The Dark Knight Rises (2012)

[Todd Smith]

Originally Posted by srinivas1015

Watched The Dark Knight Rises for the first time today.

Movie : 3.5/5
Better than The Dark Knight but not as good as Batman Begins. I watched half yesterday (stopped after the first Batman/Bane fight) and finished the other half today. I was never bored but I can't accurately comment on the pacing until I watch it a second time though I doubt it's gonna hold up well. Begins is excellently paced and time flies whenever I watch it. TDK's pacing isn't that great either. The boat sequence in particular is boring after watching the movie once.

Pacing - BB>TDK>>TDKR

I am really disappointed with the score in this film. Zimmer mostly reused stuff from Batman Begins' soundtrack (just like he did with The Dark Knight). People should remember that BB's score was a collaboration of Zimmer and James Newton-Howard. James was the one responsible for the orchestra and the more 'melodic' aspects of the Trilogy's soundtrack and more importantly, the main theme.
I was disappointed with the score the most during these three scenes:
1)The scene where

[Show spoiler]Bruce climbs out of the well

. This scene should have had something other than the chant or the chant should have been used only for this scene. It needed a piece of music unique to this scene and this scene only. By this time in the film, the chant has been used a lot and is no longer 'special'. I also wished there were more references to the 'why do we fall' lesson other than just that 1 second flashback. "Why do we fall" was implemented much more effectively in BB when the manor burns down.
2)The scene where

[Show spoiler]Batman takes off with the bomb

. I was hoping the music to be more melodic/emotional/beautiful. The worst part is when the kids see the Bat and the same old theme kicks in...just like every other appearance of Batman. This whole segment should have been a new piece of music with a mix of sadness and hope (something like The Thin Red Line's soundtrack, which was also composed by Zimmer).

This is the track I'm referring to:
THE THIN RED LINE - Journey to the line - YouTube



This film's soundtrack should have been as epic as that.

3)The scene where Batman

[Show spoiler]appears on the ice

. There was little to no score in this scene and a scene like this should have been chill inducing.




Overall, I liked the movie but it could have been better. The cafe scene was cheesy as hell and could have been executed better. One more thing, I literally laughed at loud at

[Show spoiler]Talia/Miranda Tate

's death scene. That is THE worst acting I have ever seen. And people complain about bad acting in the Star Wars prequels..


Video : 4/5
The 35mm scenes looked overly soft and while the IMAX scenes look better, they still appear to be lacking detail. The photography of this film is just abysmal. Look at The Amazing Spiderman to see how to do dark photography with ambient lighting, still have loads of detail and most importantly, use shadows artistically and effectively; not just dim the entire image to the point where the blacks are crushed . The color timing/color grading of TDK and TDKR is horrid, especially in the daytime sequences.
Atleast there isn't any Edge Enhancement or DNR this time.

Audio - 4/5
Why do people keep calling this the best AQ of 2012? It's the one with the most bass but that is no way to judge the AQ. I've noticed many scenes where the bass is quite simply unkept and borderline boomy. In some of the scenes, the dialogue is mixed way too low and can hardly be heard over the music. The surrounds kick in during the action sequences but atmospherics during non-action scenes are barely existent. The first appearance of The Bat is noteworthy where the bass is like a wave that swoops over you. But the sound design is nothing compared to that of Prometheus or The Amazing Spider-Man.


If I had to rate all three movies out of 10,
Batman Begins - 9.5/10
The Dark Knight - 7/10
The Dark Knight Rises - 8/10

I agree with a lot of your thoughts on the A/V of DKR. The inconsistency from the IMAX to non IMAX footage took me out of the film to some degree. The IMAX footage while very good at times was also a bit inconsistent it seemed. There is also this strange faint strobing type element to these films in parts of both the IMAX and non IMAX footage alike that I found distracting. BB is the worst for this, but all 3 have this issue in both dark and bright scenes at times.

