Viz Licenses Original Sailor Moon Anime Franchise

[BigOnAnime]

Originally Posted by goofystitch

WB is the distributor for Viz. Discs and packaging cost very little. If they can get two consumers to pay $60 when they otherwise would avoid a release at $80, then thats $120 vs. $80 for Viz. The number of people willing to buy increases as the price goes down. Their marketing team could have done a MUCH better job figuring out the best price to sell the most copies while still making them more money. Despite negative fan reaction, Sailor Moon Crystal has a built-in fanbase and would sell much better AND make Viz much more money if it were priced appropriately. Many fans on this forum agree and will tell Viz the price is too high by refusing to buy it. That means they're losing money.

This place is so far the only place I've seen any sorts of complaints about the pricing, so they're going to be fine. And losing money is doubtful given it's going to still sell anyway.

Earlier you said that Sailor Moon was the number one show on Hulu. As a Hulu subscriber, I've noticed SMC is consistently higher on the list of popular shows than the classic anime. If it wasn't profitable for Viz to put the series on Hulu, then they wouldn't be doing it. Like a mainstream series, they've already made money on SMC. And again, SM and SMC aren't your typical obscure anime, they are much more mainstream than that.

For a while it was, and streaming is NOT a replacement for discs as far as anime is concerned. Yes you can make money, but that's off the streaming license, home video rights are a much more expensive thing. Plus there's the dub, which for most anime (Not in this case as Sailor Moon had to be REALLY, REALLY expensive to license) costs more to do than it does to license the show. The dubbing costs averages to about $10,000+ per episode these days.

I think you're forgetting the way home media consumption has changed over the years. When anime was selling singles, so were other companies. At the same time I was collecting Pioneer's SM singles, I was also buying I Love Lucy in singles. The market shifted to collection sets and Anime has done the same. You referenced DBZ, which has since been repackaged and is available at standard blu-ray prices, not standard anime prices. Because like SM, DBZ is more mainstream.

I'm aware of the move, and as far as anime is concerned, moving to singles was a mistake as I mentioned earlier, sales are lower due to the price dropping so hard and there not being much of an increase in sales to offset it. Only on longer shows did it make sense to drop singles. The move to box sets was done because of retailers, and the market crash. Geneon went under in 2007, and ADV was starting to show signs of going under due to some of their poor decisions, though ultimately it was the Sojitz deal that screwed them over.

Right. For most anime that most people have never heard of, a lower price won't help because there's not an increase in demand for the show. SM and SMC are completely different beasts. You might as well not think of them as anime when it comes to home media sales. Viz's inability to realize this will only hurt themselves.

More Sailor Moon than Sailor Moon Crystal as Crystal isn't known anywhere near as well as the original among the general consumer. And VIZ is fine given what they've got going for them.

I don't like the price and I don't intend on buying this release until it comes down to a more reasonable amount. Plenty of fans feel the same way and Viz is going to be surprised by the lower than expected volume of sales. Again, with an SRP of $60, they stand to make way more than they do at $80. That high price even discourages retail stores from stocking it because who in their right mind is going to pay that? Only diehard anime fans who are used to having to pay inflated prices for obscure content. For proof of this, try to find Sailor Moon on Blu-Ray at Wal Mart or Target. Then look to see if they have DBZ, which they do stock... and it's under $30 per season and is a Toei Animation product. Funimation understands that they can make MORE money by selling it at a less expensive price because it appeals to general consumers, not just anime fans.

I don't think they're going to be surprised as they know for a fact it's going to sell lower than the original. And yes, I know, B&M stores have been stocking pretty much only the DVD, which among the general consumer is still more popular than Blu-ray. They're expecting to sell more DVD's among the general consumer than Blu-ray. With DBZ, you're forgetting how long it's been on the market and how long FUNimation has had the license (20 years), along with the many, many, many releases its had (And this isn't everything, and there's been at least one DBZ release a year since the 90's), to the point they've confused the DBZ consumer numerous times. They made their money on DBZ long ago, it costs them almost nothing to keep re-releasing it. And it should be noted when the Orange Bricks first hit, they were priced at $50 MSRP, they didn't become $35 until 2010. The first DBZ BD's were priced at $35 for 17 or so episodes (To cover the very high costs of remastering the original film), and the new ones (Which were cheaply "remastered") are priced at $45 MSRP.

VIZ Media meanwhile hasn't made very much off SMC, especially considering they were only streaming it at the time, not putting out the discs. Streaming rights and home video rights are two different things. Although they can be bundled together, which is becoming more common these days to make the contracts simpler. Which for VIZ with SMC was already the case, they still have yet to make the money back on the home video rights.

