Physical & Digital EST: The Future of Home Video Discussion Thread

[flyry]

Originally Posted by veritas

Trying movies anywhere at this point I am not sure if its a win for physical or digital. On one hand they gave away a shit ton of free stuff but on the other hand everything is glitchy with uhd stuff turning to sd and customer service is basically none existent now as the major studios basically say we are sol when we call for help.

I think this whole experience makes physical look a hell of a lot more reliable in comparison.

All these companies need to do is push fixed version of the films into the service but instead they are all pointing at each other saying its not our fault its that companies rather then fixing the problem. It should not be the customer that is trying to fix your service with you they should take the code info go oh ya that is valid add it to your account and then fix it on the back end on their own time instead they are wasting both our time and the Indian guys time who keeps having to give us bull answers.

Anyway with my experience with movies anywhere I don't wanna buy digital anymore (if they ever beak I know they wont help me) but I don't really want to buy stuff from these guys in physical form either. These companies are willing to shoot themselves in the foot over a matter of who has to pay pennies.

How can you trust them to keep your digital library up years in the future when they wont even fix problems you have currently.

Movies Anywhere has been up and running for 4 days. I think you're overreacting.

[veritas]

Originally Posted by flyry

Movies Anywhere has been up and running for 4 days. I think you're overreacting.

I am not talking about them having problems though I am talking about how they deal with problems.

I have a problem with a fox digital copy so I call fox and they send me over to iTunes who cant fix the problem either meanwhile they could fix this whole thing though ma...

If I go to a restaurant and they screw up my order and I tell the waiter he doesn't go not my department you gotta talk to the manager who then sends you the chef who then sends you back to the waiter.

The entire digital movies system right now seems to be built on shifting the blame for who will need to pay the pennies to fix the problem and regenerate the code.

It doesn't matter if your business is days old or years old customer service should fix problems not shift blame to other departments and leaving the customer screwed.

[flyry]

Originally Posted by veritas

I am not talking about them having problems though I am talking about how they deal with problems.

I have a problem with a fox digital copy so I call fox and they send me over to iTunes who cant fix the problem either meanwhile they could fix this whole thing though ma...

If I go to a restaurant and they screw up my order and I tell the waiter he doesn't go not my department you gotta talk to the manager who then sends you the chef who then sends you back to the waiter.

The entire digital movies system right now seems to be built on shifting the blame for who will need to pay the pennies to fix the problem and regenerate the code.

It doesn't matter if your business is days old or years old customer service should fix problems not shift blame to other departments and leaving the customer screwed.

I hear you, but I've never really had an issue that wasn't ultimately fixed.

Usually I go to the studios directly.

I even chatted with defunct flixster video twice last week to get some issues resolved.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by flyry

Gimmick, just like 3D and VR etc.

Neither are a gimmick. I genuinely thought that 3D has enhanced many films. Gravity for example. Sure, the way it is used most times is w gimmick because directors don’t commit to the format and it leaves a half way house. 3D when utilised correctly, ho gimmick. VR, well only people who don’t own one call them gimmicks.

As for interactive, there is a definite push. Apple getting involved is not good as they want to differentiate with their content and I think they see interactive as the way to do that. It’s an ideal chance to get content working across the Ipad, IPhone and Apple TV. I think you lot are wrong not to worry about this.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by master gandhi

Most of us don’t share your fear of an interactive future. The second screen experience never really got mainstream to my knowledge, unless kids were using it. For the most part, these interactive experiences are for kids, so you needn’t worry about it taking over cinema IMO.

Tablets didn’t take off until Apple got involved. Same thing could happen here. They won’t be happy until everything is interactive and films are robbed of their intregity and story.

[flyry]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

Neither are a gimmick. I genuinely thought that 3D has enhanced many films. Gravity for example. Sure, the way it is used most times is w gimmick because directors don’t commit to the format and it leaves a half way house. 3D when utilised correctly, ho gimmick. VR, well only people who don’t own one call them gimmicks.

As for interactive, there is a definite push. Apple getting involved is not good as they want to differentiate with their content and I think they see interactive as the way to do that. It’s an ideal chance to get content working across the Ipad, IPhone and Apple TV. I think you lot are wrong not to worry about this.

Definitely a gimmick to me. The only worthy movies in almost a decade since it's resurgence have been Gravity and Avatar. That's all people really ever mention.

This forum is full of 3d fanboys who prefer it over 4k though so I won't bother to argue the point further.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by flyry

Definitely a gimmick to me. The only worthy movies in almost a decade since it's resurgence have been Gravity and Avatar. That's all people really ever mention.

This forum is full of 3d fanboys who prefer it over 4k though so I won't bother to argue the point further.

