Physical & Digital EST: The Future of Home Video Discussion Thread

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Fiffy

For starters, check out this Wikipedia article:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o..._subscriptions

You can find more details and the most recent statistics on the ITU web site:

http://www.itu.int/en/ITU-D/Statisti...t/default.aspx

Thsnks.

[Fiffy]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

AirPlay relies on WI-FI not mobile data.

You keep moving the goal posts. You were claiming that TVs somehow had trouble picking up the Wifi. But you're wrong anyway. It's perfectly possible to stream a video to an iPhone via cellular and then on to an Apple TV via Wifi, all with just mobile Internet access. You don't even need a Wifi access point if you don't want to. There are quite a few people with grandfathered unlimited data plans who do this routinely.

I am talking about a mobile only household. No broadband.

You keep mixing up the local and the wide-area access. You can have a local Wifi network without having wired Internet access.

As for your other points, I respect them. If that's your field, that is your field. Just one question? I thought higher frequencies used in 5g were more susceptible to interference and dropout not less?

You have to be more specific. 5G opens up a number of new bands, and they all have different properties.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Fiffy

You keep moving the goal posts. You were claiming that TVs somehow had trouble picking up the Wifi. But you're wrong anyway. It's perfectly possible to stream a video to an iPhone via cellular and then on to an Apple TV via Wifi, all with just mobile Internet access. You don't even need a Wifi access point if you don't want to. There are quite a few people with grandfathered unlimited data plans who do this routinely.
You keep mixing up the local and the wide-area access. You can have a local Wifi network without having wired Internet access.
You have to be more specific. 5G opens up a number of new bands, and they all have different properties.

But is that all reliable? It seems to be all makeshift options. Im pretty sure most people think of Wi-Fi as broadband. So in your opinion, could they possibly, at some future moment in time, work out a solution where homes with no broadband could still watch digital content on a large screen? Either by casting or some other method? Presumably, 5g would work as a hotspot or wifi option even without 5g fixed broadband?

Just trying to understand.

[alchav21]

Originally Posted by alchav21

I know what you are talking about, but Wireless is Wireless. We were using Fixed as a Hard Wired Connection. Wireless whether Fixed on a rooftop or dependent on a good signal, is not as consistent as Wired.

Originally Posted by Fiffy

A well-provisioned fixed wireless connection can absolutely be as consistent as a wired connection. And it will not be damaged if your neighbour forgets to call 811 before digging that hole for the new swimming pool.

The Key Word is Well-Provisioned, so in real life situations Hard Wired beats Wireless every time. If I had a choice between Fixed Fiber and Fixed Wireless, I would pick Fiber every time. Like I said, the Future are Network Fiber Rings, and yes your Fixed Wireless will be there too but only when Fiber Facilities are not available. Straight Fiber to the Fiber Backbone, beats Wireless every time!

[Fiffy]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

But is that all reliable? It seems to be all makeshift options. Im pretty sure most people think of Wi-Fi as broadband.

Wifi is a local network technology that creates connectivity only within your home. It is technically completely separate from the Internet access, be it wired or wireless.

So in your opinion, could they possibly, at some future moment in time, work out a solution where homes with no broadband could still watch digital content on a large screen? Either by casting or some other method?

Assuming by "no broadband" you really mean "no wired broadband": Of course. This is possible today.

[Fiffy]

Originally Posted by alchav21

The Key Word is Well-Provisioned, so in real life situations Hard Wired beats Wireless every time. If I had a choice between Fixed Fiber and Fixed Wireless, I would pick Fiber every time. Like I said, the Future are Network Fiber Rings, and yes your Fixed Wireless will be there too but only when Fiber Facilities are not available. Straight Fiber to the Fiber Backbone, beats Wireless every time!

Sorry, but you have no clue what you are talking about.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Fiffy

Wifi is a local network technology that creates connectivity only within your home. It is technically completely separate from the Internet access, be it wired or wireless.
Assuming by "no broadband" you really mean "no wired broadband": Of course. This is possible today.

