Do those DVD upconverters really work on HD TV's at improving the picture quality?

[Rob J in WNY]

When "reconstituting" a standard-definition 480 pixel movie frame to 1080 pixels (upconversion), the pixel "jaggies" are reduced in a process called "anti-aliasing." This simply means that the higher resolution naturally "fills in" the jaggies, reducing the appearance of the jaggies. Some upconversion algorithms perform better than others at this (such as in attempting to render increased visual detail), but all Blu-ray players currently available will upconvert DVDs to 1080 (1080p over HDMI).

[Suntory_Times]

Originally Posted by Rob J in WNY

When "reconstituting" a standard-definition 480 pixel movie frame to 1080 pixels (upconversion), the pixel "jaggies" are reduced in a process called "anti-aliasing." This simply means that the higher resolution naturally "fills in" the jaggies, reducing the appearance of the jaggies. Some upconversion algorithms perform better than others at this (such as in attempting to render increased visual detail), but all Blu-ray players currently available will upconvert DVDs to 1080 (1080p over HDMI).

and even if they have an older dvd player (please use component or hdmi though, as if you don't the pq will stink), you're screen will upscale anyway.

[enaej1]

I have a pretty large collection of DVD movies. All I can say is, a good DVD upconverter makes watching DVDs on your latest HDTV bearable.

[BillieCassin]

Originally Posted by PaulGo

Yes! A good upscaler can improve on the picture quality by sampling the picture elements and actually improving what is shown on the screen. The PS3 has a very good upscaler and I have seen what it can do. The Oppo has an excellent upscaler and can even produce better results.

However it appears I can not convince you so let's just agree to disagree.

He's just arguing semantics.

Yes, we all know you aren't going to add detail that wasn't already there. However, what he fails at is grasping how this concept applies to the actual viewing experience.

If you hook a plain-old DVD player with component cables, and you hook an upconverting DVD player up via HDMI, YES, they will look different. I've tried quite a few, and while yes quality does vary, the picture indeed looks better. I have done head to head tests with the same discs at the same time.

Now, this is ESPECIALLY going to be true for "Joe Wal-Mart" DVD owner. You know why people are not jumping on Blu-ray but are sticking with their existing DVDs? It's because they can't believe how incredible their DVDs look now. Just the HDTV and an upconverting DVD player, or playing them through a Blu-ray player, is a HUGE step-up in improvement for most people.

Why? Because the average person was watching DVD's with composite ("RCA") cables, *MAYBE* S-Video if they were savvy. Very few analog TV's had component inputs. Watching it through an HDMI connection shows the quality that was there that they never saw before in the same exact DVDs.

So, while you can argue the technicalities or semantics of the situation, the answer is : yes, you will likely see a marked improvement compared to what you were watching before from the same DVD. Is it actually in "HD"? No, it's not. But it's still a step up, and for most people, it seems good enough so far.

[lovgun7]

Yes.

i have one ... its not blu-ray quality but they do improve the picture quality.

even on my back ups which are only 4.7gigs they still look good.

[krazeyeyez]

Originally Posted by BillieCassin

I have done head to head tests with the same discs at the same time.

Out of curiosity have you tried a head to head test allowing your tv to handle the job rather then your upconverter/dvd/blu-player. Unless your tv is low rent their should be no difference which is why these things are snake oil, unless you get into the quality chips like oppo uses.

[BillieCassin]

Originally Posted by krazeyeyez

Out of curiosity have you tried a head to head test allowing your tv to handle the job rather then your upconverter/dvd/blu-player. Unless your tv is low rent their should be no difference which is why these things are snake oil, unless you get into the quality chips like oppo uses.

Yes, that's what I am saying.

I have had two copies of the same DVD, one playing out of a standard DVD player hooked up with component 480p, and another in an upconverting DVD player at 1080p coming out of HDMI. And the latter looked much nicer.

I guess I have a "low rent" TV, because when it gets a 480p image it just blows it up, whereas the upconverting DVD player redraws it into 1080p. Yes, I totally get it isn't REALLY native 1080p...I do understand the concepts involved here. I know no detail not originally there is going to be there. However, I find it a much more pleasing picture is all I can say. /shrug

I agree that a lot of the ads for upconverting DVD players sound really bogus, because what they promise isn't possible. I got one in a round about way (needed a cheap HTIAB) and it came with one, which was nice since I was playing everything out of the Blu-ray player at that point and I often like to have some TV show on DVD set going that I can just leave in and watch whenever. In fact, it plays DVDs better upconverted than my Blu-ray player.

