New 4K Blu-ray players

[huskersports]

Saw an article today that Pioneer is going to stop producing Blu-ray optical drives. Cord Cutters News had the article, linked from Impress. The article's in Japanese, so you'd have to translate.

[Naiera]

Originally Posted by Deadend45

And always was.

Physical media was not always a niche. DVD was huge.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Naiera

Physical media was not always a niche. DVD was huge.

Yep, mainstream.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Deadend45

I have seen that posted on this site for 10 years.



And always was.

Alchav is looking forward to the day disc dies. He preached that digital HD was going to become the mainstream choice, and all these years later, that format is flatlining, so he changed the goalposts to subscription streaming, where of course movies are only a part of a larger offering.

[dcx4610]

Originally Posted by Naiera

Physical media was not always a niche. DVD was huge.

DVD was an anomaly. Physical media was still niche. DVD just happened to be right place right time. It came out when there was no streaming. You couldn't really buy VHS tapes outside of mail order catalogs, special one-offs sold in stores or buying a pre-owned tape at a rental store.

When DVD came out, that changed. DVDs were cheap to manufacture and you could actually start buying them at the store. There was no competition. You could rent DVD but it was nearly as cheap just to buy it. So that's what people did.

People didn't suddenly become physical media collectors. It was just the cheapest and most convenient option at the time. I compare it to the Nintendo Wii. Nintendo's stated goal with the Wii was to turn non-gamers into gamers. Get grandparents and people who have never touched a game into games. They succeeded...or they thought they did. The Wii sold 101 million systems which is roughly 75% MORE than most consoles sold. Nintendo thought that they had turned 75 million new people into gamers. They didn't.

Their next system sold 13 million. They didn't make new gamers. People just bought a Wii because it was the hot new toy and they wanted to try bowling. They didn't buy the Wii U and they didn't buy a PS4. Their Wii just collected dust and they moved on to the next big fad. That's DVD to me.

They bought DVDs because it was just how you consumed movies at the time. Now that streaming is the cheapest, easiest and most mainstream way to consume movies, that's how they do it.

[Naiera]

wat

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by dcx4610

DVD was an anomaly. Physical media was still niche. DVD just happened to be right place right time. It came out when there was no streaming. You couldn't really buy VHS tapes outside of mail order catalogs, special one-offs sold in stores or buying a pre-owned tape at a rental store.

When DVD came out, that changed. DVDs were cheap to manufacture and you could actually start buying them at the store. There was no competition. You could rent DVD but it was nearly as cheap just to buy it. So that's what people did.

People didn't suddenly become physical media collectors. It was just the cheapest and most convenient option at the time. I compare it to the Nintendo Wii. Nintendo's stated goal with the Wii was to turn non-gamers into gamers. Get grandparents and people who have never touched a game into games. They succeeded...or they thought they did. The Wii sold 101 million systems which is roughly 75% MORE than most consoles sold. Nintendo thought that they had turned 75 million new people into gamers. They didn't.

Their next system sold 13 million. They didn't make new gamers. People just bought a Wii because it was the hot new toy and they wanted to try bowling. They didn't buy the Wii U and they didn't buy a PS4. Their Wii just collected dust and they moved on to the next big fad. That's DVD to me.

They bought DVDs because it was just how you consumed movies at the time. Now that streaming is the cheapest, easiest and most mainstream way to consume movies, that's how they do it.

You could buy VHS films, I just popped down to my local Woolworths store and there was a vast amount to choose from.

DVD was mainstream, that’s the bottom line. It was a huge success and made a lot of money for the industry.

[Telemachus]

Sony and Panny are making cheap players with a good markup, I don't see them stopping selling these. If you think the UB9000 is actually a $1k player comparable to past $1k players it isn't imo.

[apollo828]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

You could buy VHS films, I just popped down to my local Woolworths store and there was a vast amount to choose from.

DVD was mainstream, that’s the bottom line. It was a huge success and made a lot of money for the industry.

Yeah, OP's take is...whoa. Sure, there were a lot of tapes priced for rental in the 70s and 80s. By 1990, quite a few were priced for sale. The K-Mart in my little podunk town had plenty of A-level films for sale at US$20-25 each, and cheaper if you went for the public domain / EP-recorded junk. I also recall Entertainment Tonight and other shows loudly announcing certain releases, on top of prominent commercials here & there. That and rentals, while rentals, weren't exactly the kinds of things where you had to drive to major cities hours away in order to rent anything. (Hell, we had a rental shop right next to the aforementioned K-Mart!) If that's not mainstream, I don't know what to tell OP.

[kingreed]

It does make you wonder if both Samsung and LG will ever jump back into the 4K blu ray player market again. It seems that the 4K blu ray player market is shrinking. With streaming services not streaming as much content lately because of rising costs to stream it does make you wonder if more manufacturers like LG and Samsung will ever develop new 4K blu ray players again.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by dcx4610

DVD was an anomaly. Physical media was still niche. DVD just happened to be right place right time. It came out when there was no streaming. You couldn't really buy VHS tapes outside of mail order catalogs, special one-offs sold in stores or buying a pre-owned tape at a rental store.

When DVD came out, that changed. DVDs were cheap to manufacture and you could actually start buying them at the store. There was no competition. You could rent DVD but it was nearly as cheap just to buy it. So that's what people did.

People didn't suddenly become physical media collectors. It was just the cheapest and most convenient option at the time. I compare it to the Nintendo Wii. Nintendo's stated goal with the Wii was to turn non-gamers into gamers. Get grandparents and people who have never touched a game into games. They succeeded...or they thought they did. The Wii sold 101 million systems which is roughly 75% MORE than most consoles sold. Nintendo thought that they had turned 75 million new people into gamers. They didn't.

