Physical & Digital EST: The Future of Home Video Discussion Thread

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by CV19

I've always loved them. I still have the 20th Anniversary DVD boxset from 1999 - the very first DVD's I bought. I've also kept hold of the Alien Quadrilogy which came out about 2004 I think, and then the blu-rays when they were released a few years back. The only ones I don't have any longer are the VHS releases. You'd be forgiven for thinking I don't like to throw anything away.

I don’t blame you. My most watched films of all time I would say, and there is quite a lot of competition in that regard. (Jaws, Halloween, Carrie, The Wickerman, T2 to name a very small amount)

[Wendell R. Breland]

Originally Posted by alchav21

As for the Quality they all Stream Outstanding, even Amazon Prime.

I understand that for viewers like you that may well be the case but many here have their displays in “Filmmaker Mode” or the equivalent thereof. That means they will see video aberrations you do not see or it could be a case of where you are not sensitive to mosquito noise, banding, dropped frames, etc.

If you had a minimum immersive audio setup then you should realize Amazon Prime is the pits in the audio department for movies with 192 Kbps DD+ 5.1 sound when others have 448 Kbps and up for DD+ Atmos.

[Show spoiler]

[alchav21]

Originally Posted by PenguinInfinity

Do you have any sort of media server on your local network or ISP network? Just a few posts ago you said one was "needed".

Yes, it's called a DVR on the ISP network. Where I can Record and Store Movies, Sport Events, Hallmark, HGTV, ect. So it's possible to have a Media Server for my Personal use for my Movies and TV Shows.

[PenguinInfinity]

Originally Posted by alchav21

Yes, it's called a DVR on the ISP network. Where I can Record and Store Movies, Sport Events, Hallmark, HGTV, ect. So it's possible to have a Media Server for my Personal use for my Movies and TV Shows.

Have you backed up any of your Vudu/Prime/MA/Google Collection to this media server?

[HDTV1080P]

select quotes

"Chicken Soup for the Soul Entertainment reported that its Redbox business unit generated third-quarter (ended Sept. 30, 2023) net revenue of $36 million, up more than 14% from revenue of $31.6 million in the previous-year period. Through nine months of the fiscal year, kiosk revenue increased 254% to $90.7 million from $25.6 million in 2022 — just two months after the closure of Chicken Soup’s Redbox acquisition."

"Redbox posted an operating loss of $393 million, up from an operating loss of $9.5 million during the previous-year period. The operating loss includes an asset impairment charge of $237.8 million and a goodwill impairment charge of $136.9 million."

"Streaming and VOD revenue dropped almost 30% to $21.7 million from $30.9 million in the previous year."

"Despite the uptick in Redbox revenue, the legacy disc rental kiosks continue to be hampered by an inability to pay for and secure new movies — a reality the company says has strained relationships with creditors, including content providers. As a result, Chicken Soup said it was unable to pay for all the movies that were offered to it by distributors in the quarter."

https://www.mediaplaynews.com/redbox...perating-loss/

[HDTV1080P]

Comcast is the second largest Cable TV operator in the United States and is popular in the United Kingdom. One negative thing about buying movies on cable TV, is that if one relocates to another city that has a different cable TV provider, one loses all their movies that they purchased. That is one thing streaming has going for it. If one buys a movie on Amazon or VUDU they will end up being able to watch that cloud-based movie format anywhere in the world with a Internet connection. Whereas if one buys a movie from a cable TV company or satellite TV company, that movie is only watchable as long as the customer lives in an area of the world that has the exact same cable TV or satellite TV provider (plus one has to have active cable TV or satellite TV subscription to view the movie that was purchased). It is so much better to buy physical optical disc media like 4K Blu-ray discs so one owns that copy that can be sold to someone or watched anytime without having to subscribe to a Cable TV, satellite TV, or subscribe to Internet service to watch the movie.


Select quote from article

"Comcast’s U.K. pay TV company Sky is planning to cut about 1,000 jobs in Britain this year, as the media group moves away from linear cable and satellite TV towards streaming-based services."

https://www.nexttv.com/news/comcasts...s-to-streaming

[HDTV1080P]

Charter is now the largest cable TV provider in the United States, with Comcast being number two.

quote

"Charter Communications, which has for several years been losing linear video customers at a much slower pace than Comcast, has surpassed the Philadelphia cable conglomerate as the No. 1 pay TV operator in America."

https://www.nexttv.com/news/for-what...ng-subscribers

[cheez avenger]

Originally Posted by HDTV1080P

select quotes

"Chicken Soup for the Soul Entertainment reported that its Redbox business unit generated third-quarter (ended Sept. 30, 2023) net revenue of $36 million, up more than 14% from revenue of $31.6 million in the previous-year period. Through nine months of the fiscal year, kiosk revenue increased 254% to $90.7 million from $25.6 million in 2022 — just two months after the closure of Chicken Soup’s Redbox acquisition."

