Physical & Digital EST: The Future of Home Video Discussion Thread

[bhampton]

Originally Posted by Lee A Stewart

[Show spoiler]

[Show spoiler]

Criterion Collection 4K UHD BD Citizen Kane Cover

Just saw the price of this.

Glad Mulholland Drive is cheaper, that's the first one I'll get.

[crutzulee]

After being banned for a week, I'M LOVING all the micro aggression, subtle name calling and judgemental attitude in this thread.. keep it coming LOL..

I'm the sucker, loser, lowest common denominator fool that's responsible for ruining movies for everyone with my buying habits.. as a lifelong movie lover, I've been on ALL sides of this argument.
I first fell in love with movies when it was a special event to walk into a grand movie house, with a circular staircase leading to a balcony. I saw STAR WARS this way. These gave way to multiplexes and Drive ins for my teenaged years. I missed a lot of films at the drive in once I got my license...
The change from going to the cinema for "date night" and my preference for home presentation was gradual, with many years of overlap. As far as patience was concerned, I had to exert more than any of you today. I would often wait, and make my girlfriend and first wife wait months, sometimes years for a home viewing until the LD was available. I didn't resist grabbing the latest tittle from blockbuster because of superior resolution or digital sound (although those came in to play as my HT improved)..no, for me, even on a smaller screen, I needed the black bars that everyone else back then hated..
DVD was great for me because, I could finally get movies OAR, day and date with VHS! Although I stopped being a collector because the packaging of every type of media since has been a joke. Once you've held a beautiful gatefold LD or Vinyl boxed set in your hands, you'll stop being so precious about blurays and UHDs and see that their only benefit is in the superior presentation when the lights go down...
And speaking of that, I remember watching my LDs on my big 3 gun Sony projector with a line doubler and an old JVC prologic sound system to extract a rear center channel from my Pioneer Dolby digital amp from a modified LD player that could extract the AC3 stream from my Japanese import of THE PHANTOM MENACE (which my wife paid $250 for back when that amount was worth something sonny).
I remember referring to that presentation as "filmlike" just as many publications of the day did when they reviewed LDs..I chuckle at those of you that deride the quality of streaming movies today as though it's for the unwashed masses. It ABSOLUTELY DESTROYS what us HT aficionados of the past had.
Tarantino is the only film maker that gets me into the cinema today and I always seek out the film presentation. I absolutely tear up when I watch my UHDs of THE DEERHUNTER and THE SHINING. I recently presented TRUE ROMANCE for my kids and it was like a new movie to me.
But for most of the pedestrian drek that gets shoveled out hot and fresh every week?.. I'm more than happy with the 4K stream with DD+ ATMOS sound. I sit 10 feet away from a 120" 4K projected image and a decent 7.4.4 sound system in a modestly appointed dedicated room. It is more than good enough for me. I love shortened windows from theatrical release to home presentation and don't think I'm jeopardizing theatrical releases one bit.. I've been hearing that crap since VHS was able to finally cram a 2 hour movie on to single tape..hell long before my time, the invention of the TV was supposed to close movie houses...
Movies will always be made, there will always be a market for theatrical presentation. The studios will always find a way to maximize profits. This pandemic has just given them an opportunity to play with windows until they find the optimal solution.. there's room for all of us.

[alchav21]

Originally Posted by Ender14

Yes, I've seen that as well. But as someone pointed out the UHD's will only be about $5 more during the sales throughout the year. $5 for a UHD upgrade is very reasonable in my opinion.

Buying Quality 4K Discs the prices keep going up, you say only $5 when the average BD is $20 does that mean $25? You call us Digital people Suckers for buying and enjoying Streaming. The Theatrical window is going 45 days for Streaming, and longer for Discs because of the work to produce this product. Here is a Video from John Campea talking about PM!

Will WandaVision, Loki Or Other Disney+ Shows Get Blu-Ray Releases - YouTube

[cheez avenger]

My True Romance and Cat O Nine Tails 4K discs arrived today from DiabolikDVD. The shipping box had a dent in it that transferred over to the the Cat slipbox a bit. It's the coveted "Arte Original" edition, too. DD's shipping policy is that they are not responsible for items damaged in transit.

[Ender14]

Originally Posted by cheez avenger

My True Romance and Cat O Nine Tails 4K discs arrived today from DiabolikDVD. The box had a dent in it that transferred over to the the Cat box that caved in the slipbox a bit. It's the coveted "Arte Original" edition, too. DD's shipping policy is that they are not responsible for items damaged in transit.

Wow, I'm sorry. That sucks. I've never had a problem like that from Diabolik. They package their stuff well so the courier really had to treat it roughly to damage the slipbox.