As my closing argument, if the anime licenses are that expensive, why can Viz afford to sell the series digitally at a lower price? Packaging and discs cost nothing compared to the price of a Blu-Ray release, the real cost is the content. Fans can get all of Sailor Moon R in "HD" with the dub on iTunes for $79.98. Based on Right Stuf sale prices for the non-limited parts 1 and 2 on Blu-Ray, it costs $111.18. No deluxe packaging there. For most companies, digital media costs more than package media, but Viz has no problem making less money on digital sales. So please, tell me again why Viz HAS to sell SMC for $70-$80 on Blu-Ray when the iTunes HD version will be around $40?

You've got me there on digital, but it's probably the same reason why FUNi does $2 digital downloads, as well as Sentai Filmworks. The discs though are still the most important thing as digital and streaming don't make anywhere near as much money, and with licenses apparently skyrocketing back to these prices on bigger titles, you definitely need the discs (As I mentioned earlier, streaming being bundled with home video rights is becoming more common). VIZ most definitely paid WAY, WAY more than that for all of Sailor Moon. Given that after grabbing Sailor Moon early last year, they licensed zero anime titles (They did grab manga, which is what they mainly focus on) until a few months ago such as One Punch-Man (A surefire hit for them, the manga does really well for them), it probably cut a very deep hole in their pockets.

Originally Posted by kevers7290

Right on. I wouldn't mind paying the high price for Sailor Moon if the VQ was up to snuff with the price point. Aniplex releases will eat a hole in your wallet but at least the quality of their blu-rays reflects their high price. IMO Viz's prices on the Sailor Moon classic sets are inexcusable.

AoA's pricing has nothing to do with the video quality. It's done because they do the model of selling for higher, and expecting to sell lower, but make more money that way. Also to defeat reverse-importation (These BD's come out not long after the Japanese releases), and because they can.
-----------------------------------
More reasons for me to dislike Toei, we're getting screwed over again. So not only do the Japanese BD's have no clean second OP, the international markets haven't been getting it, and are stuck with this (We'll find out with VIZ when the dub of ep 15 hits).
http://www.sailormoonforum.com/viewt...801088#p801088

[Vlad Draculi]

I'm sorry, but I fail to see how that is an issue. You do know that the brightness system between the US and Japan is different, right? US releases are supposed to have the brightness tweaked and upped compared to Japan.

[goofystitch]

Originally Posted by BigOnAnime

This place is so far the only place I've seen any sorts of complaints about the pricing, so they're going to be fine.

I'm sure your typical anime forum doesn't have many non-anime consumers chatting. I personally only found out this section of BD.com existed when the original SM thread was moved from the US section, but I've seen several upset fans on both Viz Media's Facebook page as well as Twitter during the Moonlight Party. At any rate, Viz is going to do what they're going to do. The dub on SMC is nice, but I don't love it enough to need to own it until the price goes way down. In that respect, if they're going to set the price so freakishly high that it prices the general SM fan out, then your original point is right. They need to charge more to break even.

I also didn't realize that Viz had to stop licensing other anime series for a while to bounce back. I knew Sailor Moon was incredibly expensive and that there were bidding wars with other anime companies. They must be kicking themselves that the video quality is so poor that fans are now holding off to import the BadMan Australian DVDs instead of continuing to support their release. Again, more mistakes from Viz on a series that is not obscure and could have made way more money priced more competitively.

[Norbie]

I've just quickly scanned through this forum so I apologize if this has already been mentioned.......

Some/A lot of people have been critical of the transfers provided by Viz which is a shame after what the gave us with Ranma 1/2.

One of the best mentioned transfers around is the Italian DVD, however it's not English friendly. Well, there now is one.......

https://www.madman.com.au/catalogue/...imited-edition

Enjoy.

[prophetic]

Sorry if this has been mentioned before, but I don't pop in to this thread too often. I called Warner Brothers today to see where my replacement discs are, and they said they don't have them yet. They hope to be sending them out "soon."

[BigOnAnime]

Originally Posted by goofystitch

I also didn't realize that Viz had to stop licensing other anime series for a while to bounce back. I knew Sailor Moon was incredibly expensive and that there were bidding wars with other anime companies. They must be kicking themselves that the video quality is so poor that fans are now holding off to import the BadMan Australian DVDs instead of continuing to support their release. Again, more mistakes from Viz on a series that is not obscure and could have made way more money priced more competitively.

Yep, they had grabbed some series in 2013, the last one being Coppelion (Fall 2013), and after they got Sailor Moon, you can see here (Scroll down to VIZ), they licensed nothing for over a year. People actually got a bit worried and rather frustrated because of the lack of licenses from them. Only manga was still going for them (Which is where they put most of their attention).

