The Movie Review and Discussion Thread

[Steve46]

Originally Posted by jhiggy23

Memento:

Film: 3 (out of 4)

First time viewing. I thought it was good, but overrated. Surf, I know you're a huge fan of the film, so let me inquire as to whether my interpretation of the film is correct:

[Show spoiler]The main character's wife was raped and murdered and in the struggle he is thrown against the mirror. This leads to his short-term memory loss condition. The cop then helps/utilizes him to find the killer and the guy does, subsequently killing him but then forgetting he did so. The cop, who is crooked, then uses the guy to help him knock off other bad guys since the original kill, which helps him get money. For instance, in knocking of the drug dealer in the film, the cop was able to get the money in the car the guy drove to the warehouse

.

I think that

[Show spoiler] the crooked cop sees the money in Leonard's car and spends the entire movie trying to find a way to get the car. He asks to borrow it. He was probably trying to open the trunk in the scene where Leonard found him sitting in the passenger seat. Outside the tattoo parlor too.

It's possible that Leonard had found and killed his wife's killer. He may have killed many other suspects too by mistake before and since.

[Riff Magnum]

Originally Posted by Steve46

The Eternal tour was pretty great. I liked Rather Ripped a lot too.

You know i forgot about that one. Our bassist played it for me once and i remember digging it.
They got a new one coming out or something?

[Steve46]

Originally Posted by Riff Magnum

You know i forgot about that one. Our bassist played it for me once and i remember digging it.
They got a new one coming out or something?

No, I was just comparing seeing a new movie to anticipating an album from a favorite band.

I think with Thurston and Kim splitting up, all future tours are in doubt. Kim is doing a UK date with her own band and Lee is working with his other band.

Scary times.

[Riff Magnum]

Originally Posted by Steve46

No, I was just comparing seeing a new movie to anticipating an album from a favorite band.

I think with Thurston and Kim splitting up, all future tours are in doubt. Kim is doing a UK date with her own band and Lee is working with his other band.

Scary times.

For many years they were the kings of the underground. I'm ashamed to say i didn't know that Kim and Thurston broke up. I tend to keep up with movies better than music these days.

[Pondosinatra]

Originally Posted by Steve46

Criterion recently released the Three Colors Trilogy on Blu-ray and fans of Veronique will almost certainly enjoy the trilogy. It's best to see them in sequence: Blue stars Juliette Binoche, White stars Zbigniew Zamachowski and Red stars Irene Jacob. Red in particular will appeal to fans of Veronique because it touches on similar themes and Jacob gives another captivating performance. The three films are loosely tied together in a scene at the end of Red, so that's why I suggest seeing them in order.

I have all three on DVD but haven't watched them yet. That said, I earlier reviewed 'I Want You' which I watched on LD. Thought the film looked gorgeous, found out later it was the same cinema photographer that did the Three Colors trilogy. So I'll definitely watch them soon.

[Steve46]

Originally Posted by Pondosinatra

I have all three on DVD but haven't watched them yet. That said, I earlier reviewed 'I Want You' which I watched on LD. Thought the film looked gorgeous, found out later it was the same cinema photographer that did the Three Colors trilogy. So I'll definitely watch them soon.

I think you'll be happy with the look of Three Colors. Blue probably looks the best, but Red is the strongest story in my opinion. Maybe I'm just obsessed with Irene Jacob though? I gave my DVD copy to a friend.

[Pondosinatra]

Originally Posted by Steve46

I think you'll be happy with the look of Three Colors. Blue probably looks the best, but Red is the strongest story in my opinion. Maybe I'm just obsessed with Irene Jacob though? I gave my DVD copy to a friend.

I originally grabbed it because I was in love with Julie Delphy

[Diesel]

Saw The Grey last Saturday and watched Chronicle tonight.

Reviews to come some time today (Thursday).

[surfdude12]

Originally Posted by jhiggy23

Memento:

Film: 3 (out of 4)

First time viewing. I thought it was good, but overrated.

