Superman: The Movie 4K UHD (1978)

[Ben_UK]

I kinda knew when I picked up this UHD that if there was one thing I thought they might screw up it was the contrast / brightness levels of the suits they wear on Krypton and I was right. Its like the computer calculating the brightness has just auto adjusted it for the suits and as a result they dont look anywhere near as "blown out" as they should be, as a result the entire image looks darker than it should be I assume because its taken the white levels from the suits in the scene.

[david_blu]

Wait till you see the rest of the dreadful transfer...

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by Ben_UK

I kinda knew when I picked up this UHD that if there was one thing I thought they might screw up it was the contrast / brightness levels of the suits they wear on Krypton and I was right. Its like the computer calculating the brightness has just auto adjusted it for the suits and as a result they dont look anywhere near as "blown out" as they should be, as a result the entire image looks darker than it should be I assume because its taken the white levels from the suits in the scene.

What TV and player are you using? Watching in DV or HDR10?

[CompleteCount]

Originally Posted by Mocorongo

If this is the only available source why haven’t they done the same for II and IV? And why the 3 hour cut from STM in 1080p only? Or 1984’s Supergirl?

Am I the only one thinking they are sitting on many things either to release them later or due to not wanting to spend much on it? With TV shows I always heard excuses about companies not being able to re-release them in 1080p, and over the years everyone that said this was impossible was proven wrong.

The two scenes from the longer cut of Superman IV (the tornado scene and the bit in Moscow) were included in the theatrical releases outside of the US, as it was handled by Columbia-Cannon-Warner, as opposed to Warner Bros, so at the very least prints of it should exist - probably in good condition, as they were certainly returned to vaults or sold off to private collectors after it bombed.

As for the other missing footage - forget it. Cannon utterly unconcerned with anything other than the final film. To store unused material cost money and space, so they usually junked it. The same fate awaited the many cut scenes from Texas Chainsaw Massacre Part 2, and - just like those in Superman IV, exist only because a workprint turned up containing them, and both are still missing scenes.

[Agent Kay]

Originally Posted by david_blu

Wait till you see the rest of the dreadful transfer...

It's exactly how it should be

[eddievanhalen]

Originally Posted by david_blu

Wait till you see the rest of the dreadful transfer...

What dreadful transfer? I think Superman The Movies was made to look that way back in 1978 and the UHD BD is just faithful to the source. It looks good to me for what it is, a movie from the 1970 shot on film stock from the 1970's shot with difussion filters which were the fashion of the time.

[Nitroboy]

Originally Posted by Ben_UK

I kinda knew when I picked up this UHD that if there was one thing I thought they might screw up it was the contrast / brightness levels of the suits they wear on Krypton and I was right. Its like the computer calculating the brightness has just auto adjusted it for the suits and as a result they dont look anywhere near as "blown out" as they should be, as a result the entire image looks darker than it should be I assume because its taken the white levels from the suits in the scene.

I think it was supposed to look like that. In order to give the suits that glow, they must have pulled some trickery with the camera.

[ditcin]

Originally Posted by Nitroboy

I think it was supposed to look like that. In order to give the suits that glow, they must have pulled some trickery with the camera.

FYI - the costumes for the characters on Krypton where made from projection screen material. What you're seeing, in terms of their "glow" is light being reflected back into the camera.

[Geoff D]

I think they *have* been too keen to preserve the highlight detail on the suits though, and as the brightness of them barely hits SDR levels then the 4000-nit HDR10 mastering container and ~3200-nit MaxCLL presents a problem: tone mappers will often use one of those figures to map the content and so it doesn't 'see' that the suits are relatively much lower in brightness already. So they get hit with that 4k-nit mapping and get reduced to stupidly dim levels in the process, also making the colour look duller and it's already got a very different look to the existing versions as it is, the skin tones of the Council members are nothing like the healthy pinkiness of other editions.

I know I gabble on and on and on and on about retaining highlights in HDR but some common sense wouldn't have gone amiss here. Compared to this I'd have been happy with the suits being just as clipped as in SDR with some extra brightness on top, it's not like it's a shot of a sky but is a very specialised photographic process so I can give it some leeway re: not seeing every crease in the fabric in HDR. And yes, although this disc has has DV it doesn't help in my case because of the substantial reduction in brightness that DV has on Sony TV's.

[HeavyHitter]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

I think they *have* been too keen to preserve the highlight detail on the suits though, and as the brightness of them barely hits SDR levels then the 4000-nit HDR10 mastering container and ~3200-nit MaxCLL presents a problem: tone mappers will often use one of those figures to map the content and so it doesn't 'see' that the suits are relatively much lower in brightness already. So they get hit with that 4k-nit mapping and get reduced to stupidly dim levels in the process, also making the colour look duller and it's already got a very different look to the existing versions as it is, the skin tones of the Council members are nothing like the healthy pinkiness of other editions.

