Physical & Digital EST: The Future of Home Video Discussion Thread

[Misioon_Odisea]

Originally Posted by Wendell R. Breland

Wonder how many of the anti disc posters would turn down a free delivered and installed JVC NZ900 projector, a large scope Stewart screen, a Trinnov Altitude32 based immersive audio system, a R_volution NAS with 2000 Blu-ray and UHD Blu-ray titles on it, a R_volution media player, 1000 Blu-ray and UHD Blu-ray titles on disc and a Panasonic UB9000 UHD Blu-ray disc player. My money is on NONE would turn down such an offer.

Maybe nobody around these forums, but I do personally know in Real Life plenty of people who would actually and vehemently reject said offer, even if you deliberately bribed them in order to try to get them to accept it. They'd be happy to have the TV room with legit only a smart TV with its shoddy built-in apps and speakers, nothing external plugged into it, and nothing else in the entire room besides a couch and/or maybe an armchair at most. Legit nothing else, no other devices or furniture, just the seat and the display. And time again they've proven that it's not a money issue. Convenience is poison, I tell you, it makes for a miserable mindset.

I had to impose myself in order to at least make sure the place where I currently watch my discs didn't turn out that way, and even then, they refuse to ever use the external stereo speakers I installed for the TV and to share with everyone, under any circumstances. They actually go out of their ways to turn back on the built-in TV speakers in the settings! Right now, I'm still battling to convince them to let me plug in a Nintendo GameCube and a UPS at the minimum on the new TV we got last year (in which I also had to impose myself too so I could make sure it had Dolby Vision at least, for that matter). And that's just my household, I don't want to imagine how much worse it is elsewhere outside.

[cheez avenger]

Originally Posted by stonesfan129

Discs won't die out. But the prices are forcing a lot of people out. Eventually it will get like vinyl and SACD where you can buy them, you can buy players; but at massively inflated prices to where most people are just not going to waste time.

I'm with alchav21 on this. I use a number of different services like Tubi, PlutoTV, Freevee, Vudu, Apple; in addition to my 1080p Blu-ray collection, and handful of DVDs. The streamed content from the above services looks good enough to me to where I can enjoy something. And lots of times you can find deals as low as $5. Yeah you don't own it. But that's not much more than I'd pay for a rental anyway.

That's the irony, as was mentioned before, if folks remember the days of video sell through and laserdisc - movies were about $50 - $100 each in 90's money, so go get an inflation calculator and compare those with today's prices. We have never had it better when it comes to physical media and prices.

If folks want their streaming media that's fine too. The issue is when a person comes in here and trashes the physical media enthusiast for having a preference and that their opinion is the only one that matters and that everyone else is wrong.

[Anthony P]

Originally Posted by bhampton

Alchav,

How will you celebrate if your dream of a world without high quality media comes true ? Do you have plans for it ? Maybe buy some shiny new ethernet cables?

Originally Posted by alchav21

The question is what are you guys going to do? IPTV and Streaming is Quality enough for me.

I don't get your question. To put my point in perspective last year my friend invited us to his cottage and told me to bring my original xbox and some of the games we used to play because there will be a tournament night like we used to play back in the day. the next year we watched a movie but the younger kids picked up a DVD he had there and watrched it on my xbox.

If a day comes when there is no new players (last one I bought was 2020 my PS5 and next one my guess will be the next gaming machine I buy.) I will just continue using the players Ihave and if a day comes when there is no new maybe I will catch up on films I have not had time to buy but released but what ever haoppens I will be able to continue watching what I own.


That is the power of ownership. In your "horror" outcome the worst case sc3enario I just save a bunch of money .

The future is Fiber Networks, and Streaming is only going to get better.

you have been saying that for the last 15 years and it it still no where near as good. And as someone that supposedly can't see or hear the difference because for the last 15 years it looks fabulous how can it get better?

[Wendell R. Breland]

Originally Posted by Misioon_Odisea

Maybe nobody around these forums, but I do personally know in Real Life plenty of people who would actually and vehemently reject said offer, even if you deliberately bribed them in order to try to get them to accept it.

I know what your saying but really doubt most that you are referencing are members here (and/or AVS, AV Forum, etc.) and make post.

It has been my experience people that post negative comments about physical media are actually envious of those that find great joy of owning and using superior media. The age old have vs have nots. Nothing in terms of home theater been going on since the days of private BBS. It moved to CompuServe then to internet BBS.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by stonesfan129

Discs won't die out. But the prices are forcing a lot of people out. Eventually it will get like vinyl and SACD where you can buy them, you can buy players; but at massively inflated prices to where most people are just not going to waste time.

I'm with alchav21 on this. I use a number of different services like Tubi, PlutoTV, Freevee, Vudu, Apple; in addition to my 1080p Blu-ray collection, and handful of DVDs. The streamed content from the above services looks good enough to me to where I can enjoy something. And lots of times you can find deals as low as $5. Yeah you don't own it. But that's not much more than I'd pay for a rental anyway.

