The Dark Knight Rises (2012)

[rickah88]

Originally Posted by metal134

I just don't see it. They are nominated, judged and awarded by a panel based on criteria of which we have no real knowledge. The ONLY discernable difference is that one is movies and one is music. Other than that, they are, for all intents and purposes, twins.

Using your initial example...has a film ever "lip-synched" it's way to a Best Picture award? Do the Top 40 airplay movies always win? No.

Sorry, it will always be apples/oranges. There's no way Oscars & Grammys share the same criteria.

[xSeanZx]

I wanted to add something about the difference in 35mm and 70mm shots...

[Show spoiler]This was something I had a problem with towards the end, when they are fighting in the snow, and then batman kicks bane into the building. The transfer in that scene is really really bad. The audio becomes terrible, and it just looks bad. Other than that I had no issue.

[MifuneFan]

Originally Posted by GuruAskew

This movie was a disappointment for a substantial portion of its audience and was noticeably less well-received than its predecessors regardless of what accolades it's defenders cherry-pick..

IMDB user ratings:

Batman Begins: 8.3/10
TDK: 9.0/10
Rises: 8.7/10

Rotten Tomatoes:

Batman Begins: 85%
TDK: 94%
Rises: 87%

Clearly it's better received than Begins has been by viewers and reviewers. And it's hardly a surprise that it didn't top TDK considering how great that was, and the amount of hype that surrounded that release. I think anyone could have told you that it couldn't live up to TDK, perhaps a year before Rises even came out. Even with that said, there's just a .3 differential between the two on IMDB, hardly a significant difference. So no, this wasn't a disappointment for any substantial portion of the population. That's based on a mere 465,000+ votes, what numbers do you have to back up your claim?

[Nightwing Begins]

Originally Posted by Beast

Michael Keaton. Because he captured the duality of the character the best.

He did such a good job that you would never assume that his Bruce Wayne was Batman. Marvelous job.

And he didn't need to be a complete drunken rich playboy spaz in public like Bale was in Batman Begins. Or growl like he smoked 2 packs a day.

Exactly. Did you find it lame that Nolan had Wayne use the same Waynetech pulse thing on the cameras outside the fundraiser that he would use as Batman on a bigger scale the next night? Any one of the camera guys could have pieced "Hey look. Batman comes back the day after Bruce Wayne does and has the same thing he had." Way to keep it on the DL, Bruce.

[Jumpman]

Originally Posted by mifunefan

imdb user ratings:

Batman begins: 8.3/10
tdk: 9.0/10
rises: 8.7/10

rotten tomatoes:

Batman begins: 85%
tdk: 94%
rises: 87%

clearly it's better received than begins has been by viewers and reviewers. And it's hardly a surprise that it didn't top tdk considering how great that was, and the amount of hype that surrounded that release. I think anyone could have told you that it couldn't live up to tdk, perhaps a year before rises even came out. Even with that said, there's just a .3 differential between the two on imdb, hardly a significant difference. So no, this wasn't a disappointment for any substantial portion of the population.

+1.

[Jumpman]

Originally Posted by Nightwing Begins

Exactly. Did you find it lame that Nolan had Wayne use the same Waynetech pulse thing on the cameras outside the fundraiser that he would use as Batman on a bigger scale the next night? Any one of the camera guys could have pieced "Hey look. Batman comes back the day after Bruce Wayne does and has the same thing he had." Way to keep it on the DL, Bruce.

Considering Bruce Wayne disappeared three years prior to the beginning of Rises, I don't see the connection at all. Batman's been gone for eight years.

[metal134]

Originally Posted by rickah88

Using your initial example...has a film ever "lip-synched" it's way to a Best Picture award? Do the Top 40 airplay movies always win?

That's not the point. The point is that shitty music is and can be popular as well as shitty movies. Again, I liked the Dark Knight Rises, but the point is that a shitty movie can be (and often is) popular.

[Dreamliner330]

I almost liked Batman Begins the best. TDK, but TDKR more so had a major lack of gadgets (tool belt usage).

I will say, mistakes and choreography really show on repeat viewings.

[rickah88]

Originally Posted by metal134

That's not the point. The point is that shitty music is and can be popular as well as shitty movies. Again, I liked the Dark Knight Rises, but the point is that a shitty movie can be (and often is) popular.

Obviously we share different views.
I think Oscar/Grammy are apples/oranges. You don't.

[metal134]

That's right. I don't.

[Nightwing Begins]

Originally Posted by rickah88

Using your initial example...has a film ever "lip-synched" it's way to a Best Picture award?

Depends. With the use of ADR in films since atleast the 50's (I'm sure before that, but I'm just stating what I'm sure of), it is quite possible. Not saying Goldfinger was a winner, but the character had all his lines dubbed in that film. ADR is technically lip-synching whether they use the same actor or another.

[rickah88]

Originally Posted by metal134

That's right. I don't.

[Beast]

Originally Posted by Nightwing Begins

Exactly. Did you find it lame that Nolan had Wayne use the same Waynetech pulse thing on the cameras outside the fundraiser that he would use as Batman on a bigger scale the next night? Any one of the camera guys could have pieced "Hey look. Batman comes back the day after Bruce Wayne does and has the same thing he had." Way to keep it on the DL, Bruce.

