Alien: Covenant (2017)

[mar3o]

Originally Posted by pEgLeG

It's funny that so many people find issue with the scientists being stupid. Many scientists are in fact very stupid. Many of them lack the intellectual flexibility to think for themselves and solve puzzles; they have honed one narrow skill, and they can only solve problems that were put before them by either their prof, or their boss, but they can't seem to independently construct a problem to solve based upon their situational awareness, because they have little, or none. They aren't all Feynmans.

btw: I don't take Orndorf's review too seriously, considering that he gave an Amy Schumer movie a better score. Even a crap Ridley Scott movie would be better than Schumer's magnum opus.

I can back this up with my own experience. I had a friend long ago who was a scientist for a major battery company. He was very smart obviously and a very nice guy. He had me over for lunch one afternoon with some other friends, and he had to put something in the microwave. Except it was in a metal container, and he was just about to turn it on when we stopped him and pointed out what he was about to do.

My point is simply that even very intelligent people make stupid mistakes and sometimes miss the obvious. I'm not trying to defend Prometheus, because I'm not much of a fan for various reasons, but I just thought I'd throw in my experience.

[MassiveMovieBuff]

Rotten Tomatoes is flawed as hell! There's a lot of great films that have low ratings on RT and a lot of bad-overrated films that have high ratings. There are films that rightfully have high and low ratings as well which makes RT very uneven. I would never rely on RT. Just rely on my own opinion and thoughts on if I want to see a movie.

[BluePhirePB]

Originally Posted by MassiveMovieBuff

Rotten Tomatoes is flawed as hell! There's a lot of great films that have low ratings on RT and a lot of bad-overrated films that have high ratings. There are films that rightfully have high and low ratings as well which makes RT very uneven. I would never rely on RT. Just rely on my own opinion and thoughts on if I want to see a movie.

Piggy backing on that though, I find the audience rating much more believable than the critic rating.

[Darkstream]

You don't need to be a brilliant scientist, just an average person with common sense, to know an alien space cobra is most likely dangerous and if approaching, proceed with caution -- Better yet, don't approach -- RUN!





Actually, I do love that scene now, just because of the sheer stupidity of that character, and the gigeresque phallic snake.

[NegaScott128]

Originally Posted by mar3o

I can back this up with my own experience. I had a friend long ago who was a scientist for a major battery company. He was very smart obviously and a very nice guy. He had me over for lunch one afternoon with some other friends, and he had to put something in the microwave. Except it was in a metal container, and he was just about to turn it on when we stopped him and pointed out what he was about to do.

My point is simply that even very intelligent people make stupid mistakes and sometimes miss the obvious. I'm not trying to defend Prometheus, because I'm not much of a fan for various reasons, but I just thought I'd throw in my experience.

The problem is that the characters do things that are so obviously stupid and so completely removed from anything anybody would do in their situation that it completely takes you out of the movie. There's a difference between "sticks something metal in a microwave" and "tries to pet a freaky alien penis monster." Literally no one would ever think that's a good idea, and presumably the marijuana reference in that scene is an attempt to justify the behavior of the characters, because they knew that it was stupid, but they didn't care enough to fix it. They also didn't care enough to fix the scene where they all take off their helmets, and when they decide to bring a 90 year-old man into a meeting with the Übermensch, or when everybody decides not to run perpendicular to the falling spaceship that is about to crush them. That the characters make so many stupid decisions, on top of speaking almost exclusively in lofty, important-sounding dialogue, and the general lack of explanation for any of the dozens of questions the movie brings up, speaks to one thing: the script is terrible. And when the script is terrible, there's not much the rest of the movie can do to fix it.

The mixed reception to Prometheus, to me at least, is about your priorities as a filmgoer. Some people care more about the intent of the filmmakers rather than the execution, and so applauded the film for its ambition. Others focus more on the visuals than on the story, and so applauded the film for its cinematography, effects, and production design, all of which are excellent. Some people just wanted a scary movie, like it was advertised to be, and so were left disappointed when the film spent more time on theory and philosophy instead of fear. And some people wanted a well-told story that wasn't just the first act of a larger story that Ridley Scott thinks needs 6 movies to tell. Guess how those people felt.

[mar3o]

This thread is a calamity. Everyone has made their minds up without even seeing it. Amazing.

[Merlinpants]

Originally Posted by Darkstream

You don't need to be a brilliant scientist, just an average person with common sense, to know an alien space cobra is most likely dangerous and if approaching, proceed with caution -- Better yet, don't approach -- RUN!





Actually, I do love that scene now, just because of the sheer stupidity of that character, and the gigeresque phallic snake.

Worst and most unforgivable scene in a movie......ever. Lost all respect for the film at this very point and it could never recover. Awful.

[Merlinpants]

Originally Posted by mar3o

This thread is a calamity. Everyone has made their minds up without even seeing it. Amazing.

Lots of things in life you don't need to see to know they are bad. This happens to be one of them lol

If anyone other than Sir Ridley Scott had directed it, this would have been slaughtered and buried by now.

[MassiveMovieBuff]

Originally Posted by BluePhirePB

Piggy backing on that though, I find the audience rating much more believable than the critic rating.

It's hit and miss with both. There's so many films and directors I love that I figured most people did until I read a lot of these threads and found out that's not the case at all. The only film critics I go by these days are Richard Roeper and Peter Travers (back in the day it was Roger Ebert and Janet Maslin) . I do occasionally have disagreements with them on some films but it's fairly consistent with them as far as for me.

