Physical & Digital EST: The Future of Home Video Discussion Thread

[alchav21]

Originally Posted by alchav21

What's a Long Time...Tomorrow? You know things move fast in a Technical World. What is a Local Server, they can be put anywhere. My ISP has me on an IntraNet, they can put a Local Server there. As it stands now, my Vudu Streaming Server is not too far away so I have Direct Trunking there. This is not a Pipe Dream, with the UV Locker we can access our Collection from various Streaming Providers which are all on Servers. Storage is abundant and not too expensive.....Local Media Server here we come!

Originally Posted by wolfpackTri

A LOCAL server is one in your house. Local IS NOT a server that is within a 50 mile radius.

I wonder why LAN is called local area network? hrmmm......

You guys forget I worked in The Industry and setup Networks and LAN's for Companies like Oracle. Yes, typically a LAN is in a Home, but it can also be on a Campus or Community. I have setup Home Servers, but a Server is one that Serves Local Computers. They are not hard to setup, all you need is Storage and Access. Nothing Magic or FM!

[flyry]

Originally Posted by cpr3584

Is 4K streaming even better than blu ray at this point?

No question

[Zu Nim]

Originally Posted by alchav21

You guys forget I worked in The Industry and setup Networks and LAN's for Companies like Oracle. Yes, typically a LAN is in a Home, but it can also be on a Campus or Community. I have setup Home Servers, but a Server is one that Serves Local Computers. They are not hard to setup, all you need is Storage and Access. Nothing Magic or FM!

Servers are application layer. The networks under discussion are physical layer. (We could talk layer 2/3 but I don't want to give you any more room to confuse the issue.) At this point I can't even tell if you're trying to describe a CDN. I think you forget that there are people here that know what they're talking about.

[alchav21]

Originally Posted by alchav21

You guys forget I worked in The Industry and setup Networks and LAN's for Companies like Oracle. Yes, typically a LAN is in a Home, but it can also be on a Campus or Community. I have setup Home Servers, but a Server is one that Serves Local Computers. They are not hard to setup, all you need is Storage and Access. Nothing Magic or FM!

Originally Posted by Zu Nim

Servers are application layer. The networks under discussion are physical layer. (We could talk layer 2/3 but I don't want to give you any more room to confuse the issue.) At this point I can't even tell if you're trying to describe a CDN. I think you forget that there are people here that know what they're talking about.

Now who is trying to confuse things, CDN (Content Delivery Network,) Application Layer. I was just talking about a Local Media Server, Storage and Access very simple. I'm not saying it's going to happen, they are just easy to setup. You guys take all this too personal, I'm just throwing ideas out there that are likely to happen.

[alchav21]

Originally Posted by alchav21

What crap, I Stream 4K Movies now with only my Sony UHD TV. You're the one that needs to spend more on a 4K Player, and storage space for your 4K Movie Collection.

Originally Posted by Dynamo of Eternia

Yeah, but only because you had already spent a lot and went through a lot of trouble to make arrangements to have the best possible service, wiring, and other aspects to get the best quality streams that you can in the first place. I would imagine that came with a considerable cost, probably one greater than simply buying a 4K player.

Not if you do it yourself, but in my last two homes I didn't have to. Like I said I did Contract Work in the Silicon Valley, and all the Companies there use Wired Cat5, so I'm very familiar with this wiring. I did run my own Wiring in my Home in the Bay Area, but in Palm Desert and here in ST George it was part of the Structured Wiring. It does depend on your priorities, and most people think Wireless is "Good Enough." You could tell I don't like things just being "Good Enough."

[Greyman]

Originally Posted by alchav21

Not if you do it yourself, but in my last two homes I didn't have to. Like I said I did Contract Work in the Silicon Valley, and all the Companies there use Wired Cat5, so I'm very familiar with this wiring. I did run my own Wiring in my Home in the Bay Area, but in Palm Desert and here in ST George it was part of the Structured Wiring. It does depend on your priorities, and most people think Wireless is "Good Enough." You could tell I don't like things just being "Good Enough."

Too bad you didn't use Cat6 in your house, you would be getting your movies in 8K.

I kid.

[echopulse]

You wouldn't need Cat6 for 8k. Cat 5e is capable of 1 Gb per sec.

[alchav21]

Originally Posted by alchav21

Not if you do it yourself, but in my last two homes I didn't have to. Like I said I did Contract Work in the Silicon Valley, and all the Companies there use Wired Cat5, so I'm very familiar with this wiring. I did run my own Wiring in my Home in the Bay Area, but in Palm Desert and here in ST George it was part of the Structured Wiring. It does depend on your priorities, and most people think Wireless is "Good Enough." You could tell I don't like things just being "Good Enough."