I actually really enjoyed the audio, but understand your complaints. This certainly is not the best mix this year from a pure technical perspective. This mix goes for bombast at the expense of everything else which I enjoyed, but again not the most creative or artistic mix. Prometheus is just one example of a mix that was better from a technical perspective this year and there are lots of other examples as well in the blu library. Being a bass head though, I still enjoyed the hell out of the bombastic nature of this one even if it was not the most technically proficient.

One thing I do disagree with you on is the DK. I watched all 3 of these films back to back to back on Fri night and to my ears, DK clearly had the best sound mix overall. BB was very good, but DK took it to the next level all around, especially in the low end. I enjoyed the audio on all 3 though to one extent or another.

[srinivas1015]

Originally Posted by Todd Smith

I agree with a lot of your thoughts on the A/V of DKR. The inconsistency from the IMAX to non IMAX footage took me out of the film to some degree. The IMAX footage while very good at times was also a bit inconsistent it seemed. There is also this strange faint strobing type element to these films in parts of both the IMAX and non IMAX footage alike that I found distracting. BB is the worst for this, but all 3 have this issue in both dark and bright scenes at times.

I actually really enjoyed the audio, but understand your complaints. This certainly is not the best mix this year from a pure technical perspective. This mix goes for bombast at the expense of everything else which I enjoyed, but again not the most creative or artistic mix. Prometheus is just one example of a mix that was better from a technical perspective this year and there are lots of other examples as well in the blu library. Being a bass head though, I still enjoyed the hell out of the bombastic nature of this one even if it was not the most technically proficient.

One thing I do disagree with you on is the DK. I watched all 3 of these films back to back to back and to my ears, DK clearly had the best sound mix overall. BB was very good, but DK took it to the next level all around, especially in the low end. I enjoyed the audio on all 3 though to one extent or another.

The last rating of all three movies is of the movies themselves, not the AQ .
The bass was great but even in the action sequences, it was a little too 'chaotic'. Like you said, it went all out bombastic and I enjoyed it too but I wish it went bombastic while still maintaining 'fidelity' like the action sequences in The Amazing Spider-Man.

[Whirlygig]

Originally Posted by King_Spade

So there's no way of me getting the Bat Cowl version? UGH.....are they going to release more or only way is spending an arm & leg?

Eventually (if not now) you could buy one of the non-limited cowl sets released overseas for a lot less. Then put in the US discs if desired.

[Todd Smith]

Originally Posted by srinivas1015

The last rating of all three movies is of the movies themselves, not the AQ .
The bass was great but even in the action sequences, it was a little too 'chaotic'. Like you said, it went all out bombastic and I enjoyed it too but I wish it went bombastic while still maintaining 'fidelity' like the action sequences in The Amazing Spider-Man.

I hear ya. Funny thing about Spiderman is that while the mix is very good, the LFE is focused on the 30hz and below if you see the graphs while the mid/upper bass is not as prominent as most other films. This is just the opposite of a lot of tracks that are strong down to around 30hz or so then drop off (Avengers for example has a ~30hz filter employed if you see the graphs and feels like it is missing that last bit of extension in a system that can dig below 20hz to some degree). I enjoyed the AS audio as well, but the LFE feels a bit lacking due to this vs something more full range like Prometheus, Incredible Hulk, etc.......

OOOPS! Sorry, just realized your ratings were for the movies and not the AQ.

[TheBully]

Originally Posted by djgcue

This may have been discussed, but I couldn't find any mention of it.

Anyone else experience weird cuts in scenes? I'll have to go back to get exact times, but one example is where Anne Hathaway is looking at someone's picture in a broken frame in an unknown broken into house. All of a sudden she's talking to her friend about something?

There's also scenes which just end abruptly, you can tell because the music just ends and jumps to some other audio.

Weird editing?

Maybe you can submit that to moviemistakes.com and they should have a list of mistakes for TDKR. But I'll list them here.

