Michael Mann on Blu-ray

[tim_p]

Originally Posted by James Luckard

I would guess the YouTube version is a rip of the DVD. It's a watchable disc. I'll have to check mine at home tonight, but I believe it has PAL speedup.

I think that UK DVD is the only legit release of the film.

The best is the dvd from Universal France. The transfer is nothing amazing though perfectly watchable but it also includes a discussion of Heat when Mann attended the Cinémathèque de Paris in 2009 plus the interview Mann did comparing ’Takedown and Heat when the former was screened on BBC2 several years ago.

[thatguamguy]

Originally Posted by postmodel

Thanks! Yeah I would think what’s on YouTube would just be from the dvd, but while watchable it could definitely look better.

Comparing the two, the UK DVD is probably the source of the Youtube rip, but it's also filtered through Youtube's compression, and looks like it was a choppy rip to start with. The DVD picture is more like "nobody has looked at this since 1989", so that's a big step up from Youtube. I think "watchable" is a very kind way to describe the Youtube rip, but it's appropriate for the DVD.

[5meohd]

Very cool thread.

I have maybe an oddball question. Since you seem like fans... Im also a budding Mann admirer. I've only seen about a handful of these. I have many thousands of films to watch so I continue to delay seeing some of the less than stellar releases in hopes that one of the boutiques is working on releasing them eventually.

Should I quit waiting and just dive in? I suppose I could start by watching 3 I already own and haven't seen yet: Thief (CC blu), Miami Vice (DC) and Blackhat.

I haven't seen Insider since the VHS days and I haven't seen Manhunter in HD yet. Otherwise I still need to track down and watch The Keep, Jericho Mile and L.A. Takedown. Sometimes I really enjoy experiencing a film for the first time with nice master on my projection system.

[thatguamguy]

Originally Posted by RegressiveScan

By the way Tim, the conversation you’re responding to is a discussion of DVD releases of ‘The Keep’, not ‘Heat’.

He's responding to a discussion of "L.A. Takedown", which is a TV movie based on a rewrite of the "Heat" script.

[James Luckard]

Originally Posted by Rayjg

Yup, I wonder how that ended up on the laserdisc? Did Paramount allow Mann to make a quick director's cut or was it a similar situation to Blade Runner where an alternate version was used accidentally and no one knew what it was.

Ah,so the alternate ending wasn't a bonus feature on the laserdisc? The laserdisc contained an entire alternate cut of the film, with the alternate ending in the body of the film? Interesting.

What's the difference between the theatrical ending and the laserdisc ending.

I have an old unofficial DVD that I always assumed was ripped from the laserdisc.

I also have the Aussie DVD, and I could have sworn they had the same ending.

How big a difference are we talking?

I'm not super familiar with the various versions of the film. I've only seen it twice, on those 2 DVDs.

[James Luckard]

Originally Posted by tim_p

The best is the dvd from Universal France. The transfer is nothing amazing though perfectly watchable but it also includes a discussion of Heat when Mann attended the Cinémathèque de Paris in 2009 plus the interview Mann did comparing ’Takedown and Heat when the former was screened on BBC2 several years ago.

Interesting, so the Universal France DVD of LA Takedown is superior to the UK one? I might have to track it down for my Mann collection.

[erixon20]

If Mann makes Manhunter as dark as the Heat 4K is then I will not be happy.

[side__on]

A fresh scan of LA Takedown should have been included with the new Heat uhd release.

[James Luckard]

Originally Posted by 5meohd

Very cool thread.

I have maybe an oddball question. Since you seem like fans... Im also a budding Mann admirer. I've only seen about a handful of these. I have many thousands of films to watch so I continue to delay seeing some of the less than stellar releases in hopes that one of the boutiques is working on releasing them eventually.

Should I quit waiting and just dive in? I suppose I could start by watching 3 I already own and haven't seen yet: Thief (CC blu), Miami Vice (DC) and Blackhat.

I haven't seen Insider since the VHS days and I haven't seen Manhunter in HD yet. Otherwise I still need to track down and watch The Keep, Jericho Mile and L.A. Takedown. Sometimes I really enjoy experiencing a film for the first time with nice master on my projection system.

Ask three people for their top favorite Mann films and you'll probably get entirely different lists, haha.

That said, you can't go wrong with Thief. Miami Vice and Blackhat are a bit more divisive. I love them both, flawed though they are, but I wouldn't make them my intro to Mann.