Originally Posted by Greyman

Too bad you didn't use Cat6 in your house, you would be getting your movies in 8K.

I kid.

Originally Posted by echopulse

You wouldn't need Cat6 for 8k. Cat 5e is capable of 1 Gb per sec.

Yes, he was kidding, Cat5 works good. Newer construction uses Cat6 with tighter Specs, but for all practical purposes Cat5 will do.

[master gandhi]

Originally Posted by alchav21

Yes, he was kidding, Cat5 works good. Newer construction uses Cat6 with tighter Specs, but for all practical purposes Cat5 will do.

In other words, Cat5 is "good enough." j/k

[flyry]

They don't even use CAT5e in silicon valley?

[BMox81]

Originally Posted by irighti

hi to all. I am not sure if I have posted in this thread before, but why can't the answer be both? I like both equally. having a physical copy for me is all about watching something I enjoy in the best possible way. when I introduced my daughters to star wars, indiana jones, back to the future- etc, I use my disc copy to show them the best possible version.

the digital side is just a great time saver. I can load up anything for my family in a few seconds without having to go and grab the disc from my media room. they can load up whatever movie they are in love with for that week and just watch anywhere.

it is just like with most format debates, they are great things about both. the people who are so devout in one over the other are missing out. I do not expect physical media to ever go away (although I do think it will be less plentiful). digital, streaming etc is only going to grow. the two can coexist without harming the other. just saying.

edit
I also love the idea of backing up all my movies to a home server, but the little down time I have I like to use to watch movies or do something with my family. for a beginner, how long am I looking at to convert/rip a bluray to a file I can access at home? I plan to upgrade as many as I can to ultraviolet, unless doing it the other route is easier than I thought. thanks.

Your answer is far too logical for this thread my friend.

[Zu Nim]

Originally Posted by alchav21

Now who is trying to confuse things, CDN (Content Delivery Network,) Application Layer. I was just talking about a Local Media Server, Storage and Access very simple. I'm not saying it's going to happen, they are just easy to setup. You guys take all this too personal, I'm just throwing ideas out there that are likely to happen.

Using well-defined terms isn't confusing. You described a "Local Server" as something that was remote and at best described as a CDN. I think, at least, because I'm not entirely sure what you were trying to get at.

What is a Local Server, they can be put anywhere. My ISP has me on an IntraNet, they can put a Local Server there.

Nothing you said is right or is what someone in the industry would be suggesting even 20 years ago. First, you're not on an intranet unless it's private to your ISP, and that's the opposite of what ISPs provide - access to the public internet. Second, once traffic leaves the LAN in your house via whatever physical layer technology (fiber, cable, copper, cellular, satellite) the servers you connect to are no longer local. The device that sits between your local network and your connection to your ISP most likely puts you on two separate layer 3 subnets so not even your ISP could be considered local. So no, you can't put "local" servers anywhere.

I'm not taking it personally. You are the one handwaving and bringing your bona fides into it. But if you don't use the right terms and concepts, don't be surprised when you're challenged on them.

[alchav21]

Originally Posted by alchav21

What is a Local Server they can be put anywhere. My ISP has me on an IntraNet, they can put a Local Server there.

Originally Posted by Zu Nim

Nothing you said is right or is what someone in the industry would be suggesting even 20 years ago. First, you're not on an intranet unless it's private to your ISP, and that's the opposite of what ISPs provide - access to the public internet. Second, once traffic leaves the LAN in your house via whatever physical layer technology (fiber, cable, copper, cellular, satellite) the servers you connect to are no longer local. The device that sits between your local network and your connection to your ISP most likely puts you on two separate layer 3 subnets so not even your ISP could be considered local. So no, you can't put "local" servers anywhere.

I'm not taking it personally. You are the one handwaving and bringing your bona fides into it. But if you don't use the right terms and concepts, don't be surprised when you're challenged on them.

Okay, sorry maybe I was using the wrong terminology, I was talking about a Media Server and probably is your CDN. I guess you worked IT, I was more on the Voice side and helped out IT. I am on Fiber to my ISP, and they set me up with a Switch that lights up all my RJ45 Jacks. Thanks for the clarification.

[alchav21]

Originally Posted by irighti

hi to all. I am not sure if I have posted in this thread before, but why can't the answer be both? I like both equally. having a physical copy for me is all about watching something I enjoy in the best possible way. when I introduced my daughters to star wars, indiana jones, back to the future- etc, I use my disc copy to show them the best possible version.

the digital side is just a great time saver. I can load up anything for my family in a few seconds without having to go and grab the disc from my media room. they can load up whatever movie they are in love with for that week and just watch anywhere.

it is just like with most format debates, they are great things about both. the people who are so devout in one over the other are missing out. I do not expect physical media to ever go away (although I do think it will be less plentiful). digital, streaming etc is only going to grow. the two can coexist without harming the other. just saying.

edit
I also love the idea of backing up all my movies to a home server, but the little down time I have I like to use to watch movies or do something with my family. for a beginner, how long am I looking at to convert/rip a bluray to a file I can access at home? I plan to upgrade as many as I can to ultraviolet, unless doing it the other route is easier than I thought. thanks.

