragile methods become obsolete once an OS is no longer available or supported. So the theory you present in an ideal world sounds good, but the reality is different and fundamentally we have to accept that even though we pay for things, we no longer are being allowed true ownership. They're even trying to make this a thing with cars for crying out loud.