Surf, I know you're a huge fan of the film, so let me inquire as to whether my interpretation of the film is correct:

[Show spoiler]The main character's wife was raped and murdered and in the struggle he is thrown against the mirror. This leads to his short-term memory loss condition. The cop then helps/utilizes him to find the killer and the guy does, subsequently killing him but then forgetting he did so. The cop, who is crooked, then uses the guy to help him knock off other bad guys since the original kill, which helps him get money. For instance, in knocking of the drug dealer in the film, the cop was able to get the money in the car the guy drove to the warehouse

.

There are 3 interpretations that I am aware of.

(1) The conventional interpretation which you laid out pretty accurately.

(2) The unconventional interpretation which I like.

[Show spoiler]The "Lenny is Sammy" interpretation. Toward the end Teddy says "Sammy didn't have a wife" and "It was your wife (Lenny's wife) who had diabetes!" after which we see Lenny (not Sammy) pricking his wife with the needle and she goes "ouch!". Under this theory:
-there was no Sammy
-there was no burgulary
-there was no attack
-there was no John Q
-Lenny killed his wife (when she tested him the same way Sammy's wife tested him in teh film)
-Lenny couldn't accept the fact that he killed his wife, so invented the burgulary/attack/JohnQ scenario
-Teddy still used Lenny just as in the conventional interpretation (1) above, as from Teddy's standpoint its still the same: a vunerable guy with a short-term memory loss condition who thinks a guy named "John Q" murders his wife. The difference in (2) is it never happened. In (1) , it did happen. But for Teddy's purposes, Lenny is still just as manipulatable.
-did Sammy exist? No, not under this theory. This theory is similar to SHutter Island, where Dicaprio's character can't accept his actions, so gives himself another identity and sets out to solve an unsolvable crime!
-Strong support for intepretation (2): Teddy tells Lenny this information at the end of the film, which is the chronological beginning of the film. What does Lenny do when he learns this information? He "lies to himself to be happy" (one of last lines in the film) by writing down Teddy's license tag, so he can go back to being Lenny in "John Q hunting mode". Once again, when confronted with the truth, he rejects it and "lies to himself to be happy", because the alternative (truth that he killed his wife) is unbearable. The chronological rest of the film (what we already saw before that) is just him living out that lie.
-I like theory (2) over theory (1) because its more fascinating and narrows in on the fact that the mind is a powerful thing, almost an independent entity apart from us, that can adapt to inputs and take corrective actions that it sees fit, resulting in people doing unconcious things they never realize!

(3) I've heard of a third interpretation based on

[Show spoiler]a shot later in the film showing Lenny lying in bed with his wife with "I did It" tattoeed on his chest. Can't remember where in the film this happens, but its definitely shown. What does this mean? One interpretation is:
-His wife survived the attack
-Lenny mistakenly thought she died
-Teddy told Lenny she died, so he could use him
-ONce Lenny found out Teddy lied to him and was using him, Lenny killed Teddy
-Hence him lying next to his wife with "I did it" (killed Teddy) on his chest
-I don't think this theory has as much support as (1) and (2), but its still interesting

[Foggy]

Originally Posted by surfdude12

There are 3 interpretations that I am aware of.

(1) The conventional interpretation which you laid out pretty accurately.

(2) The unconventional interpretation which I like.

[Show spoiler]The "Lenny is Sammy" interpretation. Toward the end Teddy says "Sammy didn't have a wife" and "It was your wife (Lenny's wife) who had diabetes!" after which we see Lenny (not Sammy) pricking his wife with the needle and she goes "ouch!". Under this theory:
-there was no Sammy
-there was no burgulary
-there was no attack
-there was no John Q
-Lenny killed his wife (when she tested him the same way Sammy's wife tested him in teh film)
-Lenny couldn't accept the fact that he killed his wife, so invented the burgulary/attack/JohnQ scenario
-Teddy still used Lenny just as in the conventional interpretation (1) above, as from Teddy's standpoint its still the same: a vunerable guy with a short-term memory loss condition who thinks a guy named "John Q" murders his wife. The difference in (2) is it never happened. In (1) , it did happen. But for Teddy's purposes, Lenny is still just as manipulatable.
-did Sammy exist? No, not under this theory. This theory is similar to SHutter Island, where Dicaprio's character can't accept his actions, so gives himself another identity and sets out to solve an unsolvable crime!
-Strong support for intepretation (2): Teddy tells Lenny this information at the end of the film, which is the chronological beginning of the film. What does Lenny do when he learns this information? He "lies to himself to be happy" (one of last lines in the film) by writing down Teddy's license tag, so he can go back to being Lenny in "John Q hunting mode". Once again, when confronted with the truth, he rejects it and "lies to himself to be happy", because the alternative (truth that he killed his wife) is unbearable. The chronological rest of the film (what we already saw before that) is just him living out that lie.
-I like theory (2) over theory (1) because its more fascinating and narrows in on the fact that the mind is a powerful thing, almost an independent entity apart from us, that can adapt to inputs and take corrective actions that it sees fit, resulting in people doing unconcious things they never realize!