Originally Posted by BMox81

Your answer is far too logical for this thread my friend.

I think when this Thread started most felt like you do, I still have a large Collection of Discs. Most of my Favorite Movies I'll keep the Blu-ray, but I really don't watch Disc anymore. A lot of people here have sold off most of their Collection, because it was taking up too much space. The Disc people feel the Quality is better, but Digital HD Streaming Quality has been going up and I say it's very dependent on your equipment setup and Bandwidth. So the Digital HD people like myself get very touchy when the Disc people say Digital HD is just "Good Enough." I think it makes for interesting Banter and Controversy, but at time it gets a little Heated.

Anyway, to answer your other question about backing up your Movies to a Home Server. Some people do this, and I have done it too. It does require good software, a powerful Workstation, and is very time consuming. This is why I have gone to the Digital HD route, but the Movie Purist feel Quality is an issue. Kaleidescape does offer a Home Server with Disc Quality Downloads, but they are very expensive. I feel the Quality of Digital HD will match Disc sooner than most think. The only problem with Streaming is Bandwidth, Access, and the proper equipment setup.

[randian]

Originally Posted by alchav21

The only problem with Streaming is Bandwidth, Access, and the proper equipment setup.

As long as Digital HD providers want to sell to people buying bare-minimum Internet service they'll never improve the quality of their video or audio. If they double average quality to ~10MB/S (or about 20% of Blu-ray's average 25 MB/S for those keeping score) they'll lose a lot of customers because those customers can't stream at those bit rates. Also, a lot of people buy bandwidth-limited phone service like Cricket (throttled by AT&T to 8MB/S max) because it's cheaper so they couldn't stream on their phone either.

[alchav21]

Originally Posted by alchav21

The only problem with Streaming is Bandwidth, Access, and the proper equipment setup.

Originally Posted by randian

As long as Digital HD providers want to sell to people buying bare-minimum Internet service they'll never improve the quality of their video or audio. If they double average quality to ~10MB/S (or about 20% of Blu-ray's average 25 MB/S for those keeping score) they'll lose a lot of customers because those customers can't stream at those bit rates. Also, a lot of people buy bandwidth-limited phone service like Cricket (throttled by AT&T to 8MB/S max) because it's cheaper so they couldn't stream on their phone either.

You're right, but it will all depend on Customer Demand and higher Bandwidth advancements. The minimum to watch 4K Content is 25Mbps, but in reality it's twice as much. Streaming Providers test your Bandwidth, and check your equipment compatibility to offer you their Services and Products. In order for Streaming Providers to be successful they have to keep up with Customer Demand. Those that do will survive, and the ones that don't will fade away. Then some Major Providers like Apple, will say their Quality is "Good Enough."

[Steedeel]

I see the interactive kids show is up on Netflix now. Puss in boots. Gave it a thumbs down.

Another reason to avoid Digital when they are coming up with crap like this.

Note to industry: stop trying to **** with our entertainment. If you must do this shit, do it on mobile, tablets and let the film/tv fans enjoy grown up, passive entertainment. Tv shows are great at the moment. LEAVE THEM ALONE!

I guarantee they will push this to adult content like top dramas and movies. I fear for movies in their current form, I really do. What with this and 'clean' movies being a thing.

[squatting hen]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

I see the interactive kids show is up on Netflix now. Puss in boots. Gave it a thumbs down.

Another reason to avoid Digital when they are coming up with crap like this.

Note to industry: stop trying to **** with our entertainment. If you must do this shit, do it on mobile, tablets and let the film/tv fans enjoy grown up, passive entertainment. Tv shows are great at the moment. LEAVE THEM ALONE!

I guarantee they will push this to adult content like top dramas and movies. I fear for movies in their current form, I really do. What with this and 'clean' movies being a thing.

You know....the Netflix rating system is only personalized to each user. So if you thumbs down something, it doesn't lower the rating for anyone else. Also, a true film fan would watch it, at least once.

I liked the Clean Version, and it is too bad that has been pulled....for now.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by squatting hen

You know....the Netflix rating system is only personalized to each user. So if you thumbs down something, it doesn't lower the rating for anyone else.

I liked the Clean Version, and it is too bad that has been pulled....for now.

Know that, I'm big stupid. It's just a principal thing.

Wait, they pulled Sony's 'clean' version films?

[Steedeel]

*not stupid

Oh the joys of non functioning buttons on my tablet. Can't edit.