Physical & Digital EST: The Future of Home Video Discussion Thread

[Plutotype]

Commenting on digital vs physical. The future is digital download of a physical master ( whole disc ) or streaming of the uncompressed video/audio ( ISPs get ready ). The whole industry is loosing money on physical media ( declining sales ), because they HAVE NOT replaced physical media with a consumer friendly legal platform for uncompressed movie downloads/streaming.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by Plutotype

Commenting on digital vs physical. The future is digital download of a physical master ( whole disc ) or streaming of the uncompressed video/audio ( ISPs get ready ). The whole industry is loosing money on physical media ( declining sales ), because they HAVE NOT replaced physical media with a consumer friendly legal platform for uncompressed movie downloads/streaming.

Sales of physical media have been declining since 2011, but the sales of discs remain profitable. If they were not so, then they would not be offered by either the studios themselves or those that license their content. Business does not make it a practice to lose money.

Discs are compressed, too, just not as severely as streamed content. A truly uncompressed movie would be terabytes in size and that is not going to happen on physical media and not via streaming or download, either.

[gotmule]

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by gotmule

It's too early here for popcorn; I just finished my breakfast.

Isn't your appointment to audition that Trinnov today? Let us know how that goes and which one you buy, if any.

[gotmule]

Originally Posted by Vilya

It's too early here for popcorn; I just finished my breakfast.

Isn't your appointment to audition that Trinnov today? Let us know how that goes and which one you buy, if any.

I worked with someone who use to have popcorn at 9:00 in the morning. I thought she was crazy.

And yes! The appt is in 3 hours. The owner called wanting to know what kind of adult beverage I wanted and what kind of food he should have for me. They have a Kaleidoscope there with plenty of demo options, but I still am going to bring some discs to see how it does with upmixing compared to what I know my room sounds like with the Marantz. Jon from Trinnov sent me a list of his top 20 Atmos DTS X demos as well, so this is going to be a fun afternoon for sure.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Vilya

It's too early here for popcorn; I just finished my breakfast.

Isn't your appointment to audition that Trinnov today? Let us know how that goes and which one you buy, if any.

Originally Posted by gotmule

I worked with someone who use to have popcorn at 9:00 in the morning. I thought she was crazy.

And yes! The appt is in 3 hours. The owner called wanting to know what kind of adult beverage I wanted and what kind of food he should have for me. They have a Kaleidoscope there with plenty of demo options, but I still am going to bring some discs to see how it does with upmixing compared to what I know my room sounds like with the Marantz. Jon from Trinnov sent me a list of his top 20 Atmos DTS X demos as well, so this is going to be a fun afternoon for sure.

I love the smell of popcorn in the morning.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by gotmule

I worked with someone who use to have popcorn at 9:00 in the morning. I thought she was crazy.

And yes! The appt is in 3 hours. The owner called wanting to know what kind of adult beverage I wanted and what kind of food he should have for me. They have a Kaleidoscope there with plenty of demo options, but I still am going to bring some discs to see how it does with upmixing compared to what I know my room sounds like with the Marantz. Jon from Trinnov sent me a list of his top 20 Atmos DTS X demos as well, so this is going to be a fun afternoon for sure.

Getting you , or at least "uninhibitied", is conducive to making a five figure sale after all. Have fun; I will await your report!

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

I love the smell of popcorn in the morning.

I know this may sound sacrilegious with us being movie fans and all, but I have never been a big fan of ; I can take it or leave it as I much prefer other snackies.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Vilya

I know this may sound sacrilegious with us being movie fans and all, but I have never been a big fan of ; I can take it or leave it as I much prefer other snackies.

I always have pizza on movie night (delivery)

If I go to the cinema, I always get popcorn. I like all flavours, toffee, salt and sugar.

[gotmule]

Originally Posted by Vilya

Getting you , or at least "uninhibitied", is conducive to making a five figure sale after all. Have fun; I will await your report!

I am also looking at the new Storm Audio ISP MKII, which has just been released. It is another 24 channel processor that is a bit less than the Trinnov, but does not have all the customization and control though, so we will see. It is more of a traditional chip based processor, where the Trinnov is a computer, as well as having a much better microphone option. Trinnov has been great through the process with a white glove treatment, whereas Storm Audio has been somewhat relaxed and lacking.

[gotmule]

Originally Posted by Vilya

I know this may sound sacrilegious with us being movie fans and all, but I have never been a big fan of ; I can take it or leave it as I much prefer other snackies.

Always popcorn for me....with an adult beverage.

[Vilya]

Going back to the question of offering fully uncompressed movies via any distribution method, I asked our very knowledgeable forum member GeoffD in a private message just how large these files would be and he sent me this answer:

"2 hour movie in full compressed master form would be ~2 terabytes for a 2K master, 8 terabytes for a 4K master (it just scales linearly according to how many pixels the frame size is, unlike with compressed interframe consumer video). As a point of reference, the uncompressed 4K 120fps 3D master for Gemini Man is approximately 92 terabytes in size!