Most of us here use streaming/ digital copies. My digital collection is as large or larger than alchav's and Wendell has spent far more money on streaming hardware than alchav has on his entire system. The irony is that many of us that prefer physical media spend more on streaming than alchav does.

You and alchav both complain about the prices of physical media. The difference is that you actually buy physical media while he does not. The prices of discs do not affect him at all, but notice how he never has anything to say about streaming services increasing their prices. He fixates only upon the negatives of what other people enjoy.

Most people talk enthusiastically about what they enjoy, but he talks almost exclusively about what other people like with the intent to undermine it. His posts can be distilled into one simple theme: discs and their players are dying and we better get with the program and do as he does: use streaming only. That's not going to happen.

Most of us talk about our passions. He does not seem to have any passions of his own as he instead just talks about ours.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by Wendell R. Breland

Streaming was always targeted to the masses and that will not change. The masses is content with low data rate content as seen here (January 2025). Not much has changed in 40 years, us LD owners tried to show and explain the difference between LD and HBO & Showtime, video cassette with very little success.

Wonder how many of the anti disc posters would turn down a free delivered and installed JVC NZ900 projector, a large scope Stewart screen, a Trinnov Altitude32 based immersive audio system, a R_volution NAS with 2000 Blu-ray and UHD Blu-ray titles on it, a R_volution media player, 1000 Blu-ray and UHD Blu-ray titles on disc and a Panasonic UB9000 UHD Blu-ray disc player. My money is on NONE would turn down such an offer.

Doesn't mean that they would appreciate it, though. Pearls before swine as the expression goes.

[Anthony P]

Originally Posted by stonesfan129

How good must it look?

that is something we must all decide for ourselves.

If I sit there and worry about the quality, then I'm ruining the enjoyment of what I'm watching.

some people are happy with a 60% grade because they passed others might be happy withy a 80% grade others look at 80% and now that there is 100% and wish to get 100%. Every compression artifact I see and hear, I know it should not be there and it ruins my enjoyment. For me UHD is the least objectionable but I sure wish there was something better.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Anthony P

had to search what stone meant. Wish you and your family all the best with thyeir problems

Thanks mate.

[crutzulee]

Originally Posted by Wendell R. Breland

Just curious, if you are content with HT5 then why have Jellyfin as a server? Windows can group your HDD’s into one large volume then you could make that as a share which HT5 could see. I have no personal experience doing this, I use hardware RAID 5.

Other than NETFLIX exclusive movies (never my choice), I don't really use the service for movies (which i exclusively watch in my HT)... comedy specials, documentaries and the odd "TV" show get watched on a phone, tablet etc.. on rare occasions by various members of the family...

I'm not an activist for ANYTHING, but the wife and kids still have hearts and so their current focus on NETFLIX means that I've got to find some other solution..lol..

Jellyfin means that I can be watching something from my library on my phone at work, my son can watch something else on his super computer in his room, my in laws on their setup in Florida, my wife on her laptop and my daughter in my HT...

Things sent to the HT will pass full bitrate for display by the ZIDOO's internal player either chosen from the HT5 or the JF client app poster wall.... everything else will be transcoded on the fly to give the best possible experience to the end user based on the limitations of the tech on the other end...

Most of the parts we had lying around from what would have been higher end gaming components in their respective times...AMD 3700x 3.4ghz, NVIDIA RTX 2070super 32gb DDR4 ram.. I only had to throw in $70 on the local KIJIJI app ($20 gaming case and BNIB 750W power supply) and we were in business... We've been testing it for a couple of days now under various torture test scenarios and it has been very impressive with nary a hiccup...

[bhampton]

Originally Posted by Misioon_Odisea

Maybe nobody around these forums, but I do personally know in Real Life plenty of people who would actually and vehemently reject said offer, even if you deliberately bribed them in order to try to get them to accept it.

I tend to think most people would take the easy 20,000 dollars in resale ability.

[bhampton]

My Zidoo Z9X seems to have problems with most of my high rez Music blu ray audio files. The Division Bell and Meddle in 5.1 MKV will both lock the player up requiring me to pull power. My conclusion is these discs are a little out of spec in some way.

And, that's fine because it has no problems with movies and I don't have too many Blu Ray audio files and my BDP plays them even in MKV form.

[crutzulee]

Originally Posted by bhampton

My Zidoo Z9X seems to have problems with most of my high rez Music blu ray audio files. The Division Bell and Meddle in 5.1 MKV will both lock the player up requiring me to pull power. My conclusion is these discs are a little out of spec in some way.

And, that's fine because it has no problems with movies and I don't have too many Blu Ray audio files and my BDP plays them even in MKV form.

I've never looked into it because music is not really my thing, but from what I understand, the thing that differentiates ZIDOO'S base models in any lineup to it's higher end gear pertains to music playback specifically..

[bhampton]

Originally Posted by crutzulee

I've never looked into it because music is not really my thing, but from what I understand, the thing that differentiates ZIDOO'S base models in any lineup to it's higher end gear pertains to music playback specifically..