"Redbox posted an operating loss of $393 million, up from an operating loss of $9.5 million during the previous-year period. The operating loss includes an asset impairment charge of $237.8 million and a goodwill impairment charge of $136.9 million."

"Streaming and VOD revenue dropped almost 30% to $21.7 million from $30.9 million in the previous year."

"Despite the uptick in Redbox revenue, the legacy disc rental kiosks continue to be hampered by an inability to pay for and secure new movies — a reality the company says has strained relationships with creditors, including content providers. As a result, Chicken Soup said it was unable to pay for all the movies that were offered to it by distributors in the quarter."

https://www.mediaplaynews.com/redbox...perating-loss/

Impressive higher revenue there. I stopped using them when I went back to Gamefly. Gamfly has better offerings and great prices and lots of 4K discs for rent/sale.

[alchav21]

Originally Posted by PenguinInfinity

Have you backed up any of your Vudu/Prime/MA/Google Collection to this media server?

Yes, John Wick 2 & 3. I have been watching John Wick 2, and then I will watch John Wick 3. Good Action Movies, and Keanu Reeves at his best!

[gj217]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

Those films haven’t released yet. We don’t know if they are downgrades. Most are forming opinions on a bit rate starved stream.

Also have to disagree (sorry) about the Halloween 2007 Blu being horrid. Sure, it’s an older transfer but it’s far from horrid.

IMO, the 2007 disc looks… cheap and smeary. The colors are entirely too hot, and the little bit of grain that is there just looks clumpy,

The issues with the Cameron titles have absolutely nothing to do with bitrate It’s the fake AI generated “details,” details that appear and disappear at random, and people who look computer generated. Eyes look downright bizarre in many shots. It’s almost as though every character is played by Meg Foster, in that their eyes are distracting as hell.

Originally Posted by Steedeel

I mean, they scrubbed detail away for the Aliens Blu-ray but it still looked great.

Titanic and The Abyss both had the A.I treatment and many enthusiasts think they look great, me included regarding Titanic.

One person’s terrible is another’s crystal clear presentation.

I will wait and form my own opinion, but Titanic is a pass for me.

Big difference here - Titanic and The Abyss actually came from 4K scans. So the majority of the detail is real. With Aliens and True Lies, the AI didn’t get enough real detail to work with and it added a bunch of distracting, bizarre things to compensate. In one shot (just that comes to mind, I’m sure it happens more than once), Gorman’s shirt has completely different textures in different parts of the frame.

[PenguinInfinity]

Originally Posted by alchav21

Yes, John Wick 2 & 3. I have been watching John Wick 2, and then I will watch John Wick 3. Good Action Movies, and Keanu Reeves at his best!

I'm trying to figure out how putting just a couple of movies in your ISP media server provides any protection or support for your collection.

Originally Posted by alchav21

You do know that it's a File on a Server, and can be put on any Storage Devise. You mentioned four Providers Vudu, Amazon, Google, and Apple, but if they can't support storing your Files I'm sure for a price your ISP can!

If anything but John Wick 2 or 3 is removed or modified from your Vudu/Prime/MA/Google Collection you will lose access and you won't have any recourse.

[alchav21]

Originally Posted by PenguinInfinity

I'm trying to figure out how putting just a couple of movies in your ISP media server provides any protection or support for your collection.

If anything but John Wick 2 or 3 is removed or modified from your Vudu/Prime/MA/Google Collection you will lose access and you won't have any recourse.

The Server is just a Digital Video Recorder, and used to store and playback content on the IP Channels. I only used this example to show you Storing Movies and TV Shows on a Server for playback can be done!

[PenguinInfinity]

Originally Posted by alchav21

The Server is just a Digital Video Recorder, and used to store and playback content on the IP Channels. I only used this example to show you Storing Movies and TV Shows on a Server for playback can be done!

Were John Wick 2 & 3 from your Vudu/Prime/MA/Google Collection or from IP Channels? Did you answer my previous question incorrectly?

Originally Posted by PenguinInfinity

Have you backed up any of your Vudu/Prime/MA/Google Collection to this media server?

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by gj217

IMO, the 2007 disc looks… cheap and smeary. The colors are entirely too hot, and the little bit of grain that is there just looks clumpy,

The issues with the Cameron titles have absolutely nothing to do with bitrate It’s the fake AI generated “details,” details that appear and disappear at random, and people who look computer generated. Eyes look downright bizarre in many shots. It’s almost as though every character is played by Meg Foster, in that their eyes are distracting as hell.