[Gamma_Winstead]

Well, said space scientist in a deleted scene had already interacted with a little space snake, and had quite the positive experience. This one didn't go so well though.

Biologists who study or work with dangerous animals sometimes die or are wounded in their line of work. Millburns death was potentially preventable (I mean, it's not really though because it's a movie and he was going to die either way) but he also geniuenly had no idea the thing would be the way it was. The only way TO know is by interacting with it. He'd be a pretty sh*t biologist if he just ignored a new species when he's there to study new species. He's technically killed doing his job, unlike Fifield, who gets lost despite being the guy who designed the map making gear.

[DrWally]

I just got back. My first instinct is that this is a cautious thumbs up from me. A solid seven. The first act is the strongest by far - tense, eerie and spectacular. Then gradually the movie becomes an exposition heavy Prometheus sequel. This middle section is the part of the movie that I think will generate the most controversy. The third act sees the conventions of the action / horror genre come to the fore a bit. It's all done perfectly well but, you know, we've been there and done that by now. Fassbender is the MVP, but Danny McBride is surprisingly good here. At this point I'd rank the series as follows:

1. Aliens
2. Alien
3. Alien 3 (workprint)
4. Covenant
5. Alien 3
6. Prometheus
7. Resurrection
8. AVP (never saw AVPR)

[Det. Bullock]

Originally Posted by pEgLeG

It's funny that so many people find issue with the scientists being stupid. Many scientists are in fact very stupid. Many of them lack the intellectual flexibility to think for themselves and solve puzzles; they have honed one narrow skill, and they can only solve problems that were put before them by either their prof, or their boss, but they can't seem to independently construct a problem to solve based upon their situational awareness, because they have little, or none. They aren't all Feynmans.

btw: I don't take Orndorf's review too seriously, considering that he gave an Amy Schumer movie a better score. Even a crap Ridley Scott movie would be better than Schumer's magnum opus.

I don't know about Covenant but in Prometheus you often saw scientists being bad exactly at their own one narrow skill, like the protagonist being a bad archaelogist and her boyfriend too, etc.
It would be fine if the writer knew he was dealing with bad scientists, but it's clearly not the case because the guy is visibly an ignorant hack.

[Darkstream]

Okay, here's another one. Let's mess this dead alien being's head. We don't need to wear any breathing apparatus, or faceshields, or surgical masks -- I'm sure there won't be any airborne contaminants or possible deadly pathogens, because its physiology is not that different from ours, even though it is obviously alien. But don't worry, we'll have on our plastic gloves just as a minor precaution.

[pEgLeG]

Originally Posted by Det. Bullock

I don't know about Covenant but in Prometheus you often saw scientists being bad exactly at their own one narrow skill, like the protagonist being a bad archaelogist and her boyfriend too, etc.
It would be fine if the writer knew he was dealing with bad scientists, but it's clearly not the case because the guy is visibly an ignorant hack.

Originally Posted by pEgLeG

[...]and they can only solve problems that were put before them by either their prof, or their boss, but they can't seem to independently construct a problem to solve based upon their situational awareness, because they have little, or none.

.

[Gremal]

Originally Posted by Merlinpants

Worst and most unforgivable scene in a movie......ever. Lost all respect for the film at this very point and it could never recover. Awful.

How is it a whole lot different from the original Alien? A crew member goes and sticks his face into an egg after falling from a platform. I don't see you complaining about that as the worst thing ever since cuneiform and hieroglyphics or possibly the big bang.

Face it (no pun intended): Prometheus is very much in keeping with the original Alien.

[ManBeast]

When I left the cinema I thought 'well it wasn't bad', but today I have decided it's not terrible. Just kind of a movie that didn't really matter in terms of the wider series.

Who else thought the opening scene was cool but slightly ruined by the TV style opening credits?

Michael Fassbender was good as David however.

[pEgLeG]

This discussion of unbelievable stupidity has actually been on my mind before this thread. I used to be annoyed by how stupid people in horror movies are, but as I've gotten more experience with people over the years, I find that most people are exactly that stupid and unaware. Now it no longer bothers me, mostly because it's an accurate representation of reality. I just didn't realize it, or didn't want to accept it. Now I just live vicariously through the killer to assuage some of the frustrations that build up from my real-world encounters with these cattle.

[pEgLeG]

I should also point out an amazingly annoying philosophy that I've routinely heard on campus: "C's get degrees." I think that says it all right there.

[drush9999]

Just watched it, thought it was a bit meh, predictable, and a very obvious ending

I guess if you liked Prometheus you will like this. Best bit was the fingering joke which made the audience titter

[Merlinpants]

Originally Posted by Gremal

How is it a whole lot different from the original Alien? A crew member goes and sticks his face into an egg after falling from a platform. I don't see you complaining about that as the worst thing ever since cuneiform and hieroglyphics or possibly the big bang.

Face it (no pun intended): Prometheus is very much in keeping with the original Alien.

Were you watching the same film?

In alien he fell next to a pod which opened and he naturally looked inside out of curiosity with no idea a facehugger was going to fling out.

This versus an imbecile that is supposed to be a scientist trying to pet an alien snake that has reared up and spread its hood. He then tries to stroke it! If that had been on earth and a cobra do you think he would have tried that, but on an alien planet with an unidentified lifeform he tries to stroke it? You seriously think they compare? Are you Damon lindelof?

Not sure what you're smoking, but pass it round bud!