Physical & Digital EST: The Future of Home Video Discussion Thread

[Dynamo of Eternia]

Originally Posted by Lee A Stewart

Why is it that none of you understand the streaming business? Yet you think you do.

You don't listen - that's the problem. You ignore the #1 issue that streaming has - CHURN. I don't know how many times I have to say it for any of you to believe it to be the truth. Do I have to fill posts with articles that say exactly that?

There are no free trials anymore. The minimum sub time is 1 month. Getting consumers to subscribe is #1. Keeping them subscribed is #2. Can't you see that? It doesn't take a genius to figure out how to do that. But it does take a very savy experienced business person to maximize number 1 and 2.

And you don't listen, either. CHURN is happening regardless.

If anything, the simple fact that so many streaming services co-exist is what is causing that churn to occur. When everything is split between different services, and unlike cable (where you typically have some kind of package of channels and cannot completely pick and choose each one), people can easily sign up for a service for a month or two, watch all that they want from that service, cancel it, and switch to another..... and keep going back and forth as it makes sense for them.

These services continue to lose subscribers. This has been happening even as these studio-owned streaming services have movies put on there that were just in theaters.

So, most of them seem to be failing at #2.

[Lee A Stewart]

Originally Posted by Dynamo of Eternia

And you don't listen, either. CHURN is happening regardless.

The goal is to minimize it. You can never get rid of it completely. Eveyrbody knows that.

If anything, the simple fact that so many streaming services co-exist is what is causing that churn to occur. When everything is split between different services, and unlike cable (where you typically have some kind of package of channels and cannot completely pick and choose each one), people can easily sign up for a service for a month or two, watch all that they want from that service, cancel it, and switch to another..... and keep going back and forth as it makes sense for them.

Cord-cutting is responsible for leading cable TV providers losing millions of customers they can’t seem to win back. In fact, traditional pay-TV providers lost around 6 million pay-TV subscribers each year from 2019 to 2022. This trend seems set to continue, with 2.3 million customers leaving in the first quarter of 2023 alone.

Dish Network Q2 Subs Fall Below 9 Million as Pay-TV, Sling Services Continue to Shed Customers

These services continue to lose subscribers. This has been happening even as these studio-owned streaming services have movies put on there that were just in theaters.

So, most of them seem to be failing at #2.

Netflix Adds 2.4M Subscribers in First Gain of the Year

Paramount+ Ups Q2 Subs by 700,000 to Top 61 Million Paid Subscribers

Peacock lags behind competitors, gains just 2M subs for Q2

So much for your "These services continue to lose subscribers" bullshit.

[PenguinInfinity]

Originally Posted by Lee A Stewart

Cord-cutting is responsible for leading cable TV providers losing millions of customers they can’t seem to win back. In fact, traditional pay-TV providers lost around 6 million pay-TV subscribers each year from 2019 to 2022. This trend seems set to continue, with 2.3 million customers leaving in the first quarter of 2023 alone.

This is why streaming was such a terrible business move in the first place. It caused people to move from expensive cable and satellite subscriptions to much cheaper streaming subscriptions. And because of the ease of cancelling streaming subscriptions churn is a major problem; it was never an issue with cable and satellite.

[Lee A Stewart]

Originally Posted by PenguinInfinity

This is why streaming was such a terrible business move in the first place. It caused people to move from expensive cable and satellite subscriptions to much cheaper streaming subscriptions. And because of the ease of cancelling streaming subscriptions churn is a major problem; it was never an issue with cable and satellite.

Right! Blame it all on streaming. How about . . . INFLATION? Do you think that had something to do with consumers getting rid of expensive Pay-TV options? I sure do.

[PenguinInfinity]

Originally Posted by Lee A Stewart

Right! Blame it all on streaming. How about . . . INFLATION? Do you think that had something to do with consumers getting rid of expensive Pay-TV options? I sure do.

If people didn't have a drastically cheaper subscription option for their entertainment then they would have continued subscribing to cable or satellite TV.

[Lee A Stewart]

Originally Posted by PenguinInfinity

If people didn't have a drastically cheaper subscription option for their entertainment then they would have continued subscribing to cable or satellite TV.

Cable, Pay-TV subscriber losses are accelerating



Netflix, Hulu and Prime Video were it during those years. And their sub counts were low.

[PenguinInfinity]

Originally Posted by Lee A Stewart

Cable, Pay-TV subscriber losses are accelerating

[Show spoiler]

Netflix, Hulu and Prime Video were it during those years. And their sub counts were low.

Netflix had around 100 million subscribers in 2017.

[Lee A Stewart]

Originally Posted by PenguinInfinity

Netflix had around 100 million subscribers in 2017.

57.4 million subscribers - 2014. They were an International service by then. Hulu was US only.

By 2017 Netflix was available in 190 countries. More than half of their subs were International. Doesn't affect US Pay-TV companies.

[PenguinInfinity]

https://www.pewresearch.org/short-re...-s-since-2015/

Some 71% of those who do not use cable or satellite services say it’s because they can access the content they want online.

