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Old 04-27-2017, 12:51 AM   #3841
whipnet whipnet is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PenguinMaster View Post
UltraViolet doesn't determine the law. The fact that they don't want you to resell the codes doesn't make it illegal.
Absolutely.

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Old 04-27-2017, 12:59 AM   #3842
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whipnet View Post
Selling codes may not be illegal, but it's not legal.

Here's what Ultraviolet support told me:

......

Regrettably, UltraViolet redemption codes are not for resale. We appreciate you taking the time to contact us, is there anything else we can do to assist you today?
If they regret it, why don't they change their policy?
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Old 04-27-2017, 01:07 AM   #3843
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The very fact that the studios want selling codes to be illegal is clear evidence that they don't want what is best for their customers. They are doing everything they can to make sure that the first sale doctrine doesn't apply to digital content. And digital supporters are apparently willing to accept that for a bit of extra convenience.

Last edited by PenguinMaster; 04-27-2017 at 01:11 AM.
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Old 04-27-2017, 01:27 AM   #3844
alchav21 alchav21 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dynamo of Eternia View Post
Oh look, it's that thing the pro-digital folks said wouldn't happen for years, if ever!

Let me go find a crow so they can eat it...
Quote:
Originally Posted by alchav21 View Post
Do those Crows live in the UK, find this happening a little closer. I don't think you can!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steedeel View Post
It doesn't matter where you are. If they can do it, they can do it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dynamo of Eternia View Post
And what a crappy and dismissive attitude to take towards the UK and anyone who lives there and is effected by this.
The UK and other countries are far behind when it comes to Digital HD Streaming. I don't think most have the Infrastructure or knowledge, that's why they are sticking to Disc and probably SD Streaming. Even here in the US most people don't have the Bandwidth for consistent Digital HD Streaming. Our Copper Infrastructure is Obsolete, and AT&T and Verizon are just waking up to this fact. Digital HD Streaming is just a given, and Disc will fade sooner than anyone thinks!
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Old 04-27-2017, 01:33 AM   #3845
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PenguinMaster View Post
The very fact that the studios want selling codes to be illegal is clear evidence that they don't want what is best for their customers. They are doing everything they can to make sure that the first sale doctrine doesn't apply to digital content. And digital supporters are apparently willing to accept that for a bit of extra convenience.
Well the first sale doctrine, at the moment, only applies to the digital code sheets since digital copies aren't capable for resell. So, the convenience thing doesn't really apply here since it's more about customers not want to pay the full retail price of $14-20 over getting the code for $2-8. Studios think their losing sales and that by getting sales of one-time use codes to become illegal will boost sales. Similar to them cracking down on early code redemptions.
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Old 04-27-2017, 03:50 AM   #3846
Dynamo of Eternia Dynamo of Eternia is offline
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Originally Posted by Jett Rink View Post
Why is this thread even open? It seems like a hotbed for argument and danger.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PenguinMaster View Post
Danger?
I read these two comments, and immediately thought of the song "Secret Agent Man."


"There's a man who leads a life of danger..."



Last edited by Dynamo of Eternia; 04-27-2017 at 03:56 AM.
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Old 04-27-2017, 03:53 AM   #3847
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Originally Posted by alchav21 View Post
The UK and other countries are far behind when it comes to Digital HD Streaming. I don't think most have the Infrastructure or knowledge, that's why they are sticking to Disc and probably SD Streaming. Even here in the US most people don't have the Bandwidth for consistent Digital HD Streaming. Our Copper Infrastructure is Obsolete, and AT&T and Verizon are just waking up to this fact. Digital HD Streaming is just a given, and Disc will fade sooner than anyone thinks!
That was a nice story, grandpa.

