Forbes: How BluRay and hd-dvd differ

[Damon Payne]

http://www.forbes.com/feeds/ap/2007/...ap3446816.html

I like the MSFT quote. Of course they are going to say the extra capacity isn't needed. I love reporters, 90% of them are idiots. This is not a format war specific issue: why would you take the word of one side or another about the competing item?

[jrchisholm]

Garbage. Why are so many of these articles pure garbage? Let's spit on some facts, mixed with what we think are facts, and throw in a quote from a non neutral point of view.

[JTK]

Originally Posted by Damon Payne

This is not a format war specific issue: why would you take the word of one side or another about the competing item?

Sadly, the answer is all too painfully obvious.

[joeorc]

Originally Posted by Damon Payne

http://www.forbes.com/feeds/ap/2007/...ap3446816.html

I like the MSFT quote. Of course they are going to say the extra capacity isn't needed. I love reporters, 90% of them are idiots. This is not a format war specific issue: why would you take the word of one side or another about the competing item?

Kevin Collins, a Microsoft Corp. (nasdaq: MSFT - news - people ) executive on HD DVD's North American promotions committee, said movies have yet to require the additional space or faster transfer rate that Blu-ray offers.

well now this is new.....looks like MICROSOFT WENT FROM JUST A GENERAL MEMBER OF HD-DVD to executive on HD-DVD's NORTH AMERICAN promotions committee...

LOOKS LIKE WITH ANY NEWS Q: FROM THE MEDIA why is it seem to alway be MICROSOFT answering them instead of TOSHIBA...could it be that HD-DVD is realy MS-DVD...

[fragglerock585]

"Blu-ray can hold even more - 50 GB. That's because the data layer is closer to the surface - 1 millimeter instead of 6 mm deep - so the laser can focus in even more tightly, said Andy Parsons, a Pioneer Corp. executive who is chairman of the Blu-ray Disc Association's U.S. Promotion Committee."


Holy Cow, I didnt know HD-DVD's were the thickness of a waffle! (considering that its near the middle of their disc)

[dialog_gvf]

Blu-ray can hold even more - 50 GB. That's because the data layer is closer to the surface - 1 millimeter instead of 6 mm deep - so the laser can focus in even more tightly, said Andy Parsons, a Pioneer Corp. executive who is chairman of the Blu-ray Disc Association's U.S. Promotion Committee.

I'm pretty sure Andy would have said 0.1mm and 0.6mm. That the reporter is so clueless that they couldn't catch the error in fact, speaks volumes.

Gary

[dialog_gvf]

Kevin Collins, a Microsoft Corp. (nasdaq: MSFT - news - people ) executive on HD DVD's North American promotions committee, said movies have yet to require the additional space or faster transfer rate that Blu-ray offers.

Seems no matter how many times this is questioned by INSIDERS, this MS spin remains.

[Damon Payne]

I'm pretty sure my BD50 copy of The Descent with some scenes being more than 30mb/s video rate and all the uncompressed 6.1 sound would like to get off the shelf and argue with them about that.

[Zvi]

Why don't they ask about TL HD DVDs that they're braging about then? Happy to make something that is totally unnecessary?

[Shadowself]

Originally Posted by Zvi

Why don't they ask about TL HD DVDs that they're braging about then? Happy to make something that is totally unnecessary?

Not to hijack the tread, but...

Triple Layer HD DVDs don't necessarily mean that HD DVDs need to support higher bit rates. Even if they do the epics at the low 20s for the total stream (video and audio using a lossless audio) they're looking at over 40GB. In theory a TL HD DVD could do this and provide a good quality epic.

That said, with a variable bit rate compression and a "Tier 0" (for lack of a better term) PQ and AQ, the peak rate could easily exceed that allowed for by HD DVD -- unless they change the max bit rate for the Triple Layer disks.

The problems are
....the HD DVD camp designed the HD DVD format around the "average" movie and figured anything more (higher motion rate, higher contrast, more colorful scenes, better sound, longer run time, etc.) would be taken care of by "flipper" disks or by multiple disk sets and the quality would be "good enough".
....they believed Microsoft's mantra of "we can get great PQ with only 9Mbps"!
....the Triple Layer add on only makes up for the last of these (longer run time)
....Odds are the first and second generation HD DVD players will NOT be able to play the Triple Layer disks -- it will very likely require an optics change to read three layers. I have not even heard a rumor of any current players reading a prototype Triple Layer disk. If they change the max bit rate for the Triple Layer disks that will be just one more reason why the current players most likely won't play Triple Layer disks.

Now to return you to your regularly scheduled program...
AKA
How Forbes can't really figure out the differences between HD DVD and Blu-ray.

[Fozziwig]

This is my favourite bit: "HD DVDs, on the other hand, are essentially DVDs on steroids"

Yes, I can see the next HD DVD poster coming up.

****************************************
Buy HD DVD today! - The Look and Sound of Perfect

Essentially, DVD on Steroids....

****************************************

[Fozziwig]

And then "Both HD DVD and Blu-ray support basic pop-up menus, meaning you can change language and subtitle preferences without stopping the movie."

So, hasn't this journo ever looked at his DVD remote and wondered what the 'Audio' and 'Subtitle' buttons do?

You have to despair sometimes.

[PeterTHX]

Originally Posted by Fozziwig

This is my favourite bit: "HD DVDs, on the other hand, are essentially DVDs on steroids"

Yes, I can see the next HD DVD poster coming up.

****************************************
Buy HD DVD today! - The Look and Sound of Perfect

Essentially, DVD on Steroids....

****************************************

"Instead of rubbing "cream" on myself, before a game I watch a HD DVD!"
Barry Bonds - official spokesman

[marzetta7]

Hahahahaha! LOL! ^^^

[Chad Varnadore]

Sadly, even many journalists that write for publications dedicated to the HT hobby, are writers first and competent enthusiasts second and don't have the experience to question what they're being fed. Who knows if the Forbes writer even has an HD display and capable sound setup to evaluate on his own.

When we interviewed Kevin Collins last year, I sent Dave a list of tough, but reasonable questions that I expected anyone that actually has some experience born insight into the technology would be able to easily address. He couldn't answer a one. It was pretty obvious to me based on that, the redundant result of the interview as well as other quotes I've read from him that he was nothing more than a shill or flunky as my Dad would say, sent to get the HD DVD gospel out and befriend gullible enough press sites to charm them to the HD DVD side. They only thing he could do was regurgitate the standard lines we had already heard for months like a telephone marketer reading from a memorized script. His knowledge and insight into these technologies is evident in his recent remarks that Sony is the only studio using PCM audio. He says he bought a BD player. If so, apparently he doesn't use it.

Still preaching that 30GBs is more than enough when all evidence clearly indicates it's not unless you don't have very high expectations for the future + the fact that HD DVD is now "claiming" they're developing 51GB discs - no doubt specifically to address BDs higher capacity, assuming the DVD forum doesn't shoot it down like they did 45GB discs. Just how hard is it for some to put 2 and 2 together?

[vsbdtv]

On Fox New's "Bulls & Bears" business program this past Saturday, Scott Bleier's prediction was that Blu-Ray would beat out HD-DVD, contributing to a 30% rise in Sony (SNE) stock. This is the first time I can remember any of the weekend financial pundits taking a strong position on the HD disc battle.

[thunderhawk]

HD DVD = MS DVD
Same FUD, different day.