Physical & Digital EST: The Future of Home Video Discussion Thread

[Zu Nim]

Originally Posted by Dynamo of Eternia

That's like saying that since really high end, 5-star restaurants serve very high quality food, what's to stop McDonalds from doing the same. And I'm not holding my breath on McDonalds serving File Minjon anytime soon.

True, but the primary cost for electronic delivery is bandwidth that is cheap and getting cheaper. Netflix quality has gone up. It's not unreasonable to anticipate better streaming quality.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Zu Nim

Of course they can. Do you think apps can remain cheap (or free!) yet still have a thriving market? Can computers? Consumer electronics? I guess none of those things are thriving because their prices are constantly going down. And if you say that films are entirely unrelated I would disagree. Technology has saved filmmakers hundreds of millions of dollars and that means they can thrive at lower prices.

An unsold $10 disc earns the studio nothing. Selling two $5 copies via EST earns more. You suggest the former is thriving and the latter is not, which is nonsense.



Rubbish. The average price for games has dropped. AAA titles with enormous budgets require high prices but that's not new. Hint to consumers: Don't buy it if you don't like the price. It will drop.



Electronic sell-thru revenue was over $2 billion last year (all discs: $5.5 billion). And you think that has to do with cheap codes? Pretty myopic.



We know that the middleman's cut is now 30% (or even 15%). That's less than the cut studios previously lost between wholesalers and retailers. Simple math. And that cut isn't 30% because there's competition from physical sales, so it's not going to grow to 40%, then 50%, etc. If anything it will probably shrink.



They will. Digital transmission prices only drop. Spitballing right now, the cost to stream an HDX movie is less than 15 cents. It's probably far less but I'm using published rates for CDNs. I'm never going to stream most of my digital collection even once. Lots of consumers won't watch their movies more than a few times ever. The burden of digital delivery is extraordinarily low.



I doubt you know what the economics behind a remaster are, but if adding the remaster to the existing product for sale increases sales enough to pay for the remaster that's all they need (more or less). To use a related example, look at iTunes Extras. Several studios keep adding iTunes Extras to existing films. There's clearly a cost associated with that. But the additional sales presumably pay for that expense. The studios aren't doing it out of the goodness of their hearts.

Oh, the game console digital downloads are just temporary, wish you had said that earlier and we could have cleared things up pages ago. Here is me thinking the Studios were using the convenience card to charge £10 extra over the disc version. But hey, you know everything. Prices will drop and we will pay less soon. Ok......

[darkknightman]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

Having said that, if that makes her happy, why not? It's very arrogant to declare what is normal and what isn't.

There are such things as facts and this type of behavior is an illness. There is an entire show dedicated to this type of behavior, it's called Hoarders. Not everything is an opinion and a debate. Some things simply are. Your telling me that the individuals on hoarders are doing just fine and as long as they are happy filling their homes with junk? Alcoholics are happy when their are drunk. Opiate addicted individuals are happy when they are consuming their drugs. I know in the age of Trump, everything is now up for debate.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Zu Nim

True, but the primary cost for electronic delivery is bandwidth that is cheap and getting cheaper. Netflix quality has gone up. It's not unreasonable to anticipate better streaming quality.

Netflix still has very blocky, banding backgrounds at times. Their HD at least looks like HD but the backgrounds leave a lot to be desired.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by darkknightman

There are such things as facts and this type of behavior is an illness. There is an entire show dedicated to this type of behavior, it's called Hoarders. Not everything thing is an opinion and a debate. Some things simply are. Your telling me that the individuals on hoarders are doing just fine and as long as they are happy filling their homes with junk? Just as long as it makes them happy? Alcoholics are happy when their are drunk. Opiate addicted individuals are happy when they are consuming their drugs. I know in the age of Trump, everything is now up for debate.

Some people may love collecting and therefore it's not a problem for them. It's only a problem if they hate being that way. Like I said, hoarding and collecting are two different things. You make it sound like all,disc buyers are sitting in their homes surrounded by discs. I'm telling you, I hate clutter and my discs are neatly stored and in no way get in my way. But you have turned into a mental health doctor over the last few pages (maybe you are basing your own past behaviours on obsessive behaviour) and applying that to everyone? You did mention you used to collect and you saw it as a illness?