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Old 04-27-2017, 04:39 AM   #3848
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alchav21 View Post
The UK and other countries are far behind when it comes to Digital HD Streaming. I don't think most have the Infrastructure or knowledge, that's why they are sticking to Disc and probably SD Streaming. Even here in the US most people don't have the Bandwidth for consistent Digital HD Streaming. Our Copper Infrastructure is Obsolete, and AT&T and Verizon are just waking up to this fact. Digital HD Streaming is just a given, and Disc will fade sooner than anyone thinks!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dynamo of Eternia View Post
That was a nice story, grandpa.
Ha, ha, you Funny Boy...Ha, ha, Funny!
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Old 04-27-2017, 09:19 AM   #3849
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alchav21 View Post
The UK and other countries are far behind when it comes to Digital HD Streaming. I don't think most have the Infrastructure or knowledge, that's why they are sticking to Disc and probably SD Streaming. Even here in the US most people don't have the Bandwidth for consistent Digital HD Streaming. Our Copper Infrastructure is Obsolete, and AT&T and Verizon are just waking up to this fact. Digital HD Streaming is just a given, and Disc will fade sooner than anyone thinks!
We can get 4K streaming absolutely no problem. Whether that's through BT, Sky or Virgin, fast connections are not a issue anymore. I get Netflix 4K and Amazon 4K for example. Although I don't have the equipment yet (next year) I have sampled all kinds of 4K at my friends home and he is on a similar fibre package to me.

Yeah, you keep saying that, and I keep saying to you, we are not seeing the growth. If that number drops or goes minus, it doesn't matter how incredibly fantastic you think Vudu is, it will go under. The industry will lose interest with those type of numbers and the shareholders also. Maybe Vudu will have to switch to a subscription with ads? I can see that happening. Although I'm not sure where Walmart would fit in. People say Digital HD is still a young thing but dipping into single figures is the exact opposite of where a healthy growing business should be IMO. Also, what about expansion. It's all about global dominance these days, Vudu doesn't even offer their services outside the U.S do they?

Finally disc will fade? Yeah, you should write click bait articles online. You would be great. You know, the same one that have predicted the death of the CD for the last 15 years.
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Old 04-27-2017, 12:20 PM   #3850
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You know, the same one that have predicted the death of the CD for the last 15 years.
you mean music CDs? I'm pretty sure they did
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Old 04-27-2017, 01:06 PM   #3851
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you mean music CDs? I'm pretty sure they did
99% of new music is still released on CD. There were over 25,000 new CDs released in the last 90 days in the United States.
That's amazingly good for a format that's apparently been dead for 15 years.

https://www.amazon.com/s?fst=as%3Aof...rnid=387643011

Last edited by PenguinMaster; 04-27-2017 at 02:23 PM.
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Old 04-27-2017, 02:58 PM   #3852
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Originally Posted by Talal86 View Post
you mean music CDs? I'm pretty sure they did
No, they didn't. They were declared dead sure, but the truth is far from it. In fact, CD could easily outlive downloads the way things are looking. It's the usual online bullshit and scrape the barrel articles and bloggers. They just keep saying something is dead every year without any foundation or truth.

Sure, CD isn't as popular as it was, but neither is Duran Duran. Are they dead?

The death of books had been predicted for a long time also. Guess what happened in the U.K last year? Book sales went up and kindle sales dropped.

Us collectors will be fine with another fifteen years of disc. Meantime, you can declare them dead, even when they outlast Digital HD.
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Old 04-27-2017, 03:06 PM   #3853
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Those that don't support digital or UV should totally support a PLEX home media server. That is the best thing since sliced bread. You backup all your DVDs and Blu Rays to the server and stream them to your networked devices with zero quality loss. (No internet connection required after initial server setup) I been so happy since PLEX became available because now even if VUDU never offers a convenient file format I can still enjoy my own perfect quality images on PLEX and really never have to fear losing anything ever. I have all my discs backed up on multiple hard drives and with hard drive space good and cheap these days there are literally no drawbacks. PenguinMaster and Steedeel have either of you ever used PLEX?

