SPECTRE Review Thread

[chip75]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

As the Forbes article rightly said, if this grosses "only" $1 billion or thereabouts then it'll be ASM2 all over again: it took enough money to cover its ass but was nothing like as profitable as they anticipated ('orbis non sufficit' indeed).

I'm not sure what happened to studios' expectation with profits in the last few years they don't seem to have any logic. They throw money at things hoping to get back double or triple but the outlay is so huge it's very rarely happens. The Force Awakens is going to cost a lot of money and it's going to make a lot of money, but the merchandise will make Disney billions. The movie is a 250 million dollar commercial. The same can't be said for Bond (even though it's full of product placements).

[imsounoriginal]

If this does end up being financially disappointing there still won't be a moratorium. Worst case scenario is Craig walks and they recast and go back to basics for a lower-budget, more old-school Bond. It's happened before.

[dgoswald]

Originally Posted by imsounoriginal

If this does end up being financially disappointing there still won't be a moratorium. Worst case scenario is Craig walks and they recast and go back to basics for a lower-budget, more old-school Bond. It's happened before.

If that's the alternative, a part of me wants Spectre to fail, lol.

[Nada]

Originally Posted by imsounoriginal

If this does end up being financially disappointing there still won't be a moratorium. Worst case scenario is Craig walks and they recast and go back to basics for a lower-budget, more old-school Bond. It's happened before.

That would be fine, but I don't know how much more basic you can get from the gadgetless and generally humorless Craig films. If this doesn't make enough money and they recast, I hope we can return to when Bond movies were colorful and adventurous.

[baheidstu]

Originally Posted by dgoswald

If that's the alternative, a part of me wants Spectre to fail, lol.

It won't fail. SPECTRE is the Thunderball to Skyfall's Goldfinger, just being released in the wake of the earlier, successful and acclaimed film will be enough to sustain it. Bond is a globally popular brand and comparing it to Amazing Spider-Man 2 is absurd as that was part of a dog franchise reboot that nobody asked for.

[Nada]

Originally Posted by baheidstu

It won't fail. SPECTRE is the Thunderball to Skyfall's Goldfinger, just being released in the wake of the earlier, successful and acclaimed film will be enough to sustain it. Bond is a globally popular brand and comparing it to Amazing Spider-Man 2 is absurd as that was part of a dog franchise reboot that nobody asked for.

ASM2 made plenty of money, enough to surely generate a sequel, but Sony tucked tail because they spent too much money and are incapable of properly producing a movie within reason. This kind of situation could happen to any of these $200M+ budgeted franchise films.

[ZoetMB]

Originally Posted by chip75

I'm not sure what happened to studios' expectation with profits in the last few years they don't seem to have any logic. They throw money at things hoping to get back double or triple but the outlay is so huge it's very rarely happens. The Force Awakens is going to cost a lot of money and it's going to make a lot of money, but the merchandise will make Disney billions. The movie is a 250 million dollar commercial. The same can't be said for Bond (even though it's full of product placements).

Just remember that Lucasfilm and Disney do not produce any products. They license them out to manufacturers who pay them back royalties backed by guarantees and advances. No different than what the major sports team do. The royalties they get back are relatively small.

If we assume that 30% of U.S. males aged 5 to 19 and 10% of females aged 5 to 19 will each spend $35 each on Star Wars merchandise, that's a gross of about $305 million of which Lucasfilm would typically receive no more than $37 million. This just includes retail sales and not character licensing for advertising, etc., which is probably far more lucrative. That $37 million (which I think is very optimistic) is nice, but it's obviously far less than film net.

[chip75]

Originally Posted by ZoetMB

Just remember that Lucasfilm and Disney do not produce any products. They license them out to manufacturers who pay them back royalties backed by guarantees and advances. No different than what the major sports team do. The royalties they get back are relatively small.

Disney are making Star Wars merchandise. These days they seem to make their own stuff as well as licencing it out.

I was thinking about the Disney's Cars franchise as well, it's made over 4 billion dollars in merchandising. Bond is a relatively low-earner with merchandise compared to other movies with similar budgets, which is the opposite of what it used to be. The James Bond movies were big earners and there was lots of paraphernalia available, it seems more limited now. The Corgi DB5 was its year's biggest toy back in the day, there's no-chance of something similar happening today. I'd wager BB-8 will be one of the biggest toys this year.

[Infernal King]

Originally Posted by imsounoriginal

If this does end up being financially disappointing there still won't be a moratorium. Worst case scenario is Craig walks and they recast and go back to basics for a lower-budget, more old-school Bond. It's happened before.