Also, despite the poor video quality, Sailor Moon is selling well (6 minute mark). Your average joe thinks it looks fine (Are they blind?), and will buy it just because it says Sailor Moon on it, similar to the people that buy FUNi's awful DBZ releases just because it says DBZ on it. Which is why they aren't bothering to fix it, why fix it if it's still selling? Just ugh....

Originally Posted by Norbie

I've just quickly scanned through this forum so I apologize if this has already been mentioned.......

Some/A lot of people have been critical of the transfers provided by Viz which is a shame after what the gave us with Ranma 1/2.

One of the best mentioned transfers around is the Italian DVD, however it's not English friendly. Well, there now is one.......

https://www.madman.com.au/catalogue/...imited-edition

Enjoy.

So I've recently heard, and surprisingly it's NTSC, not PAL, so nobody has to deal with that awful PAL speedup. As much as it pains me to do so (I was not happy with what VIZ did either, and that ANNCast made it worse), I'll be completing VIZ's release, then sometime later on importing the Australian release which will actually treat the show with more respect.

Only hope we have for any good video quality from VIZ are the movies if Toei properly remasters them. The only time Toei gives a crap is with movies, despite the grain removal (Think Cardcaptor Sakura and YuYu Hakusho BD's).

Originally Posted by prophetic

Sorry if this has been mentioned before, but I don't pop in to this thread too often. I called Warner Brothers today to see where my replacement discs are, and they said they don't have them yet. They hope to be sending them out "soon."

Well that's strange, last night I finally called them, and they said it would come in like 2 weeks. Also the guy wondered what I meant by "I have the combo pack"... The big studios are HUGE proponents of combo packs, so how do you not get that, and have to further make me clarify that I need both the DVD and BD replacement discs?

[goofystitch]

Originally Posted by prophetic

Sorry if this has been mentioned before, but I don't pop in to this thread too often. I called Warner Brothers today to see where my replacement discs are, and they said they don't have them yet. They hope to be sending them out "soon."

I'm not all that surprised. Two weeks seemed like a really quick turn around to press and ship discs. The rep I talked to quoted me 3-5 weeks. Plus the corrected sets have pre-orders on Amazon.com with a release date of December 29th, so I'm guessing they won't have the discs available to ship for at least another week or two.

[goofystitch]

Originally Posted by BigOnAnime

Yep, they had grabbed some series in 2013, the last one being Coppelion (Fall 2013), and after they got Sailor Moon, you can see here (Scroll down to VIZ), they licensed nothing for over a year. People actually got a bit worried and rather frustrated because of the lack of licenses from them. Only manga was still going for them (Which is where they put most of their attention).

Also, despite the poor video quality, Sailor Moon is selling well (6 minute mark). Your average joe thinks it looks fine (Are they blind?), and will buy it just because it says Sailor Moon on it, similar to the people that buy FUNi's awful DBZ releases just because it says DBZ on it. Which is why they aren't bothering to fix it, why fix it if it's still selling? Just ugh....

Thanks for sharing those Charlene Ingram tweets. To me, she's part of the major problem with Viz's Sailor Moon releases. I don't know her personally, nor can I comment on the quality of her work within Viz, but she is sort of the face of Viz Media's Sailor Moon and hearing her talk in that podcast about how the DVD pillarbox issue made it "a collectable" and how she's a videophile and yadda yadda yadda. I just can't stand to watch her represent it as a property anymore. She can't give anybody honest answers. All she needed to say was "Replacing the discs for every DVD set released would be too costly and we simply can't afford it." She has a very condescending tone, even in those tweets, for example: "Video sales numbers are rarely made public. This is nothing new. SM is still doing great. Plz don't speculate."

Despite matching the price of the SMC set, the classic anime pricing doesn't feel as bad because each set is around 23 episodes. The episode price comes out to about $2.50 a piece, which isn't much more than the digital price. I think Viz just assumed that they would slip SMC into their release schedule, delaying S by about 6 months to accommodate it. Since fans were planning to spend this same amount of money on that delayed release, why wouldn't they pony it up for the new show? Well, I don't need to retread this forum on the problems with SMC. The bottom line is that for my dollar (and many other fans), I don't need to own it until the price is reasonable.

SMC = Sailor Moon Crystal for anybody thinking I'm talking about the fan restoration group, Sailor Moon Center.