Last edited by zodwriter; 04-27-2017 at 03:11 PM.
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Old 04-27-2017, 03:19 PM   #3854
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Those that don't support digital or UV should totally support a PLEX home media server. That is the best thing since sliced bread. You backup all your DVDs and Blu Rays to the server and stream them to your networked devices with zero quality loss. (No internet connection required after initial server setup) I been so happy since PLEX became available because now even if VUDU doesn't offer a convenient file format I enjoy my own perfect quality images on PLEX and really never have to fear losing anything ever. I have all my discs backed up on multiple hard drives and with hard drive space good and cheap these days there are literally no drawbacks. PenguinMaster and Steedeel have either of you ever used PLEX?
There is in my opinion. Having to spend time doing all this is a backdraw, it's a waste of time as far as I'm concerned, I could use that time to watch my movies or to do other things.
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Old 04-27-2017, 03:24 PM   #3855
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Originally Posted by zodwriter View Post
Those that don't support digital or UV should totally support a PLEX home media server. That is the best thing since sliced bread. You backup all your DVDs and Blu Rays to the server and stream them to your networked devices with zero quality loss. (No internet connection required after initial server setup) I been so happy since PLEX became available because now even if VUDU never offers a convenient file format I can still enjoy my own perfect quality images on PLEX and really never have to fear losing anything ever. I have all my discs backed up on multiple hard drives and with hard drive space good and cheap these days there are literally no drawbacks. PenguinMaster and Steedeel have either of you ever used PLEX?
I haven't Zodwriter.
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Old 04-27-2017, 03:26 PM   #3856
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Originally Posted by PenguinMaster View Post
99% of new music is still released on CD. There were over 25,000 new CDs released in the last 90 days in the United States.
That's amazingly good for a format that's apparently been dead for 15 years.

https://www.amazon.com/s?fst=as%3Aof...rnid=387643011
I don't follow music, but isn't Drake one of the biggest musicians now? anyway, his latest album has been out for over a month, but it has yet to get a CD release. yes I know it will come out eventually, but that show you the importance of the format, it's not completely dead, but it's not alive and a well

most recent laptops and cars don't even come with CD drives

when it comes to music, streaming is not the future, it's the present
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Old 04-27-2017, 03:26 PM   #3857
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There is in my opinion. Having to spend time doing all this is a backdraw, it's a waste of time as far as I'm concerned, I could use that time to watch my movies or to do other things.
In the long run it's not a waste of time if you want to make your discs available on all devices. I've gotten to the point where I enjoy it. It's just another part of the process of preserving collections.
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Old 04-27-2017, 03:30 PM   #3858
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Originally Posted by Talal86 View Post
I don't follow music, but isn't Drake one of the biggest musicians now? anyway, his latest album has been out for over a month, but it has yet to get a CD released. yes I know it will come out eventually, but that show you the importance of the format, it's not completely dead, but it's not alive and a well

most recent laptops and cars don't even come with CD drives
when it comes to music, streaming is not the future, it's the present
If people want it, they will wait. All they will do is subscribe for a month and then cancel and get the CD. Over 40's are very attached to CD still.

As a side not, the fact that Drake is so popular makes me weep for the music industry. Those great Brit pop days of Oasis, Pulp, Radiohead, Coldplay and the Manics is well gone.
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Old 04-27-2017, 04:22 PM   #3859
PenguinMaster PenguinMaster is offline
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Originally Posted by zodwriter View Post
Those that don't support digital or UV should totally support a PLEX home media server. That is the best thing since sliced bread. You backup all your DVDs and Blu Rays to the server and stream them to your networked devices with zero quality loss. (No internet connection required after initial server setup) I been so happy since PLEX became available because now even if VUDU never offers a convenient file format I can still enjoy my own perfect quality images on PLEX and really never have to fear losing anything ever. I have all my discs backed up on multiple hard drives and with hard drive space good and cheap these days there are literally no drawbacks. PenguinMaster and Steedeel have either of you ever used PLEX?
I haven't used PLEX because I don't want to spend thousands of dollars on hard drives. I've done the math and the hard drive space needed to back up my entire collection twice would cost around $4,000.