Calculated thusly: 2.3 terabytes for a 2K 24fps 2D show. So x4 pixels for a 4K 24fps 2D = 9.2 terabytes. Then x5 for the increased frame rate, 120fps vs 24fps, so 4K 120fps 2D = 46 terabytes. Finally x2 for the 3D as you're doubling the amount of images, so 4K 120fps 3D = 92 terabytes."

No one will be streaming, or downloading, uncompressed movie files with humongous file sizes like these anytime soon.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by gotmule

Always popcorn for me....with an adult beverage.

Haven’t drank for 12 years since developing Acid Reflux disease. Don’t miss it at all, thought I would at first.

[gotmule]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

Haven’t drank for 12 years since developing Acid Reflux disease. Don’t miss it at all, thought I would at first.

That is my one vice, but definitely in moderation. I don’t blame you walking away though, as Acid Reflux can be pretty miserable to deal with.

[JohnAV]

Originally Posted by Plutotype

Commenting on digital vs physical. The future is digital download of a physical master ( whole disc ) or streaming of the uncompressed video/audio ( ISPs get ready ). The whole industry is loosing money on physical media ( declining sales ), because they HAVE NOT replaced physical media with a consumer friendly legal platform for uncompressed movie downloads/streaming.

Please check the balance sheets of any host that provides streaming movies. Even Netflix for many years and millions of subscribers has been constantly burning through what income they made. While VoD hosts provide some revenue back to the studios, it’s minute compared to theater derived income. As Vilya mentioned physical media reproduction, distribution, sales revenue has always been profitable. While online is very convenient, the products as far as providing them over the internet just aren’t because the operating expenses is quite prohibited. Increasing the transcoded file sizes would just break the whole system, never mind ISP that likely couldn’t support unlimited downloads. Also the only service Kaleidoscope has never been anything more then a oddity in the industry, requiring a very expensive setup, for it to work. No consumer will want to be subjected to that much entertainment expense. It’s got to be something that is inexpensive for this to fly!

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by gotmule

That is my one vice, but definitely in moderation. I don’t blame you walking away though, as Acid Reflux can be pretty miserable to deal with.

Food is my vice. Movie night is the one time a week I eat later than 9pm.

You have to have pleasures in life. Nothing wrong with vices.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

Food is my vice. Movie night is the one time a week I eat later than 9pm.

You have to have pleasures in life. Nothing wrong with vices.

Are you sure about that?

[Show spoiler]It's a joke, people; not an invitation to go into a political

[JohnAV]

Originally Posted by Vilya

Going back to the question of offering fully uncompressed movies via any distribution method, I asked our very knowledgeable forum member GeoffD in a private message just how large these files would be and he sent me this answer:

"2 hour movie in full compressed master form would be ~2 terabytes for a 2K master, 8 terabytes for a 4K master (it just scales linearly according to how many pixels the frame size is, unlike with compressed interframe consumer video). As a point of reference, the uncompressed 4K 120fps 3D master for Gemini Man is approximately 92 terabytes in size!

Calculated thusly: 2.3 terabytes for a 2K 24fps 2D show. So x4 pixels for a 4K 24fps 2D = 9.2 terabytes. Then x5 for the increased frame rate, 120fps vs 24fps, so 4K 120fps 2D = 46 terabytes. Finally x2 for the 3D as you're doubling the amount of images, so 4K 120fps 3D = 92 terabytes."

No one will be streaming, or downloading, uncompressed movie files with humongous file sizes like these anytime soon.

Honestly I don’t think people have a clue how much compression is involved from the digital intermediate compared to various physical media releases to various streaming content. A typical iTunes HD digital copy file downloaded is approximately 4.5 GB compared to that multiple terabyte raw master.

[bhampton]

Originally Posted by Plutotype

Commenting on digital vs physical. The future is digital download of a physical master ( whole disc ) or streaming of the uncompressed video/audio ( ISPs get ready ). The whole industry is loosing money on physical media ( declining sales ), because they HAVE NOT replaced physical media with a consumer friendly legal platform for uncompressed movie downloads/streaming.

I don't believe most of that.

The future is digital download of a physical master ? ... Nope ... Sorry. Not at all likely.

Kaliedscape does this now and they may or may not survive but most people don't consider them reasonably priced.

[Wendell R. Breland]

Originally Posted by JohnAV

Honestly I don’t think people have a clue how much compression is involved from the digital intermediate compared to various physical media releases to various streaming content. A typical iTunes HD digital copy file downloaded is approximately 4.5 GB compared to that multiple terabyte raw master.

Recently it has gotten worse on Netflix, UHD's now stream at 11.55 Mbps and HD at 2.76 Mbps. Checked the Netflix server test and the results was 170 Mbps.