Well my Z9X is fine as is. I listen to those with the disc player. I don't mind having 3 sources - Disc Player, File Player, Streaming box.

[deatheats]

A lot of people have simply never seen a 4k disc on a decent screen, nor do they do an A-B comparison on what they could be seeing or hearing. Not to say this would sway everyone, but it wouldn’t hurt.

If 4k players were properly marketed as the last optical drive you’ll ever need to own…as it plays every CD, DVD, BluRay and 4k disc ; throw in a decent set of streaming apps maybe an SSD, and bam, there is your home media center.

Unfortunately, the writing was on the wall from media conglomerates that Streaming was the only revenue source they cared about, and they’d much rather present an inferior quality version to homes on a subscription than basically what amounts to a theater experience the consumer owns.

On the hardware side, the beauty of the audio world is how slowly it has changed over time. It is an investment that pays off over decades. You start simple, maybe a decent stereo receiver setup, and over the years add in pieces (center channel, surrounds, heights), replace others that didn’t quite live up. Sure new ports or codecs show up, but ultimately a receiver from the 70s is just as capable of pushing out a great Mono or stereo track as any modern equipment.

By the time you are in deep, you’ve probably got a couple of nice starter systems you could donate to a friend or family member. However, complexity (wires), as folks mentioned above drive a lot of people away. While I don’t own a soundbar, at least they are allowing some of these consumers a way to get decent sound with a small tech footprint. If only they would do themselves a favor and improve the source

[alchav21]

Originally Posted by stonesfan129

How good must it look? I have been totally happy with Apple's stream quality. Vudu is mostly good (they still have some old masters that need updating). If I sit there and worry about the quality, then I'm ruining the enjoyment of what I'm watching. And if it's only $5-8, I'm really not going to complain much.

We don't want to change or convince anybody, we enjoy watching Movies like you guys. Just because we enjoy the Quality of Streaming Movies with the Equipment we have, doesn't mean the enjoyment is less because it's not on Disc. There will always be something better, your High End Projectors and Sound Systems bring out the best on Disc. Our enjoyment with the Streaming Equipment we have is not any less than yours.

You asked what High End Home Theaters I've seen, well my Nephew in Texas had a real nice State of the Art HT. Yes we watched some 4K Movies and they looked and sounded Fantastic, but my enjoyment was not any better than my Streaming Movies. As a matter of fact I watched some Streaming Movies on his System and they looked and sounded like Discs...He had Fiber!

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by alchav21

We don't want to change or convince anybody, we enjoy watching Movies like you guys. Just because we enjoy the Quality of Streaming Movies with the Equipment we have, doesn't mean the enjoyment is less because it's not on Disc.

If we did not also enjoy streaming movies, we would not do it. Many of us spend more on streaming and digital than you do.

A key difference between us is that we do not restrict our enjoyment of movies to a single format like you do. Using more formats means better selection which increases our overall enjoyment of movies because we have much more to choose from than you do.

I still enjoy movies that are only available on DVD and laserdisc, but it only makes sense that I would much prefer to see them in higher quality on a superior format.

I can watch a movie in my office on my 60" 4K TV and listen with its built-in speakers, but why would I when I can choose to watch them with my 85" 4K TV connected to a nine speaker surround sound system in my living room? I can still enjoy my favorite movies in my office, but I damn well enjoy them a lot more in my living room.

I can watch my DVD copies of The Lord Of The Rings or my blu-ray copies or my digital copies or my 4K UHD disc copies, which do you think I would enjoy the most? This is really not that difficult to understand, is it?

[alchav21]

Originally Posted by Vilya

A key difference between us is that we do not restrict our enjoyment of movies to a single format like you do. Using more formats means better selection which increases our overall enjoyment of movies because we have much more to choose from than you do.

Here we go again, with Wendell's Graphs it clearly shows with IPTV and Streaming I have 90% of the Video Market to only about your 50% with Streaming and Disc. So I should have better selection with increased Enjoyment!

[bhampton]

Fiber is good for regularity.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by alchav21

We don't want to change or convince anybody, we enjoy watching Movies like you guys. Just because we enjoy the Quality of Streaming Movies with the Equipment we have, doesn't mean the enjoyment is less because it's not on Disc. There will always be something better, your High End Projectors and Sound Systems bring out the best on Disc. Our enjoyment with the Streaming Equipment we have is not any less than yours.

You asked what High End Home Theaters I've seen, well my Nephew in Texas had a real nice State of the Art HT. Yes we watched some 4K Movies and they looked and sounded Fantastic, but my enjoyment was not any better than my Streaming Movies. As a matter of fact I watched some Streaming Movies on his System and they looked and sounded like Discs...He had Fiber!

Having fibre (FTTP) means nothing for A/V quality, just potential performance improvement as in no buffering or switching to lower res if issues occur.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by alchav21

Here we go again, with Wendell's Graphs it clearly shows with IPTV and Streaming I have 90% of the Video Market to only about your 50% with Streaming and Disc. So I should have better selection with increased Enjoyment!