[cheez avenger]

Originally Posted by Ender14

Wow, I'm sorry. That sucks. I've never had a problem like that from Diabolik. They package their stuff well so the courier really had to treat it roughly to damage the slipbox.

Me neither, and I still have 2-3 orders pending with them.

[cheez avenger]

The irony is that I received the new Labyrinth 35th anniversary 4K today and it was delivered via UPS in one of those oversized Amazon bubble envelopes and it was in mint condition. C'est la vie.

[Ender14]

Originally Posted by alchav21

Buying Quality 4K Discs the prices keep going up, you say only $5 when the average BD is $20 does that mean $25? You call us Digital people Suckers for buying and enjoying Streaming. The Theatrical window is going 45 days for Streaming, and longer for Discs because of the work to produce this product. Here is a Video from John Campea talking about PM!

Will WandaVision, Loki Or Other Disney+ Shows Get Blu-Ray Releases - YouTube

I rarely pay $20 for a regular Blu-ray and many of the 4K's I get are less than that as well. You can't speak to how much discs cost because you don't buy them. I pay less than $10 for many of my Blu-ray's. Paying $5 more for the UHD version of a Criterion disc is nothing to get bent out of shape about. I will gladly pay the $25 or more premium for Criterion discs because generally they are the best on the market in presentation, extras and packaging.

When it comes to movies I don't care about cheap and convenient. Just as I avoid McDonald's for my meals, I don't want the fast food of movies. I will spend the little extra time and money for something of quality. And something that is mine until I decide it isn't, not when someone else decides.

And I apologized for my suckers statement so not sure why you felt the need to bring that up again.

[unberechenbar]

ordered these:

Trying to keep my expectations low for Sicario 2 but the first one was just so good. I don't mind paying more for the superior product.

[cheez avenger]

Originally Posted by unberechenbar

ordered these:

Trying to keep my expectations low for Sicario 2 but the first one was just so good. I don't mind paying more for the superior product.

Sicario 2 is awesome. The rest are not.

[Ender14]

Originally Posted by unberechenbar

ordered these:

Trying to keep my expectations low for Sicario 2 but the first one was just so good. I don't mind paying more for the superior product.

Originally Posted by cheez avenger

Sicario 2 is awesome. The rest are not.

Have to agree with Cheez on this one. The other 3 are very mediocre. But there are plenty of mediocre movies I love so hopefully you will like them.

[cheez avenger]

I should have said that I actually own Monster Hunter 4K on disc because I think Paul WS Anderson films are typically so bad that that they still can connect on a basic level. Soldado has never come down in price for me to buy on 4K disc, but think it's an awesome entry into the franchise. Skyscraper and TR are unwatchable trash, though.

[slimjean]

Originally Posted by cheez avenger

I should have said that I actually own Monster Hunter 4K on disc because I think Paul WS Anderson films are typically so bad that that they still can connect on a basic level. Soldado has never come down in price for me to buy on 4K disc, but think it's an awesome entry into the franchise. Skyscraper and TR are unwatchable trash, though.

I enjoyed Skyscraper. Not as much as San Andreas but it was fine for stupid action.

[unberechenbar]

Originally Posted by slimjean

I enjoyed Skyscraper. Not as much as San Andreas but it was fine for stupid action.

San Andreas is on my wishlist but I'm trying to find one with a slipcover for a reasonable price.

[veritas]

Originally Posted by alchav21

Buying Quality 4K Discs the prices keep going up, you say only $5 when the average BD is $20 does that mean $25? You call us Digital people Suckers for buying and enjoying Streaming. The Theatrical window is going 45 days for Streaming, and longer for Discs because of the work to produce this product.

I haven't noticed a price increase and my demand is pretty price elastic. Its kind of hard to price anything these days since releases have been so screwed up with the pandemic.

Its been a pretty light year for me overall mostly just buying catalog releases lately. I'm kind of interested in suicide squad and free guy but I'll have to wait till they come out and see if I'm still in the mood.

[alchav21]

Originally Posted by Ender14

I rarely pay $20 for a regular Blu-ray and many of the 4K's I get are less than that as well. You can't speak to how much discs cost because you don't buy them. I pay less than $10 for many of my Blu-ray's. Paying $5 more for the UHD version of a Criterion disc is nothing to get bent out of shape about. I will gladly pay the $25 or more premium for Criterion discs because generally they are the best on the market in presentation, extras and packaging.

When it comes to movies I don't care about cheap and convenient. Just as I avoid McDonald's for my meals, I don't want the fast food of movies. I will spend the little extra time and money for something of quality. And something that is mine until I decide it isn't, not when someone else decides.