(3) I've heard of a third interpretation based on

[Show spoiler]a shot later in the film showing Lenny lying in bed with his wife with "I did It" tattoeed on his chest. Can't remember where in the film this happens, but its definitely shown. What does this mean? One interpretation is:
-His wife survived the attack
-Lenny mistakenly thought she died
-Teddy told Lenny she died, so he could use him
-ONce Lenny found out Teddy lied to him and was using him, Lenny killed Teddy
-Hence him lying next to his wife with "I did it" (killed Teddy) on his chest
-I don't think this theory has as much support as (1) and (2), but its still interesting

Problem with the 2nd interpretation is that a Sammy definitely exists, Teddy says during the final scene that

[Show spoiler]Sammy was a phony and that Lenny exposed him for the fake he was. He just seemed to use the personal of Sammy to make himself feel less guilty of his wife's death.

Also there is a brief clip in one of the black and white scenes where you see

[Show spoiler]Sammy sat in a mental ward and as someone walks past you see a quick cut of Lenny sat in his place

, I never caught it until many watches after.

[surfdude12]

Originally Posted by Foggy

Problem with the 2nd interpretation is that a Sammy definitely exists, Teddy says during the final scene that

[Show spoiler]Sammy was a phony and that Lenny exposed him for the fake he was. He just seemed to use the personal of Sammy to make himself feel less guilty of his wife's death.

No, in that portion of the script Teddy is referring to

[Show spoiler]Lenny's invention of Sammy, not Sammy himself. Oh and by the way, I was wrong. Under the 2nd interpretation:
-there was an assault
-Lenny did get hit in the head, which is when the condition started
-His wife survived the assault
-Lenny killed his wife via the insulin injections

TEDDY
(chuckles)
You tell everyone about Sammy. Everyone
who'll listen. "Remember Sammy Jankis,
remember Sammy Jankis". Great story. Gets
better every time you tell it. So you
lie to yourself to be happy. Nothing
wrong with that - we all do. Who cares if
there's a few little things you'd rather
not remember? (SO RIGHT HERE WE ALREADY KNOW THAT SAMMY DOESNT EXIST)

LEONARD
What the **** are you talking about?
TEDDY
(theatrical shrug)
I dunno... your wife surviving the
assault... her not believing about your
condition... the doubt tearing her up
inside.., the insulin -

LEONARD
That's Sammy, not me! I told you about
Sammy -

TEDDY
Like you've told yourself. Over and over.
Conditioning yourself to believe.
"learning through repetition" - (TEDDY POINTING OUT THAT LENNY INVENTED SAMMY)

LEONARD
Sammy let his wife kill herself! Sammy
ended up in an institution - !

TEDDY
Sammy was a con man. A faker. (REFERRING TO LENNY'S INVENTION OF SAMMY)

LEONARD
I never said he was faking! I never said
that!

TEDDY
You exposed him for what he was: a fraud.

LEONARD
I was wrong! That's the whole point!
Sammy's wife came to me and -

TEDDY
Sammy didn't have a wife.
It was your wife who had diabetes.

LEONARD
My wife wasn't diabetic.

TEDDY
Are you sure?

Leonard's Wife on the edge of the bed. She feels a sharp
pain, and turns to Leonard.

LEONARD'S WIFE
Gentle.

Leonard is playfully pinching her thigh.

LEONARD
She wasn't diabetic. You think I don't *
know my own wife? What the **** is wrong *
with you? *

TEDDY
(shrugs)
I guess I can only make you believe the
things you want to be true, huh? Like ol' *
Jimmy down there.