My favorites are, in no particular order:
The Last of the Mohicans (1992 theatrical cut)
Heat
Manhunter
Collateral

[James Luckard]

Originally Posted by side__on

A fresh scan of LA Takedown should have been included with the new Heat uhd release.

Disney controls Heat, through Fox's distribution deal with Regency. I have no idea who owns LA Takedown. I don't think it has ever been commercially released in the US.

[James Luckard]

Originally Posted by erixon20

If Mann makes Manhunter as dark as the Heat 4K is then I will not be happy.

I don't think the 4K remaster that played in France a year or two ago has been released on disc anywhere.

Someone said they checked with the French distributor, and it was the theatrical cut.

This would make sense, since the other cuts were created with VHS-sourced material that wouldn't be suited to 4K (and really isn't even suited to HD).

I wouldn't be shocked if Mann has blocked a UHD of the theatrical cut.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by James Luckard

Ah,so the alternate ending wasn't a bonus feature on the laserdisc? The laserdisc contained an entire alternate cut of the film, with the alternate ending in the body of the film? Interesting.

What's the difference between the theatrical ending and the laserdisc ending.

I own The Keep on laserdisc and I do not recall there being any alternate cut or alternate ending. It was a pretty bare bones release. I own this laserdisc, to be exact:

TheKeepLaserdisc.jpg

The laserdisc database website does not list anything about alternate cuts or alternate endings, either:

https://www.lddb.com/laserdisc/23041...63-WS/Keep-The

[side__on]

My 3,
Manhunter
The Keep
Thief

[Rayjg]

Originally Posted by Vilya

I own The Keep on laserdisc and I do not recall there being any alternate cut or alternate ending. It was a pretty bare bones release. I own this laserdisc, to be exact:

Attachment 279816

The laserdisc database website does not list anything about alternate cuts or alternate endings, either:

https://www.lddb.com/laserdisc/23041...63-WS/Keep-The

I wonder where the alternate ending came from then? A TV cut maybe?

[Rayjg]

Originally Posted by James Luckard

Ah,so the alternate ending wasn't a bonus feature on the laserdisc? The laserdisc contained an entire alternate cut of the film, with the alternate ending in the body of the film? Interesting.

What's the difference between the theatrical ending and the laserdisc ending.

I have an old unofficial DVD that I always assumed was ripped from the laserdisc.

I also have the Aussie DVD, and I could have sworn they had the same ending.

How big a difference are we talking?

I'm not super familiar with the various versions of the film. I've only seen it twice, on those 2 DVDs.

The theatrical/DVD ending freezes on a shot of Eva after Glaeken is sucked into the keep. In the alternate ending we see Glaeken floating down to the bottom of the keep and then Eva re-enters and descends down to him where she finds him alive. Tangerine Dream’s version of The Walking in the Air plays over Glaeken’s descent.

[drush9999]

Originally Posted by Rayjg

I wonder where the alternate ending came from then? A TV cut maybe?

Yeah it was from a TV cut. There was a bootleg DVD which created an extended version of the film and had that ending as an extra. The quality was really bad though.

[tim_p]

Originally Posted by James Luckard

Interesting, so the Universal France DVD of LA Takedown is superior to the UK one? I might have to track it down for my Mann collection.

As a whole package yes. I suspect the film isn’t presented in a higher quality version. It’s still got that dupey, slightly blurry ntsc video master converted to pal look that every version I’ve seen has (including the BBC2 broadcast) but it’s got a healthy bit rate. The two extras are what make it with the 15 min or so Cinémathèque discussion and 12 min BBC interview covering some new ground. The former has cool things like an aerial blocking plan of the bank shootout titled World War III(!) projected as a backdrop whilst Mann discusses that scene.

[Jorvic]

Hemsworth was excellent in Blackhat. Would like to see him do serious dramatic roles more often.

[rocknblues81]

Heat
Thief
Collateral

Weakest: Ali or Public Enemies

Most Anything he did is watchable, but he started to run out of gas after Collateral.

[Jorvic]

Miami Vice is a terrific film – though I only appreciated this after my second and third viewings.

Public Enemies is a better film that it's usually made out to be.

Blackhat seemed totally misunderstood upon release and still demands repeated viewings.

There's been no let-up in the quality of Mann's work.