Thanks. Hopefully 5g will enable new ways to enjoy entertainment without costing too much and enabling viewing of tv screens. Like you said, it can now, but on a major scale I mean.

[alchav21]

Originally Posted by alchav21

The Key Word is Well-Provisioned, so in real life situations Hard Wired beats Wireless every time. If I had a choice between Fixed Fiber and Fixed Wireless, I would pick Fiber every time. Like I said, the Future are Network Fiber Rings, and yes your Fixed Wireless will be there too but only when Fiber Facilities are not available. Straight Fiber to the Fiber Backbone, beats Wireless every time!

Originally Posted by Fiffy

Sorry, but you have no clue what you are talking about.

Come on Fiffy, I Retired from AT&T, I not only helped Google and the Silicon Valley put Fiber Networks but also Provisioned from Copper Phone Lines, through ISDN, and DSL. So I think I know a little about what I am talking about. Your Fixed Wireless 5g has potential, but it will never have the Bandwidth or Reliability of Fiber. Talk to any Expert, and I'm sure they will take this to The Bank!

[Steedeel]

Fifty, are you sure this stuff is workable and will be available mainstream? This article makes it sound like a pipe-dream stating that fixed 5g tech used in trials may not even make it into the 5G final spec. It also says they are using a pre-commercial 5g router to test.


http://www.theverge.com/2017/3/2/14788218/5g-mwc-2017

[alchav21]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

Fifty, are you sure this stuff is workable and will be available mainstream? This article makes it sound like a pipe-dream stating that fixed 5g tech used in trials may not even make it into the 5G final spec. It also says they are using a pre-commercial 5g router to test.


http://www.theverge.com/2017/3/2/14788218/5g-mwc-2017

Good Article, I thought they were closer to deployment, but like I said it has a lot of potential. I have always been a Wired Guy, there's a place for Wireless but mostly for Mobile Devices. Even my Home is Hard Wired with Structured Cat5, including my Entertainment Center to my Streaming Blu-ray Player. What people should take away from this, if they can't get FTTH then they can wait and hope for 5g. Like I told Fiffy, if you have a choice between Fiber and 5g, take the Fiber that is proven Technology.

Here's a good Article that illustrates my point from my Sound & Vision:
http://www.soundandvision.com/conten...DdMgcu5AggJ.97

We haven't heard back from Fiffy, but I think he's trying to find more information. Here is more from DSL Reports on Verizon 5g, it's not looking good:
https://www.dslreports.com/shownews/...Antenna-139067

[alchav21]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

But is that all reliable? It seems to be all makeshift options. Im pretty sure most people think of Wi-Fi as broadband. So in your opinion, could they possibly, at some future moment in time, work out a solution where homes with no broadband could still watch digital content on a large screen? Either by casting or some other method? Presumably, 5g would work as a hotspot or wifi option even without 5g fixed broadband?

Just trying to understand.

Originally Posted by Fiffy

Wifi is a local network technology that creates connectivity only within your home. It is technically completely separate from the Internet access, be it wired or wireless.

Assuming by "no broadband" you really mean "no wired broadband": Of course. This is possible today.

Steedeel, here is another Report on DSLReports talking about 10% cut on Fixed-Line Broadband, feeding into your Mobile Only Scenario:

https://www.dslreports.com/shownews/...xt-Year-139087

I know Fiffy was all Gung-Ho on Wireless, and I think we lost him with our backed up information. I think the people that are switching over to Wireless Broadband are the Low End Users, that just want eMail and a little Web Browsing. For High End Video Streaming I think a Hard Wired Fixed-Line Broadband Connection is needed. I know you were asking Fiffy if a Fixed Wireless like 5g would be able to give the same Bandwidth as a Fixed-Line Broadband like Fiber. I still say no, they are in tests but if Pigeons and Air cause problems it doesn't look good!