Also there is a brief clip in one of the black and white scenes where you see

[Show spoiler]Sammy sat in a mental ward and as someone walks past you see a quick cut of Lenny sat in his place

, I never caught it until many watches after.

That just reaffirms that

[Show spoiler]Lenny is Sammy

[SDon1969]

Originally Posted by surfdude12

That just reaffirms that

[Show spoiler]Lenny is Sammy

Absolutely agree.

[surfdude12]

The English Patient

Film: 4/5
-blind buy
-great film about a guy in a North AFrican expedition (Fiennes) who is wounded during WWII and finds himself being looked after by a British ally nurse.
-the film shows 2 timelines: the guy having flashbacks to his expedition adventures and a present timeline of the nurse watching over him in an deserted monastary in the Italian? countryside and their interaction with ally soldiers who pop in (one of who??? SAYID from Lost!! He's a mine sweeper!)
-overall, the film is a great epic with much of the themes revolving around love/fate between two people (in each timeline). Fantasic cinematography and the AQ is 5/5!!

[Al_The_Strange]

Originally Posted by surfdude12

There are 3 interpretations that I am aware of.

(1) The conventional interpretation which you laid out pretty accurately.

(2) The unconventional interpretation which I like.

[Show spoiler]The "Lenny is Sammy" interpretation. Toward the end Teddy says "Sammy didn't have a wife" and "It was your wife (Lenny's wife) who had diabetes!" after which we see Lenny (not Sammy) pricking his wife with the needle and she goes "ouch!". Under this theory:
-there was no Sammy
-there was no burgulary
-there was no attack
-there was no John Q
-Lenny killed his wife (when she tested him the same way Sammy's wife tested him in teh film)
-Lenny couldn't accept the fact that he killed his wife, so invented the burgulary/attack/JohnQ scenario
-Teddy still used Lenny just as in the conventional interpretation (1) above, as from Teddy's standpoint its still the same: a vunerable guy with a short-term memory loss condition who thinks a guy named "John Q" murders his wife. The difference in (2) is it never happened. In (1) , it did happen. But for Teddy's purposes, Lenny is still just as manipulatable.
-did Sammy exist? No, not under this theory. This theory is similar to SHutter Island, where Dicaprio's character can't accept his actions, so gives himself another identity and sets out to solve an unsolvable crime!
-Strong support for intepretation (2): Teddy tells Lenny this information at the end of the film, which is the chronological beginning of the film. What does Lenny do when he learns this information? He "lies to himself to be happy" (one of last lines in the film) by writing down Teddy's license tag, so he can go back to being Lenny in "John Q hunting mode". Once again, when confronted with the truth, he rejects it and "lies to himself to be happy", because the alternative (truth that he killed his wife) is unbearable. The chronological rest of the film (what we already saw before that) is just him living out that lie.
-I like theory (2) over theory (1) because its more fascinating and narrows in on the fact that the mind is a powerful thing, almost an independent entity apart from us, that can adapt to inputs and take corrective actions that it sees fit, resulting in people doing unconcious things they never realize!

(3) I've heard of a third interpretation based on

[Show spoiler]a shot later in the film showing Lenny lying in bed with his wife with "I did It" tattoeed on his chest. Can't remember where in the film this happens, but its definitely shown. What does this mean? One interpretation is:
-His wife survived the attack
-Lenny mistakenly thought she died
-Teddy told Lenny she died, so he could use him
-ONce Lenny found out Teddy lied to him and was using him, Lenny killed Teddy
-Hence him lying next to his wife with "I did it" (killed Teddy) on his chest
-I don't think this theory has as much support as (1) and (2), but its still interesting

Originally Posted by Foggy

Problem with the 2nd interpretation is that a Sammy definitely exists, Teddy says during the final scene that

[Show spoiler]Sammy was a phony and that Lenny exposed him for the fake he was. He just seemed to use the personal of Sammy to make himself feel less guilty of his wife's death.

Also there is a brief clip in one of the black and white scenes where you see

[Show spoiler]Sammy sat in a mental ward and as someone walks past you see a quick cut of Lenny sat in his place

, I never caught it until many watches after.

