Why are Star Trek fans so bitter about the reboot?

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by peckinpah

There's a scene where Bones orders one of Khan's crew be taken out of a 'tube and kept in an induced coma. They then stick Kirk in the 'tube.

As for needing Khan's blood, was it ever established that the rest of the crew shared the same type of enhanced/magical/whatever blood? Khan was the only one whose blood McCoy tested.

But the dude actually says 'I can't open up the tubes, this tech's too old for me, I might kill the person inside' and then five minutes later he's the mack daddy of cryotube shenanigans.

As for Khan's blood, the crew were augments, just like him. IIRC Bones says that they can't thaw anyone else out to check because he can't work the tubes, but then he takes someone out just to put Kirk in so why didn't he check their blood then? Yeah, there's no guarantee that their blood would be the same, but how did Khan even know that his blood had that sort of property anyway? Did they tell him he had blood type O-Magical down at the Federation blood bank?

God, what a shit film STID is. But there's lots of 'splosions and Spock flying into a nerd rage and pummelling someone with his fists (for the third time in two films, how original), so there's that.

[peckinpah]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

But the dude actually says 'I can't open up the tubes, this tech's too old for me, I might kill the person inside' and then five minutes later he's the mack daddy of cryotube shenanigans.

As for Khan's blood, the crew were augments, just like him. IIRC Bones says that they can't thaw anyone else out to check because he can't work the tubes, but then he takes someone out just to put Kirk in so why didn't he check their blood then? Yeah, there's no guarantee that their blood would be the same, but how did Khan even know that his blood had that sort of property anyway? Did they tell him he had blood type O-Magical down at the Federation blood bank?

God, what a shit film STID is. But there's lots of 'splosions and Spock flying into a nerd rage and pummelling someone with his fists (for the third time in two films, how original), so there's that.

New Khan knew he had O-Magical the same way Old Khan knew Chekhov.

[blonde_devil]

Originally Posted by Spirit Zero

It made no sense because neither character knew each other that well enough to evoke that kind of emotion.

It was an obvious horrendous scene crowbarred in simply to appease fanboys by giving them a franchise love letter moment. A bland emotionless fail that the creators think was clever because they switched the roles. Alternative dimensional reality? we can just switch the roles...wow that was easy and look how clever we look. The fans will LOVE it!

My thoughts exactly. There is an homage and then there is a ripoff and they don't seem to get that what they are doing is a bad ripoff. That has been my biggest issue with this whole alternate universe - they make surface changes to show things are different(and to change anything they don't get/don't like) yet when they need something, they just leave the audience to fill it in. The Kirk-Spock friendship never really gets defined but they will have a scene like that and the audience is supposed to buy into it because they know in the original series that Kirk and Spock were friends. Plus does Spock need to be emotional in every movie? Sure he showed emotion in the series and films but not every since one.

Forbes has an article about the movies and fans and I understand what they mean about not really needing the fans as it is a small market but for series like Trek, the only reason they made the films was because of the fans. The original series was written off and they only made TMP because the fans were making so much noise. They only made TNG because the films showed that there was still a fanbase out there that wanted Trek. While you might not cater to everything the fans want, you do need to respect them because they are your core audience - they are the ones that you can count on. Look at the 2009 film and Into Darkness - there is a huge drop in box office even though Into Darkness was a 3D movie and charged more. Why? People didn't come back, be it fans or those casual viewers they want so badly. If you stop caring about that the fans want, sure you will make money but for how long? Will the next Trek film make as much money as they want when you consider they carefully walk around the fact that Into Darkness didn't meet thier expectations? It only took 4 movies to go from Batman to Batman & Robin and no one saw it coming.

[benbess]

Originally Posted by blonde_devil

....Look at the 2009 film and Into Darkness - there is a huge drop in box office even though Into Darkness was a 3D movie and charged more. Why? People didn't come back, be it fans or those casual viewers they want so badly. If you stop caring about that the fans want, sure you will make money but for how long? Will the next Trek film make as much money as they want when you consider they carefully walk around the fact that Into Darkness didn't meet thier expectations? It only took 4 movies to go from Batman to Batman & Robin and no one saw it coming.

You makes some good points in your post, but actually STID had bigger box office worldwide than Star Trek 09. But since STID cost significantly more, it's not clear that they've figured out the business side of star trek.

Star Trek 09 worldwide boxoffice: $386 million
STID: $467 million

[blonde_devil]

Originally Posted by benbess

You makes some good points in your post, but actually STID had bigger box office worldwide than Star Trek 09. But since STID cost significantly more, it's not clear that they've figured out the business side of star trek.

Star Trek 09 worldwide boxoffice: $386 million
STID: $467 million

But don't forget those are unadjusted totals and even 4 years makes a difference with inflation. I think adjusted it was about $100 million more compared to the 2009 film so there was a jump there but that still makes things look bad for it as you have to think most of those viewings were in 3D so there was an extra charge. Don't know about all places but I know where I am, $3 is average additional charge so every 3 3D tickets is equal to 4 regular but they don't tell that. Take that $467 and cut out 25% to eliminate that extra cost and you are around $350 million(give or take a few million to account for those who didn't see it in 3D). And that is just using the unadjusted totals - the 2009 will make more when you adjust the amounts. Like I said, not saying these are not making money but they are not making vastly more money than the original films. When TMP came out, there was no way they were going to make $300+ million. You can't say he is saving the franchise or any of the hype because the numbers really don't support that.

[peckinpah]

They're never going to make a significant profit until they sell the franchise overseas, and that's something they've struggled with since the original movies. Normally movies like this would earn a vastly greater sum in foreign markets, but for some reason it never happens with Trek. But Paramount is bound and determined to make it happen, and that's the main reason the reboot lost its Trek-ness. JJ gets the brunt of the blame, but you can't let Paramount off the hook.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by peckinpah

New Khan knew he had O-Magical the same way Old Khan knew Chekhov.

Hah! Good point.

[hendersd]

Originally Posted by AaronJ

People who are saying that nu-Kirk is "more of an ass" than TOS-Kirk either haven't seen many TOS episodes lately, or have a different definition of "ass" than I do.

TOS-Kirk would have been not only stripped of his command, but put in the brig indefinitely EVERY. SINGLE. EPISODE. The number of times he violated the Prime Directive alone is astronomical.

I was thinking more of his sexual exploits: "Ladies; Jim Kirk." And in bed with not one but two alien "chicks". Where's the "moral majority"! LOL Maybe I'm just jealous.

[Elvis]

Originally Posted by benbess

This honest trailer is funny, but it does make some points....

Honest Trailers - Star Trek Into Darkness (Feat. HISHE) - YouTube

That pic...best part of the entire film.

[i007spectre]

Well as long as he isn't lying the next film will be all about the five year mission and take place in deep space.

http://www.ign.com/articles/2014/06/...inal-tv-series