[BigOnAnime]

Originally Posted by goofystitch

Thanks for sharing those Charlene Ingram tweets. To me, she's part of the major problem with Viz's Sailor Moon releases. I don't know her personally, nor can I comment on the quality of her work within Viz, but she is sort of the face of Viz Media's Sailor Moon and hearing her talk in that podcast about how the DVD pillarbox issue made it "a collectable" and how she's a videophile and yadda yadda yadda. I just can't stand to watch her represent it as a property anymore. She can't give anybody honest answers. All she needed to say was "Replacing the discs for every DVD set released would be too costly and we simply can't afford it." She has a very condescending tone, even in those tweets, for example: "Video sales numbers are rarely made public. This is nothing new. SM is still doing great. Plz don't speculate."

It's standard damage control, sadly. VIZ's attempt at it was just really poor about the whole thing, similar to how bad FUNimation is also at damage control ("Our BD's don't look like shit, your equipment is the problem!"). FUNi though is far worse at PR, it's junk at this point, like they have people from Ubisoft doing it. Anyway she wasn't the one claiming to be a videophile, that would be Julie McDonald who put out most of the poor damage control statements in that ANNCast.

Charlene though genuinely cares about the products she works on (She doesn't deal with video quality though, doubt she does). After leaving FUNimation in mid 2012, FUNi began to become worse (Disc art for example suddenly disappeared, along with their QC), and VIZ meanwhile started to become better. She's pretty much responsible for causing VIZ to get in the LE game which they hadn't been in since they first started releasing Naruto Shippuden before dropping the LE's on that series. Heck, VIZ started to pick up more titles and release them, before they were just doing Naruto, Bleach, and Pokemon which highly irritated people.

Still, she could have helped handle the whole situation with the negative feedback much better than she did. Really wish VIZ had been more honest, I appreciate it when companies are able to admit their faults and not trying to sweep them under the rug. Sadly VIZ didn't do that, thus making consumers like me more angry.

[TheAnimeLegend]

I received my Sailor Moon LE Part 1 and Part 2 Blu-ray/DVD Combo Pack and checked the discs and of course, they are the faulty ones I contacted Warner Bros. and they told me I should get my replacement in the next two weeks

[Snl40boi]

Ha anyone received their replacement discs yet? Mine haven't arrived yet.

Also does anyone know if any stores already have Crystal English dub blu Ray for pre order?

[pikagreg]

Originally Posted by Snl40boi

Ha anyone received their replacement discs yet? Mine haven't arrived yet.

Also does anyone know if any stores already have Crystal English dub blu Ray for pre order?

Nothing here yet. Amazon has a placeholder though I would just wait for the price to go down or if TRSI has some pre-order bonuses again.

[prophetic]

Originally Posted by Snl40boi

Ha anyone received their replacement discs yet? Mine haven't arrived yet.

Also does anyone know if any stores already have Crystal English dub blu Ray for pre order?

I just so happened to have called them yesterday. WB doesn't even have the replacement discs yet.

[Misha]

Originally Posted by Vlad Draculi

You do know that the brightness system between the US and Japan is different, right? US releases are supposed to have the brightness tweaked and upped compared to Japan.

Uh... Wait, what?

[jPod]

So, I went to my local JB HI-FI store and asked if they had the Sailor Moon Season 1 Part 1 Limited Edition DVD in stock... AND THEY DID! The official release date is actually December 2 in Australia, but the staff were generous enough to give it to me early... FOR 20% OFF THE ACTUAL PRICE!!



There were no words to describe just how relieved I was when I began watching the first episode of Madman's release of Sailor Moon. The video quality is absolutely stunning for DVD. There's no ghosting during fast movements and there's no heavy DNR applied. No issues whatsoever!

It appears as though Madman obtained the Italian masters for their release of Sailor Moon on DVD. And, honestly, I think I'm going to stick with Madman's release and just sell my copies of Season One and Season Two of Viz Media's atrocious Blu-Ray/DVD release.

Now, I know this is just my opinion, so please feel free to object, but I highly recommend purchasing Madman's release and just selling Viz Media's Blu-Ray/DVD online. If you have a multi-region DVD player, then you're pretty much set.

[jonno394]

Originally Posted by jPod

Could you take a few more pictures of the release please

[Scarface32]

Originally Posted by prophetic

I just so happened to have called them yesterday. WB doesn't even have the replacement discs yet.

I just got off the phone with them, still nothing.

[Snl40boi]

Originally Posted by Scarface32

I just got off the phone with them, still nothing.

Still? What's going on

[jPod]

Originally Posted by jonno394

Could you take a few more pictures of the release please

Are you referring to the packaging? It's pretty much the same as Viz Media's Limited Edition release. However, I can take some photos when I get home from work.

[jonno394]

Originally Posted by jPod

Are you referring to the packaging? It's pretty much the same as Viz Media's Limited Edition release. However, I can take some photos when I get home from work.

Just one or two would be great so I could just fully judge before buying