Originally Posted by surfdude12

No, in that portion of the script Teddy is referring to

[Show spoiler]Lenny's invention of Sammy, not Sammy himself. Oh and by the way, I was wrong. Under the 2nd interpretation:
-there was an assault
-Lenny did get hit in the head, which is when the condition started
-His wife survived the assault
-Lenny killed his wife via the insulin injections

TEDDY
(chuckles)
You tell everyone about Sammy. Everyone
who'll listen. "Remember Sammy Jankis,
remember Sammy Jankis". Great story. Gets
better every time you tell it. So you
lie to yourself to be happy. Nothing
wrong with that - we all do. Who cares if
there's a few little things you'd rather
not remember? (SO RIGHT HERE WE ALREADY KNOW THAT SAMMY DOESNT EXIST)

LEONARD
What the **** are you talking about?
TEDDY
(theatrical shrug)
I dunno... your wife surviving the
assault... her not believing about your
condition... the doubt tearing her up
inside.., the insulin -

LEONARD
That's Sammy, not me! I told you about
Sammy -

TEDDY
Like you've told yourself. Over and over.
Conditioning yourself to believe.
"learning through repetition" - (TEDDY POINTING OUT THAT LENNY INVENTED SAMMY)

LEONARD
Sammy let his wife kill herself! Sammy
ended up in an institution - !

TEDDY
Sammy was a con man. A faker. (REFERRING TO LENNY'S INVENTION OF SAMMY)

LEONARD
I never said he was faking! I never said
that!

TEDDY
You exposed him for what he was: a fraud.

LEONARD
I was wrong! That's the whole point!
Sammy's wife came to me and -

TEDDY
Sammy didn't have a wife.
It was your wife who had diabetes.

LEONARD
My wife wasn't diabetic.

TEDDY
Are you sure?

Leonard's Wife on the edge of the bed. She feels a sharp
pain, and turns to Leonard.

LEONARD'S WIFE
Gentle.

Leonard is playfully pinching her thigh.

LEONARD
She wasn't diabetic. You think I don't *
know my own wife? What the **** is wrong *
with you? *

TEDDY
(shrugs)
I guess I can only make you believe the
things you want to be true, huh? Like ol' *
Jimmy down there.

That just reaffirms that

[Show spoiler]Lenny is Sammy

Interpretation #2 has always jived with me the most, so I'm with surfdude.

[Show spoiler]Lenny and Sammy are one and the same, and I believe Teddy's lines mean to say that Sammy is a mental invention, and therefore a "fake."

[Foggy]

Originally Posted by surfdude12

TEDDY
Sammy was a con man. A faker. (REFERRING TO LENNY'S INVENTION OF SAMMY)

LEONARD
I never said he was faking! I never said
that!

TEDDY
You exposed him for what he was: a fraud.

That just reaffirms that

[Show spoiler]Lenny is Sammy

But this line alludes to Sammy being real, and Lenny exposing him.

[Show spoiler]I'm not saying that Sammy and Lenny aren't/can't the same, but that there was really a Sammy Jankis. I always took it that Lenny took what happened to him and applied it to the story of Sammy.

[surfdude12]

Originally Posted by Foggy

But this line alludes to Sammy being real, and Lenny exposing him.

[Show spoiler]I'm not saying that Sammy and Lenny aren't/can't the same, but that there was really a Sammy Jankis. I always took it that Lenny took what happened to him and applied it to the story of Sammy.

In the film: Lenny

[Show spoiler]exposed Sammy as a fraud just before he told Sammy's wife that Sammy should be able to form new memories, after which Sammy's wife went home and tested him with the fatal insulin injection experiment.

In reality:

[Show spoiler] we know that it was Lenny's wife, not Sammy's wife, who was the diabetic, so the whole "fraud" and "should be able to form new memories" was something the Insurance company told Lenny's wife, which caused her to have Lenny over-inject her. It was Lenny, not Sammy, who the insurance thought was a fraud.

I see where you're going

[Show spoiler] with that. I suppose its possible that a real Sammy Jankis existed, but he wasn't the Sammy Jankis in the film. I think that's what interpretation (2) is saying.
Lenny experienced everything that the Sammy Jankis in the film did:
-same mental condition
-had a wife
-wife had diabetes
-killed wife when she tested his condition after Lenny's wife (not Sammy's wife) was told by the Insuance agent (Lenny in the film) that Lenny should be able to form new memories.