I was going by the Sales Report that usually averages BD at around $20, so $25 would be UHD 4K pricing. If you pay that price they will probably keep making them for you. As for the Quality of Disc or Streaming IMO it's all Subjective depending on your setup and equipment. Also when it comes to my Digital Collection I have not lost anything, and I'm closing in on a Decade!

[veritas]

Originally Posted by alchav21

I was going by the Sales Report that usually averages BD at around $20, so $25 would be UHD 4K pricing. If you pay that price they will probably keep making them for you. As for the Quality of Disc or Streaming IMO it's all Subjective depending on your setup and equipment. Also when it comes to my Digital Collection I have not lost anything, and I'm closing in on a Decade!

Discs are objectively better. less compression less banding less aliasing better sound options with less loss in general. Ya your set up could be the limiting factor so it doesnt take advantage of what discs have to offer but that doesnt make streaming equal to disc it just makes your set up worse then other set ups.

by your logic I could get out a tube televison and and say vhs is the pinnacle of audio/ video quality because that is the highest bit rate that tv could handle.

[alchav21]

Originally Posted by veritas

Discs are objectively better. less compression less banding less aliasing better sound options with less loss in general. Ya your set up could be the limiting factor so it doesnt take advantage of what discs have to offer but that doesnt make streaming equal to disc it just makes your set up worse then other set ups.

I disagree because with my setup and equipment I don't see any of that compression, banding, or less sound quality. That's great that you guys love Discs, but you shouldn't put Streaming Digital down because it doesn't look good on your setup and equipment. That's why I say it's Subjective, everyone has to decide for themselves the Quality of their Movie and TV Show needs!

[cheez avenger]

Just pre-ordered these on 4K disc:

Fast 9
Inglorious Basterds
Carlito's Way

Used the 20% off coupon code via the GRUV website.


Now that my back has healed up mostly (I'd say I'm about 90% able bodied) I got my tickets for Night House on Thursday night and The Protege for Friday night. Haven't done a two night in a row viewing in a long ass time. Still trying to figure out the Shang Chi logistics. That one is available at my AMC in Dolby Cinema and IMAX, but the IMAX showtimes seem more agreeable in terms of my schedule, even though I prefer Dolby Cinema.

[slimjean]

Originally Posted by crutzulee

After being banned for a week, I'M LOVING all the micro aggression, subtle name calling and judgemental attitude in this thread.. keep it coming LOL..

Actually I hear a little bit of aggression in this post. Imho

...as a lifelong movie lover, I've been on ALL sides of this argument.

I think most of us debating here could be in the category.

These gave way to multiplexes and Drive ins for my teenaged years. I missed a lot of films at the drive in once I got my license...

I don't quite understand this statement but I consider metroplexes after drive-ins, and since you mention Star Wars drive-ins obviously preceded that. The grand theaters I feel outlived the drive-ins (for the most part) but even then the metroplexes took hold concurrently. I consider both to be almost even deaths with the "grand" edging it out.

Still luxery theaters and drive ins both exist so my vote goes with luxery lasted longer...sorta.

As far as patience was concerned, I had to exert more than any of you today. I would often wait, and make my girlfriend and first wife wait months, sometimes years for a home viewing until the LD was available.

You can't know this to be true. In my household it was the same with my laserdisc player. Then again my wife wasn't made to wait. She was a movie buff same as my wife now who never knew laserdiscs. Wife number one went from laserdisc, from her love of vhs to DVD. So she heard the FM mod and knew the CAV edition over CLV right up to using two amps to have the 6 channel EX using to separate amplifiers for Phantom Menace using an old pro logic amp for back channel (I am sure you know what I mean) with DVD.

I too had a projector but not as flashy. I never appreciated the projected the same because how displays were changing. I loved my LD collection which was nuts, but I also knew the changing storm. It stung but upgrading was always my importance and still is.

Which is why I can't understand settling for a downgrade if one has been in the "game" so long.

I love LD artwork but bluray artwork is fantastic as well. I love LD but man were they annoying with side changes and wonky extras. Even on my Pioneer 503 a long movie still sucked. Laser rot still crept in and you still had occassional playback issues. A quick clean would do it...but not always.

I too loved the widescreen and it was pitiful how VHS tried to compete, but facts are facts, the resolution wasn't there.

What is there is original artist intent and that is why I often prefer LD.

This pandemic has just given them an opportunity to play with windows until they find the optimal solution.. there's room for all of us.

The one thing I agree with. With all your war stories which many of us share, there is one constant. We don't really mind waiting. We just spend elsewhere. A smart studio will notice money going in a specific direction more. Not scared one bit.

You don't pick optimum quality that is on you.

Streaming is less quality lighter alternative. There is really no argument.

You jumped out of physical game. I can't imagine it, but I respect your priorities because I don't pay your bills.