Or maybe you know deep down you have abandoned quality and you are trying to justify it? (A common thing in this thread)

[twobelowpar]

Originally Posted by darkknightman

There are such things as facts and this type of behavior is an illness. There is an entire show dedicated to this type of behavior, it's called Hoarders.

Are you saying someone who owns 3000 Blurays is a hoarder but someone who owns 3000 digital copies isn't ?


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[darkknightman]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

Some people may love collecting and therefore it's not a problem for them. It's only a problem if they hate being that way. Like I said, hoarding and collecting are two different things. You make it sound like all,disc buyers are sitting in their homes surrounded by discs. I'm telling you, I hate clutter and my discs are neatly stored and in no way get in my way. But you have turned into a mental health doctor over the last few pages (maybe you are basing your own past behaviours on obsessive behaviour) and applying that to everyone? You did mention you used to collect and you saw it as a illness?

Or maybe you know deep down you have abandoned quality and you are trying to justify it? (A common thing in this thread)

Negative. I have never had a lot of anything. But when I read all of your responses to streaming and digital films all I hear is panic and I wonder why. When I read people's profile and they have thousands of discs and it just does not seem rational at all. I have read posts of people going out to stores and buying movies they clearly do not like, or chasing around collector's editions that come with kids toys. All I am saying is your out of line by saying people who do not have physical collections just don't love movies as much as you do. And I stand by my belief that extreme collecting is another form of hoarding. It doesn't matter if collections are organized or not. Inanimate objects should not be this important to people. One person on here started a thread where the topic was if people were scared that someone was going to break into their homes and steal their movies. That should not be your first concern in a home invasion or break. Get a grip.

[darkknightman]

Originally Posted by twobelowpar

Are you saying someone who owns 3000 Blurays is a hoarder but someone who owns 3000 digital copies isn't ?


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I am not hoarding movies. If I could sell half of my digital movies I would. Maybe for some it could be if they are spending all of their money on movies.

[twobelowpar]

Originally Posted by darkknightman

I am not hoarding movies. If I could sell half of my digital movies I would. Maybe for some it could be if they are spending all of their money on movies.

The fact you can't sell half your digital titles is another advantage of physical.

But I would agree that if you are spending more than you should, whether on Blurays or digital copies, then it's a problem. That could be a different number for everybody.



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[Zu Nim]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

Oh, the game console digital downloads are just temporary, wish you had said that earlier and we could have cleared things up pages ago. Here is me thinking the Studios were using the convenience card to charge £10 extra over the disc version. But hey, you know everything. Prices will drop and we will pay less soon. Ok......

Dismissing conclusions based on facts and retreating to the Fortress of Paranoia is a strategy, I guess...

In the past year I've purchased at least 200 iTunes titles in the range of $1-5, and that doesn't include other discounts along the way. But maybe I really paid $15 each for them. Because fear beats facts after all.

[darkknightman]

Originally Posted by twobelowpar

The fact you can't sell half your digital titles is another advantage of physical.

But I would agree that if you are spending more than you should, whether on Blurays or digital copies, then it's a problem. That could be a different number for everybody.



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Certainly. Obsessive collecting of anything can be a problem. The Smurf video I used as an example is textbook OCD behavior. She says it in dialogue. She stresses out much like an addict when she doesn't have a package in the mail with a Smurf item. I am not saying everyone on here is OCD but their certainly are some who fall into this category. And when I hear the vitriol and snarky responses to digital consumption, it just sounds like panic from addicts who fear losing their kick. Steed's assertion that people who don't own discs are less of movie lovers than him just sounds like panic. So everyone pre VHS didn't love movies I suppose.

[Dynamo of Eternia]

Originally Posted by darkknightman

There are such things as facts and this type of behavior is an illness. There is an entire show dedicated to this type of behavior, it's called Hoarders.

And you are misrepresenting that behavior here. The people on hoarders have so much stuff that it's literally all over their house... to the point where you can't see the floor or anything. It's just random piles of stuff everywhere.

And they aren't typically collecting something really specific (like movies or even Smurf collectibles). They see a broken rake that is beyond repair out by their neighbor's garbage and feel the need to take it and keep it, and things like that.

[Texan26]

Originally Posted by twobelowpar

Are you saying someone who owns 3000 Blurays is a hoarder but someone who owns 3000 digital copies isn't ?