So who was the real Sammy Jankis? He could have been some single dude with a mental condition (hence Teddy saying "Sammy didn't have a wife"), but I'm not sure what we're told about him?

If there was a real Sammy, I don't think he could have been the Sammy in the film. What are the chances that Lenny (a) read about a real Sammy who has a mental memory condition, a diabetic wife, and how he killed his wife via. insulin injections and then (b) coincidentally Lenny gets the same condition, also coincidentally has a diabetic wife and also then coincidentally kills his wife in the same way (unknowingly)? Literally impossible.

[Al_The_Strange]

Next greatest blind-buy: "Executioners from Shaolin."

I've found that it takes a lot for me to really enjoy a Shaw Bros film. They've made a bunch of these kung fu films, but most of them come off as overly cheap and cheesy, and often with weak, unmemorable stories. Sure, there's a few bright spots with "The 36th Chamber of Shaolin," "Come Drink With Me," and "Brothers Five." But last time I tried out a batch of these films (namely, "Journey of the Doomed," "Holy Sword of the Martial World," "Brave Archer and His Mate," and something else), I hated them all.

So, I wasn't expecting much out of "Executioners from Shaolin." Right from the start, however, the action started off strong and remained strong throughout. The fight scenes are fast and choreographed brilliantly. You can definitely see the different martial arts styles on full display, for both playful and brutal effect, and it's pretty darn fun throughout.

Fortunately, the story for this is not too terrible. It has the standard "you killed my master" revenge setup , but it maintains strong focus on the characters and their training/development. It's especially charming to see their interactions as a family unit. As the characters emphasize the difference and separation of the crane and tiger styles of fighting, it struck me that they represented the essence of the female and male soul respectively; the two needed to be united in a proper ying-yang fashion in order for the characters to succeed in their struggle. I thought that was a nice implicit theme.

Unlike other Shaw Bros films, this one doesn't appear all that cheap; it does have some old-school photography and editing effects, but the production value has good-looking sets, props, and costumes. It only looks fake in certain spots. Acting is a bit cheesy (and the English voice-over is awful), and the writing shows a little too much exposition. Music is alright.

4/5 (entertainment: 4.5/5, story: 4/5, film: 3.5/5)

Recommendation: For fans of the genre, or fans of the Shaw Bros.

Notes:

• There's a brief fight scene involving chopsticks, which reminded me a bit of "Kung Fu Panda." It's likely an unintentional similarity.
• What isn't an unintentional similarity is the use of a certain character: Pei Mei. The same Pei Mei from "Kill Bill." I was really stoked to see him in this film, and was shocked to see that he's the bad guy!
• There are some strange gender issues with some of these characters. First off, the characters manage to hit Pei Mei's groin in the fights...and nothing happens. Pei Mei looks down on the guy and says "well, can you find it?" Seriously? Pei Mei has no balls?! Not to mention, his groin then sucks in the guy's foot, and he drags him all around the courtyard...WTF?! And...oh yeah, the guy's son looks kinda gay (probably intentionally, since he learned the girly crane style throughout his life).

One of the fight scenes in question can be viewed here:

[Show spoiler]

Pai Mei vs Shaolin Rebel - YouTube

[SquidPuppet]

Originally Posted by Al_The_Strange

Next greatest blind-buy: "Executioners from Shaolin."

One of the fight scenes in question can be viewed here:

Wow. That is epic badness.

[Al_The_Strange]

Originally Posted by SquidPuppet

Wow. That is epic badness.

I know, right? I love the way the guy just kept rolling and rolling and rolling down those stairs...

[SquidPuppet]

Originally Posted by Al_The_Strange

I know, right? I love the way the guy just kept rolling and rolling and rolling down those stairs...

There were dozens of punches and kicks that missed their target by a solid 10-12 inches. Not even cloooooose. Duh. Yet the victims still suffered the impact from the blow. Ha ha ha.

I got sea sick from the zoom-in-zoom-out-zoom-in-zoom-out-zoom-in-zoom-out.