Their next system sold 13 million. They didn't make new gamers. People just bought a Wii because it was the hot new toy and they wanted to try bowling. They didn't buy the Wii U and they didn't buy a PS4. Their Wii just collected dust and they moved on to the next big fad. That's DVD to me.

They bought DVDs because it was just how you consumed movies at the time. Now that streaming is the cheapest, easiest and most mainstream way to consume movies, that's how they do it.

Seriously: double wat

I bought hundreds of VHS movies from all sorts of places back in the day. Now, if you want to argue that physical media *collecting* has always been niche then yes, most people just didn't want the clutter no matter the format. DVD made a bit of inroads in that respect if only for its vastly slimmer form factor, but building a library is, was and always will be an extremely nerdy thing to do. People have always liked to try before buying and streaming/digital/whatever has simply replaced that prior rental ecosystem. Buying a physical copy is for two main reasons: to keep the nerds happy and to keep the kids happy.

[dcx4610]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

Seriously: double wat

I bought hundreds of VHS movies from all sorts of places back in the day. Now, if you want to argue that physical media *collecting* has always been niche then yes, most people just didn't want the clutter no matter the format. DVD made a bit of inroads in that respect if only for its vastly slimmer form factor, but building a library is, was and always will be an extremely nerdy thing to do. People have always liked to try before buying and streaming/digital/whatever has simply replaced that prior rental ecosystem. Buying a physical copy is for two main reasons: to keep the nerds happy and to keep the kids happy.

Collecting is niche. Yes...

At first though, you couldn't buy VHS tapes outside of mail order. They were made for enthusiasts. Then you randomly started seeing them for sale like Wizard of Oz, Back to the Future, TMNT. Eventually you could start buying them in stores.

My point is people weren't collectors. It was just how you consumed movies and most people were still happy enough just to rent. DVDs were much more abundant but same thing. People weren't movie collectors. They were consumers.

[RalphoR]

Being that DVD was the first disc format and so compact vs vhs tapes I can definitely see why it took off like it did. What saddens me is it still is #1. Are people really happy with the picture quality vs what we have now? There isn't that much of a price markup vs BD so it really should be the top selling format and the 4k market a niche for enthusiasts imo.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by RalphoR

Being that DVD was the first disc format and so compact vs vhs tapes I can definitely see why it took off like it did. What saddens me is it still is #1. Are people really happy with the picture quality vs what we have now? There isn't that much of a price markup vs BD so it really should be the top selling format and the 4k market a niche for enthusiasts imo.

I've seen people happily sit down to watch an awful pirated stream (so blocky it'd make a VCD blush) on a massive TV, picture quality just isn't something that the vast majority of people care about. Heck, even on this forum there's always a massive pushback against any complaints about picture quality even in the 4K space, supported by old standards like "I just watch the movie" and "we've never had it so good".

I still maintain that DVD took off like it did not because of quality but because of convenience. Small form factor, no rewinding, multiple language support, subtitles on board without needing an external decoder, instead of all the nerdy shit we think makes a difference (picture, sound, extras) it's the things that made it a truly user-friendly format that made it appeal to so many people. Blu didn't offer any major changes to those core features so the average user was like "so why should I buy it again?".

Seeing how UHD is starting to eat up Blu-ray's market space it's perhaps running counter to the whole 'people don't care about AV quality' aspect that I've just mentioned, but maybe it's because it's got bigger, bolder improvements - if only from a marketing POV - that it's doing that e.g. HDR, whereas Blu just had more resolution and lossless audio, two things that most folks do not give a fig for.

[RalphoR]

I wonder if people, when having to buy a new TV, have started thinking 4k because of all the marketing associated with 4k. That's probably the set they have to get anyway. Everyday people definitely don't give a rat's a$$ about picture quality or lossless audio but they love their huge TVs and cell phones so they have the tech (although they have no clue how to maximize the use). But, God forbid you deny them that.

[MechaGodzilla]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

Seeing how UHD is starting to eat up Blu-ray's market space it's perhaps running counter to the whole 'people don't care about AV quality' aspect that I've just mentioned, but maybe it's because it's got bigger, bolder improvements - if only from a marketing POV - that it's doing that e.g. HDR, whereas Blu just had more resolution and lossless audio, two things that most folks do not give a fig for.

And perhaps also because the people who got into Blu-ray - and have stuck with it - are the ones who do care about the AV quality aspect to varying degrees.

[stvn1974]

Best Buy had a huge section of VHS tapes even when BD was first taking off. Heck, there was even a section for widescreen VHS.

[danny24]

Originally Posted by kingreed

It does make you wonder if both Samsung and LG will ever jump back into the 4K blu ray player market again. It seems that the 4K blu ray player market is shrinking. With streaming services not streaming as much content lately because of rising costs to stream it does make you wonder if more manufacturers like LG and Samsung will ever develop new 4K blu ray players again.

I doubt LG will but I could see Samsung maybe especially if Sony and Panasonic stop production. A big maybe but I would not count on it.

[BaronVH]

Originally Posted by stvn1974

Best Buy had a huge section of VHS tapes even when BD was first taking off. Heck, there was even a section for widescreen VHS.

One Black Friday years ago had a Best Buy with a full parking lot and 100 people in a check out line buying nothing but VHS tapes. It is the studios’ greed that diminished physical media. They all wanted to be the next Netflix and here we are.

[alchav21]

Originally Posted by BaronVH

It is the studios’ greed that diminished physical media. They all wanted to be the next Netflix and here we are.

The Studios only react to the Market, the Collectors are only a Nitch Group. They don't control the Major Movie Audience. The Major Movie Audience doesn't see the difference Streaming from a Server as opposed to Streaming from a Disc!