I have no problem with PLEX but it isn't worth it for me personally to spend that amount of money just to avoid switching discs.
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Old 04-27-2017, 04:43 PM   #3860
Dynamo of Eternia Dynamo of Eternia is offline
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Originally Posted by alchav21 View Post
The UK and other countries are far behind when it comes to Digital HD Streaming. I don't think most have the Infrastructure or knowledge, that's why they are sticking to Disc and probably SD Streaming. Even here in the US most people don't have the Bandwidth for consistent Digital HD Streaming. Our Copper Infrastructure is Obsolete, and AT&T and Verizon are just waking up to this fact. Digital HD Streaming is just a given, and Disc will fade sooner than anyone thinks!
As a serious response to this, even if this were true, it still fundamentally has little to nothing to do with the issue at hand regarding this service provider in the UK removing content.

You are talking about infrastructure from the standpoint of delivering content from the source/provider to the end customer (i.e. referring to obsolete copper infrastructure, bandwidth, SD vs HD quality, etc.).

But that really isn't the issue here. This service provider apparently doesn't have much of a problem offering streaming content in general, and apparently the end users are generally able to use it just fine, regardless of whether it is only available in SD or if they also offer it in HD or 4K.

The problem is that the service provider apparently doesn't want to pay for the additional server/hard drive/etc. space that would be required to store all of the existing content that they offer and any and all new, incoming content... and instead are opting to remove some old content to make space for the new content, despite the fact that the information on their site specifically says that people will have access to their purchased content "forever," because somewhere in the fine print is a clause that says content can be removed at any time for any reason. Frankly I consider that to be false advertising. (IMO any kind of digital download/streaming purchases should not be allowed to legally be advertised using terms like "buy" or "own" or "keep forever", since you are at best leasing it, and you don't really own it, it can be taken away at any time).

While their servers and so forth could be considered part of their infrastructure, that's clearly not the sort of thing that you were referring to at all. Plus simply adding additional servers in a building somewhere is no where near as costly or complicated as completely redoing the infrastructure of the wiring and so forth that delivers the content to people's homes.

But none the less, apparently they, as a business whose focus first and foremost is increasing profits while reducing costs, decided that it is not worth the cost to add those additional servers, and instead are removing older content to avoid taking on those costs.... probably (as Penguin Master has stated) because they aren't getting too many more sales on that content and it's just sitting there on their servers (and it probably isn't getting watched nearly as much as newer content, but that's just the nature of the beat. Of course in the short term newer content is going to get more overall views and make more money than older content... it doesn't mean that the older content should be removed, or that the newer content should later be removed when it becomes "old" and is no longer generating huge sales).

This is exactly the sort of thing that people like PenguinMaster and I have been talking about. Even when and if the delivery infrastructure in the US, UK, and anywhere else is properly updated and modernized, it doesn't mean that it will be the end of companies trying to save money and cut corners in manners such as this, especially since new TV and movie content is constantly being created and released, making server space an ongoing issue even after all other aspects of the infrastructure are hypothetically updated properly in a manner that will last for a long, long time before they "need" to be updated again.


Your reply here really made no sense in relation to the topic at hand, and you went off on a fundamentally unrelated tangent (hence my previous "nice story, grandpa" response). That would be like someone complaining that their electrical bill keeps going up despite them making efforts to use less electricity, and you saying that things would be better if the mail service was faster and delivered the bill more quickly (and I know a lot of people do these things electronically these days without physical paper bills, but I'm just using this as an example for comparison). Even if the mail service speed were to substantially increase, it would have no impact on the rate that the customer is being charged by the electric company.


Last edited by Dynamo of Eternia; 04-28-2017 at 03:56 AM.
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