House Of Wax
Gravity
Avatar
Life Of Pi
The Walk
Doctor Strange
GOTG 2
It Came From Outer Space

All picked up in last year and reference quality 3D that enhanced the movie. I wouldn’t want it over 4K but I would want both where necessary. A gimmick to me is something that is cool but doesn’t serve a purpose. Great 3D serves a purpose and presents the artists vision in some cases.
The industry has killed off 3D, there is a big enough market for it to have a following and make a profit although it is niche. It’s a warning of what could come when the industry gets greedy, expect more of that stuff with different formats going forward.

By the way, there is a treasure trove of vintage films with super 3D but the ignorant mainstream are clueless as usual.

[veritas]

Originally Posted by flyry

Gimmick, just like 3D and VR etc.

I would say hdr is more of a gimmick then 3d. I mean 4k and hdr are supposed to make your movie look "better" by changing the color and putting 2k intermediates on 4k discs. more then 90% of people wont see a difference between 4k and 2k at normal viewing distances and changing old films is normally considered a bad thing.

4k and hdr are basically being sold to people as a placebo effect by saying it looks better then blu ray when it in most cases it doesn't offer any significant improvements. If that isn't a gimmick I don't know what is. 4k and hdr is the equivalent to the water market selling bottled water because its "better".

[flyry]

Originally Posted by veritas

I would say hdr is more of a gimmick then 3d. I mean 4k and hdr are supposed to make your movie look "better" by changing the color and putting 2k intermediates on 4k discs. more then 90% of people wont see a difference between 4k and 2k at normal viewing distances and changing old films is normally considered a bad thing.

4k and hdr are basically being sold to people as a placebo effect by saying it looks better then blu ray when it in most cases it doesn't offer any significant improvements. If that isn't a gimmick I don't know what is. 4k and hdr is the equivalent to the water market selling bottled water because its "better".

Please stop this generalization. I read a lot of this BS in the 3d vs 4K thread the other day.

Not every movie on 4K disc has a 2k DI.

And if you believe the latter bolded, then I question whether you do own 4k and a proper television

[veritas]

Originally Posted by flyry

Please stop this generalization. I read a lot of this BS in the 3d vs 4K thread the other day.

Not every movie on 4K disc has a 2k DI.

And if you believe the latter bolded, then I question whether you do own 4k and a proper television

what percent of 4k movies have a 2k DI? It has to be over 50% which is why I said most don't offer any significant improvements.

I also mentioned at normal viewing distances and tv sizes we are talking about how a 4k film looks from 10 feet away on around a 44.7 inch screen (since that Americas average tv size in 2017). If you can tell any 4k blu ray from 2k blu ray at 10 feet away on a 42 inch screen good for you but i doubt many could.

I am simply saying 4k hdr and 3d are both gimmicks at best since neither has a shot at mainstream adoption ( though I feel 3d had more of a chance since 3ds drawbacks are laughable)

you stereotyped 3d the same way I stereotyped 4k their are plenty of good 3d films that people talk about besides avatar or gravity. I could probably give you a longer list of good 3d then the list you could give me for good 4k.

[larrs]

Originally Posted by flyry

Please stop this generalization. I read a lot of this BS in the 3d vs 4K thread the other day.

Not every movie on 4K disc has a 2k DI.

And if you believe the latter bolded, then I question whether you do own 4k and a proper television

I do own a couple of proper 4K TVs with HDR and I can tell you that NO ONE could come over to my house, watch even a "decent" 2D Blu-Ray that I told them it was 4K and say "no, that's not 4K".

That said, I'm a UHD fan (mostly because of the immersive sound) but IMHO, it is really picking nits (get it) to tell the difference on all but a huge, professional screen in a theater.

[flyry]

Originally Posted by veritas

what percent of 4k movies have a 2k DI? It has to be over 50% which is why I said most don't offer any significant improvements.

I also mentioned at normal viewing distances and tv sizes we are talking about how a 4k film looks from 10 feet away on around a 44.7 inch screen (since that Americas average tv size in 2017). If you can tell any 4k blu ray from 2k blu ray at 10 feet away on a 42 inch screen good for you but i doubt many could.

I am simply saying 4k hdr and 3d are both gimmicks at best since neither has a shot at mainstream adoption ( though I feel 3d had more of a chance since 3ds drawbacks are laughable)

you stereotyped 3d the same way I stereotyped 4k their are plenty of good 3d films that people talk about besides avatar or gravity. I could probably give you a longer list of good 3d then the list you could give me for good 4k.

I don't care what the average TV size is. These seem like tactics by people who haven't seen HDR with their own eyes.