Then I hope Spectre tanks!

[Lt. Brannigan]

I enjoyed Casino Royale, but haven't really enjoyed the other Bond movies, so if takes a flop to get back to the adventure than I say FLOP BABY FLOP! But I doubt this will flop.

[NP13]

Casino Royale is on TV at the moment - it's disappointing to already know that Spectre probably won't even be half as good.

[FT-86]

Why's everyone so quick to write off spectre all of sudden? Everything that has been shown looks to have promise. The last one made over a billion, it's going to take a lot for this too flop.

[Nada]

Originally Posted by FT-86

Why's everyone so quick to write off spectre all of sudden? Everything that has been shown looks to have promise. The last one made over a billion, it's going to take a lot for this too flop.

Taking nearly half a billion to produce and market the film could do the trick.

[dohrmannmf]

I can understand the sentiment of some, but I really don't want this movie to fail. Most of that is because I want to watch a great Bond movie in a couple of months. If Craig decides to step down after this one and a reboot is needed, then they should have no problem downsizing the budget....and maybe bring back Martin Campbell. His record of rebooting Bond currently stands at 2 for 2.

[Nada]

Truthfully, the three times that Bond got to big for its own good (YOLT, Moonraker, DAD - all very successful) the next film ended up being terrific, among the best in the series. It doesn't take a flop to make Bond change. In fact, the one film that could be described as a flop, MWTGG, pushed the producers to go for broke with SWLM, and it paid off handsomely. Licence to Kill actually made quite a bit overseas, nearly on par with Living Daylights. It only disappointed in the U.S. And the six year gap was due to the legal entanglements the producers found themselves in.

[chris_sc77]

If it cost that much to make then this means we may actually get numerous impressive action sequences in the movie which we havnt seen in a Bond film in some time

[Ironhorse75]

The way everybody is talking you would think Sam Mendes is pulling some Josh Trank shit behind the scenes.

It's still Sam Mendes!

[imsounoriginal]

Originally Posted by chris_sc77

If it cost that much to make then this means we may actually get numerous impressive action sequences in the movie which we havnt seen in a Bond film in some time

Shirley you must be joking.

[dohrmannmf]

Originally Posted by Nada

It doesn't take a flop to make Bond change. In fact, the one film that could be described as a flop, MWTGG, pushed the producers to go for broke with SWLM, and it paid off handsomely.

Spy Who Loved Me was kind of a special situation though since that was the first in the series made entirely under the control of the Broccoli family after Harry Saltzman sold off his share. Albert Broccoli knew he had to go big on it SWLM or it very well could have been the end of the series.

I'm not disagreeing with your overall assessment that it doesn't take a failure to push the series further, but when a movie under performs with the numbers and is critically/fan skewered, they always go back to the drawing board. It happened with On Her Majesty's Secret Service. By no means was it a bomb, but the reception and its performance based on previous entries made them reassess the series and led to Diamonds are Forever and the Roger Moore era in general. Similar situation with Licence to Kill which combined with studio troubles led to Goldeneye. Die Another Day, while profitable, didn't meet expectations and most people hated it and we got Casino Royale shortly after.

I guess what I'm really trying to say, they REALLY need to f*ck up bad with Spectre to make sure a change in direction with the series. Craig may leave the part, but if his last one is considered a financial success and people like it, I'd expect the next entry, even with a new actor, to follow in the mold of the Daniel Craig era.

[Infernal King]

Originally Posted by dohrmannmf

Spy Who Loved Me was kind of a special situation though since that was the first in the series made entirely under the control of the Broccoli family after Harry Saltzman sold off his share. Albert Broccoli knew he had to go big on it SWLM or it very well could have been the end of the series.

I'm not disagreeing with your overall assessment that it doesn't take a failure to push the series further, but when a movie under performs with the numbers and is critically/fan skewered, they always go back to the drawing board. It happened with On Her Majesty's Secret Service. By no means was it a bomb, but the reception and its performance based on previous entries made them reassess the series and led to Diamonds are Forever and the Roger Moore era in general. Similar situation with Licence to Kill which combined with studio troubles led to Goldeneye. Die Another Day, while profitable, didn't meet expectations and most people hated it and we got Casino Royale shortly after.

I guess what I'm really trying to say, they REALLY need to f*ck up bad with Spectre to make sure a change in direction with the series. Craig may leave the part, but if his last one is considered a financial success and people like it, I'd expect the next entry, even with a new actor, to follow in the mold of the Daniel Craig era.

My worst nightmare.