Regardless, this is a largely academic discussion at this point since you really can't buy a non-upconverting DVD player anymore. Any DVD player on the shelf has it, and I'm sure some are better than others. Mine is a Phillips, and it works great for me. Maybe I'm just stupid, but I'm stupid and enjoying the picture on things that aren't available on Blu, which is all that matters.

[Cobra33]

ok, i got a 40 dollars upscaling DVD player, and....the picture quality is the same as when i play a dvd on my bluray player. im guessing now that the bluray player naturally upconverts the DVD, so the quality in picture was the same on a upscaling DVd player as on my bluray player. ok, so at least i tested it, now i got to return it the upscaling dvd player. however, what is an oppo dvd player? is it supposdly better?

[Lacit170]

This is a random question... but does anyone know if the eyes capable of seeing in 1080p or just in 1080i...

ha, friend just brough this up and ive never heard anything like this... any thoughts?

[PaulGo]

Originally Posted by Lacit170

This is a random question... but does anyone know if the eyes capable of seeing in 1080p or just in 1080i...

ha, friend just brough this up and ive never heard anything like this... any thoughts?

Eyes see in progress regardless of the resolution.

[eric oc]

Originally Posted by Lacit170

This is a random question... but does anyone know if the eyes capable of seeing in 1080p or just in 1080i...

ha, friend just brough this up and ive never heard anything like this... any thoughts?

1080i is not the complete signal and the tv fills in the rest. Think of writing on lined paper and skipping what you would write on that line. The tv guess's what you wanted to write on that line. Where 1080p has all the info included. Can you see the difference? Yes, anytime all the info is included the picture will be clearer.

[Afrobean]

Originally Posted by BillieCassin

I guess I have a "low rent" TV, because when it gets a 480p image it just blows it up, whereas the upconverting DVD player redraws it into 1080p

This shows a misunderstanding of how technology works.

No matter what, a modern HDTV is going to process the image it receives to format it properly for the screen. Some TVs might be able to do 1:1 display of 1920x1080 pictures, but everything else is going to be processed, upscaled, de-interlaced when necessary, etc. There are different ways it can be processed, different scaling algorithms, different de-interlacing techniques, but nowhere in that line is there room to IMPROVE anything. The best upscaling process can do is minimize loss from the encoded source.

Watching it through an HDMI connection shows the quality that was there that they never saw before in the same exact DVDs.

This is an admission of me being right. It does it's best ot preserve "the quality that was there that they never saw before". It does not improve quality, it minimizes loss. It cannot create what's missing, but it can do it's best to ensure the bit that's there, the bit that's always been there, looks as good as is possible.

But all TVs upscale, process, and de-interlace anyway. Wanting to watch DVDs over HDMI isn't so bad, but wasting money on a standalone DVD player is.

[eric oc]

Originally Posted by Afrobean

But all TVs upscale, process, and de-interlace anyway.

I read some comments above and i agree with you. What i think ppl are not getting is that a 40 dollar upconverter is going to perform like and Anchor Bay ABT2010 chip. It wont and most players will not come close to the ability of the ABT2010. I don't understand like you the ppl that seem to think upscaling is going to produce BD PQ. It can clean and refine but can't change to a higher resolution. Even though with my Oppo i can't believe how close it seems to come. Also depends on how good the copy is from the dvd and who knows how many other factors.

[beefytwinkie]

I currently play all my DVDs with a Sony DVP-NS77HB. Before I got that player I attempted to watch my DVDs through a regular DVD player with the yellow composite cables running to my TV. That was pretty bad.

At least with the Sony upconverter / whatever it does, the picture is a lot better and watchable. I haven't heard any complaints yet from friends or family. It's definitely not better than a bloo-ray but I still love it just the same.

[U4K61]

Originally Posted by Cobra33

Do those DVD upconverters really work on HD TV's at improving the picture quality?
i just got those lord of the rings extended DVD's but they probably wont look like a bluray quality on my HDTV. however i went to walmart and saw they have these cheap $40 dvd upconverters that are supposed to make dvd's look near-HD. but does anyone know just how well these work? would it really improve the picture quality for a HDTV? has anyone here tried this out?

It's just a question of what does a better job filling a 1080/720p screen from a 480p source. Is it the one built into the TV or the one found in the DVD or Blu-ray player. Upconversion does not add any new data points, so it's never more than 480 no matter how you cut it.

Upscaling

• The Upscale Crises
• The fallacy of upconversion - 4x4 to 7x7.

[Andrewtst]

Just get a Blu-ray Player, most can upscaling your DVD playback in 1080P resolution via HDMI cable.

The upscaling do help, it make your DVD near HD quality playback, but off course it can't compete with BD TrueHD quality.