Big difference here - Titanic and The Abyss actually came from 4K scans. So the majority of the detail is real. With Aliens and True Lies, the AI didn’t get enough real detail to work with and it added a bunch of distracting, bizarre things to compensate. In one shot (just that comes to mind, I’m sure it happens more than once), Gorman’s shirt has completely different textures in different parts of the frame.

Yet some are saying the detail is stunning in Aliens. Best wait and see.

[bhampton]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

Yet some are saying the detail is stunning in Aliens. Best wait and see.

Unless you already have it to watch like I did. (Though the streaming copy isn't really something to judge the disc master by.)

The only thing distracting about the picture quality to me was it did look perfect like every frame was photoshopped. Kind of gave it a soap opera effect type of look. I saw no film grain for any shot. So when there was a lot of special effects they similarly looked just a little too clean and sharp.

It may not be the best but if you can still get taken by the story you won't mind in this case.

[gj217]

Originally Posted by bhampton

Unless you already have it to watch like I did. (Though the streaming copy isn't really something to judge the disc master by.)

The only thing distracting about the picture quality to me was it did look perfect like every frame was photoshopped. Kind of gave it a soap opera effect type of look. I saw no film grain for any shot. So when there was a lot of special effects they similarly looked just a little too clean and sharp.

It may not be the best but if you can still get taken by the story you won't mind in this case.

That’s the big problem with it. It doesn’t look like a movie at all.

Yes it’s very sharp and “detailed,” but a lot of the detail is blatantly fake. It looks like a somewhat more advanced CG-animated film. Like the Final Fantasy film or a very good cinematic from a video game, but with more “realistic” skin textures and such.

Even then, though, it doesn’t look *real*. And I’m not speaking of effects. The actors don’t look real in motion.

There won’t be any waiting and seeing for me. I’m not paying for this disc. If I did and it looked anything at all like the stream, I’d just as soon toss $30 in the fireplace.

[Anthony P]

Originally Posted by Vilya

I said that you were rigid and inflexible because you refuse to use anything but digital sources to watch movies just as he refuses to use anything but discs. I find that using both discs and digital gives me the best of what both have to offer.

I don't agree with you I don't see it as inflexibility but prioritizing. IF someone never cares what they watch in terms of AV quality or content and they want to save money then they can definitely fill all their watching time with that subscription they have so why should the buy UHD BDs and waste their money on them when they don't care. On the other hand if someone prioritizes quality and so when push comes to shove they will spend their time watching UHD BD why waste their money on a digital sources?

When I was a student I always had a bunch of instant noodle packs, they were cheap and easy and filled up stomach, today I don't have any. Not because I have something against them but because I would always pick to eat something better even if it takes a few minutes more and is more expensive. Same here I don't watch digital but I almost never watch my normal BDs and never watch any public content on older formats.

When I sit down I have to make a decision a) do I watch that old movie I only had on (unacceptable media) or b) do I feel like watching that movie I have on UHD today and really can't wait to see and hope that one day that other film too will make it to UHD BD and at least for me b) always wins out. Don't get me wrong I can understand why things might be different for others.

[Anthony P]

Originally Posted by Vilya

If only the same could be said for streaming. The studios seem to enjoy losing money there.

As companies they are giant conglomerates but we need to distinguish between the streaming companies and the studios even if they are part of the conglomerates. Disney + is losing a lot of money, Marvel is making money even on the streaming because Disney+ has to pay them to make the content available.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by alchav21

I only used this example to show you Storing Movies and TV Shows on a Server for playback can be done!

...which everyone already knows. The ability to store stuff on a server is not a revelation to anyone.

Originally Posted by PenguinInfinity

Were John Wick 2 & 3 from your Vudu/Prime/MA/Google Collection or from IP Channels? Did you answer my previous question incorrectly?

In the case of Vudu you can download your movies, but you can only play them through the Vudu app itself. Both the Vudu app and the Vudu downloads must be on the same device that you plan to watch these on. These are not like MP3 files that you can transfer anywhere and play with any device or software that you choose.

Vudu downloads are DRM protected. If support for the Vudu app disappeared, the downloads would be worthless. This is almost certainly true for all of the other digital storefronts, too.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by cheez avenger

Impressive higher revenue there. I stopped using them when I went back to Gamefly. Gamfly has better offerings and great prices and lots of 4K discs for rent/sale.

That $393 million operating loss is even more impressive... like ten fold more.

Redbox's difficulty in being able to purchase movies does not bode well for them, either.