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by alchav21

Steedeel, here is another Report on DSLReports talking about 10% cut on Fixed-Line Broadband, feeding into your Mobile Only Scenario:

https://www.dslreports.com/shownews/...xt-Year-139087

I know Fiffy was all Gung-Ho on Wireless, and I think we lost him with our backed up information. I think the people that are switching over to Wireless Broadband are the Low End Users, that just want eMail and a little Web Browsing. For High End Video Streaming I think a Hard Wired Fixed-Line Broadband Connection is needed. I know you were asking Fiffy if a Fixed Wireless like 5g would be able to give the same Bandwidth as a Fixed-Line Broadband like Fiber. I still say no, they are in tests but if Pigeons and Air cause problems it doesn't look good!

Yes, it will happen more and more. Having said that, as someone pointed out, we could all make (IMO) clickbait headlines with the word 'likely' couldn't we?

[BMox81]

I definitely go through phases about Physical and/or Digital.

The wife and I watched Arrival on Saturday night on the Apple TV and it was a perfectly good experience - no buffering and the picture was great. In fact my digital experience as a whole has been excellent.

But I also seem to be the old relic in my group of friends as none of them buy discs anymore. They just see it as clutter - especially with the likes of Netflix/Amazon Prime video/Kodi about. Whereas I've slowly been buying UHD's to play in my One S player.

It's hard trying to find that balance - I love the convenience of digital, but when it comes to certain films (MCU/Disney), I'll want the best experience which comes from a disc.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by BMox81

I definitely go through phases about Physical and/or Digital.

The wife and I watched Arrival on Saturday night on the Apple TV and it was a perfectly good experience - no buffering and the picture was great. In fact my digital experience as a whole has been excellent.

But I also seem to be the old relic in my group of friends as none of them buy discs anymore. They just see it as clutter - especially with the likes of Netflix/Amazon Prime video/Kodi about. Whereas I've slowly been buying UHD's to play in my One S player.

It's hard trying to find that balance - I love the convenience of digital, but when it comes to certain films (MCU/Disney), I'll want the best experience which comes from a disc.

My views of Digital/Streaming are very negative. Take the latest news from Netflix for example? They want to introduce interactive tv and film as early as next year. Instead of movies and tv being a passive experience they want us clicking our remote at major plot turns to decide what happens next or god knows when. It makes me want to throw up. They are trying to destroy film.

[whipnet]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

Instead of movies and tv being a passive experience they want us clicking our remote at major plot turns to decide what happens next or god knows when. It makes me want to throw up. They are trying to destroy film.

I'm with you, that kind of takes the art out of it. The books I read as a kid that did that were fun, but none of those were great novels.

*

[Steedeel]

Agreed. I have had enough of all this crap now. I hope this is limited and not the way films and the tv are made in future. They seem determined to **** it up for those of us who just want to watch films without any stupid social media comments or interactive element. Leave our ******** films alone!

[Steedeel]

http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/20...ernate-endings

Can someone pass me a length of rope?

[squatting hen]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

My views of Digital/Streaming are very negative. Take the latest news from Netflix for example? They want to introduce interactive tv and film as early as next year. Instead of movies and tv being a passive experience they want us clicking our remote at major plot turns to decide what happens next or god knows when. It makes me want to throw up. They are trying to destroy film.

Actually, that might not be bad depending on how they do it. Now, I don't want every movie that way, but I could see myself watching the same thing more than once, choosing different options. Games do it already.

What if you had the option of "clicking now" to insert a deleted scene that was cut (in just the right place)? I always enjoyed directors alternate endings, so if a director has different ideas on turns and events, you could actually see more creativity.

[bigjim25]

Definately prefer physical copies. Digital does no good at all when the internet is down or the power is out!

[squatting hen]

Originally Posted by bigjim25

Definately prefer physical copies. Digital does no good at all when the internet is down or the power is out!

Well...can't really do much with physical copies either when the power is out except play Frisbee.