[Show spoiler]
Character mistake: As Bruce Wayne is researching the jewel thief, the word "Heist" is spelled "Hiest" in a newspaper headline.

Continuity: When the crowd of freed cops run into the thugs, the baddies shoot and several cops fall dead on the floor, yet disappear in the immediate aerial angle.

Continuity: When Bruce is meeting with Lucius in the office at Wayne Tower, the book on the seat next to Bruce changes positions during their conversation.

Audio problem: When Batman and Catwoman meet at the sewers, the angles of her swap between frontal and side shots. During a side shot, she says the word "slate" but the audio is way out of sync with her lips.

Continuity: After the military tell Blake that he can't cross the bridge with the kids, he tells the boys to get in the bus. The second time he says it, there's a side angle of Blake where his mouth is not moving at all.

Continuity: During the intro sequence, the camera points upward inside the bottom plane, allowing the viewer to see outside the hole, where nothing apparently exists except blue sky. Cut to an outside shot, and the suggested angle of the plane suggests we should be able to see the top plane outside the hole. Yet whenever we are inside, the top plane and the wires holding the planes together all mysteriously disappear.

Continuity: The bleachers in the stadium are semi-empty in the aerial angles, but packed with people in the close-ups.

Audio problem: Inside the well, when Bruce is about to take the final leap, the inmates are heard shouting "Rise!" in one single perfect cry, yet when the angle focuses on them no-one's mouth is in sync with the sound. Furthermore, no one's mouth is in sync with the inmate next to him.

Audio problem: When Batman and Bane are fighting on the bridge, 3 punches before Batman falls over the bridge, he swings a punch at Bane where he misses by far, yet the sound is heard and Bane reacts to it.

Audio problem: When a yuppie is tied on a motorbike, his teeth are clenched, yet he is heard crying with perfect pronunciation "Let me go!" and several other lines.

Revealing: When Blake and Gordon watch Bane on TV during Gotham's siege, a grey (sometimes white) square is reflected on Gordon's glasses. It's either a lighting screen or the proof that the TV is turned off and the image on it is added on post-production.

Revealing: During the party, the second time Gordon gives a speech praising Dent, a lighting screen is reflected on his glasses, which disappears in opposite shots.

Continuity: When Bruce meets with Lucius in his office his hands change from being on top of his cane in one shot to being just below it in the next.

[moviecriticsonline]

I past on the "cheap plastic" bat cowl edition. If it was bigger, and made out of metal I would of considered it. I don't care if it's detailed or not. They did a lousy job with the inclusion of the discs too. It's as if their saying, oh here you go, you want the discs too? Ok then, well just shove them in the lousy slot.

[TheBully]

Originally Posted by moviecriticsonline

I past on the "cheap plastic" bat cowl edition. If it was bigger, and made out of metal I would of considered it. I don't care if it's detailed or not. They did a lousy job with the inclusion of the discs too. It's as if their saying, oh here you go, you want the discs too? Ok then, well just shove them in the lousy slot.

Yeah, it would've been nice if they just added the standard version in it.

[King_Spade]

Originally Posted by moviecriticsonline

I past on the "cheap plastic" bat cowl edition. If it was bigger, and made out of metal I would of considered it. I don't care if it's detailed or not. They did a lousy job with the inclusion of the discs too. It's as if their saying, oh here you go, you want the discs too? Ok then, well just shove them in the lousy slot.

Oh is it really crappy?

[42041]

Originally Posted by mlittle3

It's easily the best blockbuster trilogy ever. More consistent than Star Wars, better written than Lord of the Rings, and much more involving than Bourne. The only superhero films (aside from Watchmen) with any substance at all. Anyone who thinks Avengers, Spider-man or Superman movies have anything important to say is kidding themselves. And I like Spider-man and Iron Man and even Captain America. But even the good superhero movies are pure fluff. Kid's stuff. Nolan's Batman films are a cut above all that crap.