Yeah. That was pretty groan worthy. And made me wonder why more people haven't figured out that Bruce Wayne is Batman. Not even Commissioner Gordon, who's had the most dealings with Batman. But yet some snot nosed punk Cop just figures it out with some wild leaps of logic. And when confronted... he just admits it. Yet Catwoman, who was right there when Bane called him Bruce Wayne... seems to have the same mental disorder as the guy in Memento. Cause when Bruce pops back up after escaping "The Pit", they're back to playing the game of "My Friend/Your Friend".

[GuruAskew]

Originally Posted by MifuneFan

IMDB user ratings:

Batman Begins: 8.3/10
TDK: 9.0/10
Rises: 8.7/10

Rotten Tomatoes:

Batman Begins: 85%
TDK: 94%
Rises: 87%

Clearly it's better received than Begins has been by viewers and reviewers. And it's hardly a surprise that it didn't top TDK considering how great that was, and the amount of hype that surrounded that release. I think anyone could have told you that it couldn't live up to TDK, perhaps a year before Rises even came out. Even with that said, there's just a .3 differential between the two on IMDB, hardly a significant difference. So no, this wasn't a disappointment for any substantial portion of the population. That's based on a mere 465,000+ votes, what numbers do you have to back up your claim?

I don't think people necessarily are remembering how they voted for certain films years ago on imdb. In this case there's as much as a 7-year spread between votes. And both Nolan BB sequels have been subject to ridiculous and fanatical campaigns to manipulate imdb rankings anyway and that didn't happen with the first film.

Look around. TDKR is the first of the Nolan Batman movies that isn't beyond criticism and its nobody's favorite in the trilogy. You can post all the aggregate scores and rankings and polls but at the end of the day you can't deny that it experienced a cooler reception among its audience. Well, you can (obviously) but you're only fooling yourself.

[rickah88]

Originally Posted by GuruAskew

I don't think people necessarily are remembering how they voted for certain films years ago on imdb. In this case there's as much as a 7-year spread between votes. And both Nolan BB sequels have been subject to ridiculous and fanatical campaigns to manipulate imdb rankings anyway and that didn't happen with the first film.

Look around. TDKR is the first of the Nolan Batman movies that isn't beyond criticism and its nobody's favorite in the trilogy. You can post all the aggregate scores and rankings and polls but at the end of the day you can't deny that it experienced a cooler reception among its audience. Well, you can (obviously) but you're only fooling yourself.

So if it gets nominated for Best Picture, what then?

[Jumpman]

Originally Posted by GuruAskew

I don't think people necessarily are remembering how they voted for certain films years ago on imdb. In this case there's as much as a 7-year spread between votes. And both Nolan BB sequels have been subject to ridiculous and fanatical campaigns to manipulate imdb rankings anyway and that didn't happen with the first film.

Look around. TDKR is the first of the Nolan Batman movies that isn't beyond criticism and its nobody's favorite in the trilogy. You can post all the aggregate scores and rankings and polls but at the end of the day you can't deny that it experienced a cooler reception among its audience. Well, you can (obviously) but you're only fooling yourself.

It wasn't that much cooler. You make it seem like it got a 60% rating at rottentomatoes.com.

[MifuneFan]

Originally Posted by GuruAskew

I don't think people necessarily are remembering how they voted for certain films years ago on imdb. In this case there's as much as a 7-year spread between votes. And both Nolan BB sequels have been subject to ridiculous and fanatical campaigns to manipulate imdb rankings anyway and that didn't happen with the first film.

Look around. TDKR is the first of the Nolan Batman movies that isn't beyond criticism and its nobody's favorite in the trilogy. You can post all the aggregate scores and rankings and polls but at the end of the day you can't deny that it experienced a cooler reception among its audience. Well, you can (obviously) but you're only fooling yourself.

So you don't have anything to back up your claims then? Got it.

[GuruAskew]

Originally Posted by Jumpman

It wasn't that much cooler. You make it seem like it got a 60% rating at rottentomatoes.com.

I never said that. But I do think TDKR will historically be rated as the worst film of the trilogy and I don't think AFI throwing the film a bone is going to change that nor do I think the Academy is going to pull a "Return of the King" by unofficially recognizing an entire series by honoring one film when the film itself is not a home run.

[Jumpman]

Originally Posted by GuruAskew

I never said that. But I do think TDKR will historically be rated as the worst film of the trilogy and I don't think AFI throwing the film a bone is going to change that nor do I think the Academy is going to pull a "Return of the King" by unofficially recognizing an entire series by honoring one film when the film itself is not a home run.

Well because they didn't do it for Potter (which they SHOULD HAVE), yeah, Nolan's trilogy isn't getting that treatment either.

Still chaps my ass that Return of the King won for the trilogy. Wasn't even close to being the best film of the trilogy.

[Nightwing Begins]

Originally Posted by Jumpman

Considering Bruce Wayne disappeared three years prior to the beginning of Rises, I don't see the connection at all. Batman's been gone for eight years.

I see your point, but the movie contradicts itself on that. He never met Miranda until the funraiser. If she really invested all that cash into the project, they would have met prior to that night. Everyone seems surprised to see Bruce with a cane, but if he were around 5 years after Harvey died, people would be aware. I blame bad writing and/or continuity control.