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hoarding disorder is a pattern of behavior that is characterized by excessive acquisition and an inability or unwillingness to discard large quantities of objects that cover the living areas of the home and cause significant distress or impairment.

Digital copies do not take up space.

[Cevolution]

Regardless whether you prefer online digital distribution as your delivery method for content, your fondness for movies is no different to mine. There is a big difference between someone being obsessed with something such as The Smurfs, where an entire room is filled with toys and memorabilia (and the decor matches the persons obsession), and people that have a few shelves up against the wall, that are neat and tidy, and don't affect the day to day use of the living space whatsoever. If simply the sight of shelves, with movies on them, repulses you because you see it as clutter, then you've got psychological issues in my opinion, just same as how you feel those that hoard do.

[darkknightman]

Originally Posted by Dynamo of Eternia

And you are misrepresenting that behavior here. The people on hoarders have so much stuff that it's literally all over their house... to the point where you can't see the floor or anything. It's just random piles of stuff everywhere.

And they aren't typically collecting something really specific (like movies or even Smurf collectibles). They see a broken rake that is beyond repair out by their neighbor's garbage and feel the need to take it and keep it, and things like that.

So you don't think the woman in the Smurf video is a hoarder. She has a very specific thing she collects which is all over her house. You own somewhere around 2000 movies. Are you going to watch all of those films? Why have such a large collection? If you dedicated one day to watch all of your films, it would take you over six years to see them all. This is rational?

[darkknightman]

Originally Posted by Cevolution

Regardless whether you prefer online digital distribution as your delivery method for content, your fondness for movies is no different to mine. There is a big difference between someone being obsessed with something such as The Smurfs, where an entire room is filled with toys and memorabilia (and the decor matches the persons obsession), and people that have a few shelves up against the wall, that are neat and tidy, and don't affect the day to day use of the living space whatsoever. If simply the sight of shelves, with movies on them, repulses you because you see it as clutter, then you've got psychological issues in my opinion, just same as how you feel those that hoard do.

What? So someone who doesn't like messy homes has issues? Wow. It is amazing how everything is an opinion or can be rationalized.

[Dynamo of Eternia]

Originally Posted by darkknightman

So you don't think the woman in the Smurf video is a hoarder. She has a very specific thing she collects which is all over her house. You own somewhere around 2000 movies. Are you going to watch all of those films? Why have such a large collection? If you dedicated one day to watch all of your films, it would take you over six years to see them all. This is rational?

I could see the OCD argument to an extent for her, mostly because it is all over her house and it's not something that is even contained to just one room. But her collection is still otherwise organized, and collecting and hoarding are not one and the same...

https://www.adaa.org/understanding-a...oarding-basics

Hoarding vs. Collecting

Hoarding is not the same as collecting. In general, collectors have a sense of pride about their possessions and they experience joy in displaying and talking about them. They usually keep their collection organized, feel satisfaction when adding to it, and budget their time and money.

Those who hoard usually experience embarrassment about their possessions and feel uncomfortable when others see them. They have clutter, often at the expense of livable space, feel sad or ashamed after acquiring additional items, and they are often in debt.

My movie collection is organized and contained. Maybe I have more than I'll be able to watch, but I keep it in check, keep it organized, and I don't allow it to put me in debt.

There is nothing wrong with having a hobby that one enjoys.

[Cevolution]

Originally Posted by darkknightman

What? So someone who doesn't like messy homes has issues? Wow. It is amazing how everything is an opinion or can be rationalized.

What's messy about this?:



What, the colourful spines? Or the fact that there is shelves in the room at all? If you think so, then you have a the problem as far as I'm concerned. My home is probably cleaner than yours.

[darkknightman]

Originally Posted by Cevolution

What's messy about this?:



What, the colourful spines? Or the fact that there is shelves in the room at all? If you think so, then you have a the problem as far as I'm concerned. My home is probably cleaner than yours.

I don't have shelves. I subscribe to minimalism. Your collection is a vanity thing. Newflash. No one cares about your movie collection.

[Zu Nim]

Originally Posted by darkknightman

I don't have shelves. I subscribe to minimalism. Your collection is a vanity thing. Newflash. No one cares about your movie collection.

Well, he or she cares and that's the most important thing, right? Looks tidy to me. If it doesn't affect your life or the lives of those around you negatively I don't really see a problem. That applies to most everything.