Does a superhero film need to say something "important"? Do we need to remake Star Wars as a ponderous character drama where Obi-Wan starts weeping in every scene?
And there's a big difference between striking a tone of somber self-importance and actually having "anything important to say". For me, that's one of the big problems with the Nolan Batman films, there's an incoherence between the ever-so-serious tone and the outlandish silliness of the premise, which completely undermines Nolan's "dark" approach for me.

[moviecriticsonline]

Originally Posted by King_Spade

Oh is it really crappy?

I watched a few unboxings of it on YouTube, and I wasn't impressed by it. My friend bought one and I saw it in person too, and again wasn't impressed.

I know many people bought it, and love it, and more power to them. But, it's a bit too flimsy for my taste.

[MifuneFan]

Cheap quality is to be expected when they're selling it for like $25-$30. The disc slot is poor on it though. It's funny that people are paying hundreds for it just because they artificially made it a limited number edition in the US. Warner is rather stupid to make only 35K for the US too for such a popular movie (their most popular release this year no doubt). They could have probably made 100K and it still would sell out fairly quickly.

[rickah88]

Originally Posted by moviecriticsonline

I watched a few unboxings of it on YouTube, and I wasn't impressed by it. My friend bought one and I saw it in person too, and again wasn't impressed.

I know many people bought it, and love it, and more power to them. But, it's a bit too flimsy for my taste.

Obviously beauty is in the eye of the beholder.
Had this release been made of metal, as you mentioned previously, not only would it weigh much more, but would probably retail for x4-x5 the amount.
Now maybe if they made 100 of them out of metal, which would make them much more collectible? Or use a cheaper material, like resin, again that would still raise production costs.
For me, the plastic, and the attention to detail make this a nice display piece.

[moviecriticsonline]

Originally Posted by rickah88

Obviously beauty is in the eye of the beholder.
Had this release been made of metal, as you mentioned previously, not only would it weigh much more, but would probably retail for x4-x5 the amount.
Now maybe if they made 100 of them out of metal, which would make them much more collectible? Or use a cheaper material, like resin, again that would still raise production costs.
For me, the plastic, and the attention to detail make this a nice display piece.

The amount of money this film has already made, I'm sure they will be just fine with production costs to make a few thousand metal bat cowls. Even if the price was higher, it still would of been worth it.

[rickah88]

Originally Posted by moviecriticsonline

The amount of money this film has already made, I'm sure they will be just fine with production costs to make a few thousand metal bat cowls. Even if the price was higher, it still would of been worth it.

As a collector/enthusiast, I agree with you. Clearly stdio heads do not!
As I said, I'm happy with it. I just like the trend of having multiple purchasing options...that's never a bad thing!

[Extremis]

I have two more UV code for TDKR if anyone wants one. Just PM me.
Three of them went.

[moviecriticsonline]

Originally Posted by rickah88

As a collector/enthusiast, I agree with you. Clearly stdio heads do not!
As I said, I'm happy with it. I just like the trend of having multiple purchasing options...that's never a bad thing!

Which is why studio heads continue to make a lot of crap, because they know people will buy it.

I'm definitely not one of them.

[avpjunkie]

Originally Posted by ryan4butler

I have two more UV code for TDKR if anyone wants one. Just PM me.
Three of them went.

ryan4butler I sent you a PM...

[Extremis]

No more codes left. All gone.

[Ironhorse75]

I was wondering, is the softness in th 35mm scenes a problem or simply an accurate representation of the source material?

It just blows my mind that this is the final product for a 2012 new release for one of the biggest movies to ever touch the format.

[Jumpman]

Originally Posted by Ironhorse75

I was wondering, is the softness in th 35mm scenes a problem or simply an accurate representation of the source material?

It just blows my mind that this is the final product for a 2012 new release for one of the biggest movies to ever touch the format.

Acurate, considering Nolan finishes his films photo chemically, instead of doing DI's.