[Lee A Stewart]

Originally Posted by PenguinInfinity

https://www.pewresearch.org/short-re...-s-since-2015/

YouTube, Tubi, Pluto, Filmrise, Roku, Freevee, Crackle - all FREE with ads. Just like Linear TV.

[PenguinInfinity]

Originally Posted by Lee A Stewart

YouTube, Tubi, Pluto, Filmrise, Roku, Freevee, Crackle - all FREE with ads.

Ad-supported content has always been popular. I personally think it's terrible, but I've never thought it was bad for business.

The future of streaming is just like the past and present of TV: filled with ads. Is that the future you want?

[Lee A Stewart]

Originally Posted by PenguinInfinity

Ad-supported content has always been popular. I personally think it's terrible, but I've never thought it was bad for business.

The future of streaming is just like the past and present of TV: filled with ads. Is that the future you want?

I don't agree. So far only 13% of Netflix's total sub base opted for ads. The other 87% - no ads.

Not much different with Disney+. 19% elected ads to save money. 81% - no ads.

I can watch BOSCH on Freevee for free with ads or subscribe to Prime Video with no ads but it costs. About the same as I pay for Paramount+/Showtime. And I am not interested in 2 day free shipping as we buy very little on line.

[PenguinInfinity]

Originally Posted by Lee A Stewart

I don't agree. So far only 13% of Netflix's total sub base opted for ads. The other 87% - no ads.

Not much different with Disney+. 19% elected ads to save money. 81% - no ads.

Netflix recently dropped their cheapest ad-free plan in order to encourage more people to watch ads. Warner dropped some of their shows from Max in order to move them to free ad-supported streaming services. Stuff like that will just get worse over time.

Companies are realizing that ads are way more profitable then subscriptions (just like they were with TV) so that's what they are going to focus on as time goes on.

I wouldn't be at all surprised if in order to combat churn streaming services start offering two options: cheap monthly subscriptions with ads and expensive yearly subscriptions without ads.

[Lee A Stewart]

Originally Posted by PenguinInfinity

Netflix recently dropped their cheapest ad-free plan in order to encourage more people to watch ads. Warner dropped some of their shows from Max in order to move them to free ad-supported streaming services. Stuff like that will just get worse over time.

Every month streamers add content. So what if some leaves? If they are going to FAST services, then they are gaining licensing revenue. LOL - you guys complain they aren't maximizing their profits. But when they do, you STILL complain.

Companies are realizing that ads are way more profitable then subscriptions (just like they were with TV) so that's what they are going to focus on as time goes on.

That is not a fact - not by a long shot. Total ad revenue across the board is down. Use Google.

I wouldn't be at all surprised if in order to combat churn streaming services start offering two options: cheap monthly subscriptions with ads and expensive yearly subscriptions without ads.

You can pay by the year for any SVOD. You get a savings of about 2 months versus M-T-M. Will it go up? Sure. If you are committed to a service, paying the yearly cost saves money. I can't see them ever changing that type of plan.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by Lee A Stewart

You can pay by the year for any SVOD.

I see no such plan for Netflix.

https://help.netflix.com/en/node/24926

[cheez avenger]

Originally Posted by Vilya

I see no such plan for Netflix.

https://help.netflix.com/en/node/24926

Yeah, Netflix is the only major streamer that has no yearly plan. It's a-la-carte per month with them.

[Vilya]

Subscription streaming is not really supplanting traditional pay TV so much as they are becoming it.

The SVODs realize that subscriptions alone will not make them profitable, so they are embracing ads. Despite getting in bed with advertisers, profits still elude most streaming providers.

Even Netflix has turned to ad revenue to remain profitable, which is something that Reed Hastings swore multiple times since 2015 that Netflix would never do. He even once said that advertising exploited users.

"No advertising coming onto Netflix. Period."

https://www.techtimes.com/articles/5...ng-netflix.htm

"“We want to be the safe respite where you can explore, get stimulated, have fun, enjoy, relax — and have none of the controversy around exploiting users with advertising.”

https://variety.com/2020/digital/new...ss-1203475144/

The bigger the promise, the bigger the lie.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by Lee A Stewart

Paramount+ Ups Q2 Subs by 700,000 to Top 61 Million Paid Subscribers

Peacock lags behind competitors, gains just 2M subs for Q2

So much for your "These services continue to lose subscribers" bullshit.

And despite adding those subscribers, they are still in the red.

Costs are growing faster than their subs. Time to "send in the s", aka ads.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by Lee A Stewart

There are no free trials anymore.

Hulu, AppleTV+, Paramount+, and Amazon Prime still offer free trials.

https://agoodmovietowatch.com/the-be...-trial/page/1/

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by cheez avenger

Yeah, Netflix is the only major streamer that has no yearly plan. It's a-la-carte per month with them.

Just pointing out that he is prone to making absolute statements that aren't absolutely true.