This disc looks rather good in all respects (considering the source, of course) on my tone mapped set-up. I find the BDs looking rather flawed at this point in time. Depending on the version; too filtered, too contrast boosted, too tealed, etc.

[Geoff D]

If you're watching in SDR2020 (I think?) then that goes beyond just tone mapping, it's fundamentally altering the curve into more of a gamma-type response so I'm not surprised it would react better when being compressed into 350 nits.

[ditcin]

Truthfully, the film, to me, still looks better than when I originally saw it in the theater. The one thing I can't stand is the re-mixed Atmos audio. The music levels are off - low throughout the film. That annoys me much more than how the film looks. Also the dialog is also mix way too low. They really off set the levels.

[Geoff D]

When you've got the 70mm split-surround mix on there then why the actual **** would you give the Atmos a second thought? It's just a reworking of the substantially revised SE remix anyway.

[notops]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

When you've got the 70mm split-surround mix on there then why the actual **** would you give the Atmos a second thought? It's just a reworking of the substantially revised SE remix anyway.

I think a lot of people are skipping the 70mm mix because 'lossy' mixes are treated like the boogeyman around here. It's a shame because so many people don't understand how awesome Dolby Digital @640kbps can truly be.

The fact that the 70mm Split Surround mix is included is easily my favorite feature on an already very impressive disc.

[Geoff D]

Or, given his setup in his sig, he defaults to dat Atmos regardless.

[KMR]

Originally Posted by Ben_UK

Its like the computer calculating the brightness has just auto adjusted it for the suits and as a result they dont look anywhere near as "blown out" as they should be, as a result the entire image looks darker than it should be I assume because its taken the white levels from the suits in the scene.

I don't recall the suits being "blown out" when I saw this in 70mm in 1979. They were very bright, but some detail was definitely still there. Everything but the suits certainly was a bit darker.

[HeavyHitter]

I certainly wouldn't base what the suits should look like in terms of brightness from the BDs. We all know the issues many of these older transfers suffer from in terms of over-brightness and clipping with standard SDR.

[fighthefutureofhd]

Having read this thread last night made me want to watch this movie again for the umpteenth time on 4K UHD. So I just finished watching it again and here are my new thoughts:



The more and more I watch this movie, the more and more I fall in love with it. This movie is pretty much flawless through and through. There isn't hardly a movie today in the comic book genre that comes close to this movie. I think it does far more with far less than a lot of movies try to achieve with a whole lot more. Onto the movie itself. I think the presentation here is also flawless and really soars above many other movie presentations on 4K UHD. This may be me, but I feel the fact that it's shot on film helps this a lot. Modern movies can tend to look a bit more plastic and waxy then movies shot on film. From the grain to the colors, this movie just excelled in every area. There are a couple of flaws with the movie that I found and I'll discuss those.

One is the character of Otis. He's just so stupid and doesn't add anything much to the movie other than comic relief. And even that is suspect. Also, the ending makes no sense. We see Lois saved, but we don't know how that happened or if the missiles never went off. It was a bit vague. All my other flaws have melted with each viewing and this movie just shines. The effects aren't amazing in some areas and show age, but it's so easy to overlook and believe in what you're seeing. The effects don't stand out as much as some modern effects in current movies do. I also really liked the sound presentation more this time around. I chose the 70MM audio (I believe so anyway) and it blows the Atmos away. Not that the Atmos presentation is a slouch. I just think the 70mm handled things better. Anyway, these are my two cents on a movie that I grow to love each year I get older. Thanks for reading.

[overmang5]

I have a couple questions about this. If someone could answer.

1. Is this the original theatrical cut, or the extended one?
2. Is there any hope for a Superman II Donner Cut, or both Donner and Lester cuts in 4K?
3. If the above has any chance of happening, what about a boxset Superman I & II (Donner Cut) in 4K?
4. Is it worth the $25 Amazon has it for right now?

[HeavyHitter]

Originally Posted by overmang5

I have a couple questions about this. If someone could answer.

1. Is this the original theatrical cut, or the extended one?
2. Is there any hope for a Superman II Donner Cut, or both Donner and Lester cuts in 4K?
3. If the above has any chance of happening, what about a boxset Superman I & II (Donner Cut) in 4K?
4. Is it worth the $25 Amazon has it for right now?

1) Original
2) No one knows
3) No one knows
4) Yes