Most premium 4k sets are 55 inches minimum. (not to mention the 65 inch and 75 inch options)

And what excites me most for 4K is movies shot on film, which will definitely be true 4k. Even if some of the newer movies are 2k DI's there's definitely examples of those still being leaps and bounds above the bluray (baby driver being the most recent example from what I've heard). I don't know the %'s but 4K DI's are becoming more common judging by the stuff Pieter posts in the 4k forum.

and I chortled at the last thing you said. You want to compare great releases for a format that's been around for 7 years to one that just launched last year.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by flyry

I don't care what the average TV size is. These seem like tactics by people who haven't seen HDR with their own eyes.

Most premium 4k sets are 55 inches minimum. (not to mention the 65 inch and 75 inch options)

And what excites me most for 4K is movies shot on film, which will definitely be true 4k. Even if some of the newer movies are 2k DI's there's definitely examples of those still being leaps and bounds above the bluray (baby driver being the most recent example from what I've heard). I don't know the %'s but 4K DI's are becoming more common judging by the stuff Pieter posts in the 4k forum.

and I chortled at the last thing you said. You want to compare great releases for a format that's been around for 7 years to one that just launched last year.

7 years? Try 11.

I agree about 4K being exciting (as long as interactive tv keeps away from psssive films)
I’m upgrading next year but I feel you are unfairly dismissing 3D. It’s a very valid format.

As for the 4K v 1080p thing. Of course there is a difference. It’s the same tired crap they said about Blu-ray compared to DVD. If anyone can’t tell the difference between the two, they have no right owning a home cinema. A good friend of mine owns a 4K OLED set and it blows Bluray away on the discs I saw. Bearing in mind just how much I love Blu-ray.

[alchav21]

Originally Posted by veritas

Trying movies anywhere at this point I am not sure if its a win for physical or digital. On one hand they gave away a shit ton of free stuff but on the other hand everything is glitchy with uhd stuff turning to sd and customer service is basically none existent now as the major studios basically say we are sol when we call for help.

I think this whole experience makes physical look a hell of a lot more reliable in comparison.

Originally Posted by Steedeel

We have more to worry about than that. See my above post.

Hey Steedeel it's great to have you back, I think Movies Anywhere added a big nail in the Disc Coffin. I was very skeptical of MA, but it has worked Fantastic for me. I see most of the problems are with the iTunes people, and you know I'm not an Apple guy anyway. All my Movies were HD, and they all came over that way. As for 4K you have to pay attention to the Studios, and Redeem according to Code Sheet Instructions. There is also a Spreadsheet that talks about how to Redeem, but MA works great. I think going forward Digital HD is The Future, but Disc will remain for the people that are not set up properly or have the Bandwidth for consistent Streaming.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by alchav21

Hey Steedeel it's great to have you back, I think Movies Anywhere added a big nail in the Disc Coffin. I was very skeptical of MA, but it has worked Fantastic for me. I see most of the problems are with the iTunes people, and you know I'm not an Apple guy anyway. All my Movies were HD, and they all came over that way. As for 4K you have to pay attention to the Studios, and Redeem according to Code Sheet Instructions. There is also a Spreadsheet that talks about how to Redeem, but MA works great. I think going forward Digital HD is The Future, but Disc will remain for the people that are not set up properly or have the Bandwidth for consistent Streaming.

What big nail in the coffin? I have told you before. This generation are no longer interested in owning films. We are now seeing the purists stick with disc, The casuals (mainstream) stick with subscription and Digital HD somewhere in between. It’s certainly a boost and I have no doubt Apple will be back in the mix very soon. However, it’s all about the subs. The industry knows this and they are crapping themselves. I am pretty sure by buying 4K discs next year, I’m going to be pretty secure. I listened to loads of folks who said MP3 downloads were the future and they would wipe out CD. Well, streaming is about to wipe out downloads. You have way too much confidence in Digital HD.

[flyry]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

7 years? Try 11.

I agree about 4K being exciting (as long as interactive tv keeps away from psssive films)
I’m upgrading next year but I feel you are unfairly dismissing 3D. It’s a very valid format.

As for the 4K v 1080p thing. Of course there is a difference. It’s the same tired crap they said about Blu-ray compared to DVD. If anyone can’t tell the difference between the two, they have no right owning a home cinema. A good friend of mine owns a 4K OLED set and it blows Bluray away on the discs I saw. Bearing in mind just how much I love Blu-ray.

Wiki says the first 3D Blu-ray was 2010. I'm not aware of 3D blu's launching in 2006.

[veritas]

Originally Posted by alchav21

Hey Steedeel it's great to have you back, I think Movies Anywhere added a big nail in the Disc Coffin. I was very skeptical of MA, but it has worked Fantastic for me. I see most of the problems are with the iTunes people, and you know I'm not an Apple guy anyway. All my Movies were HD, and they all came over that way. As for 4K you have to pay attention to the Studios, and Redeem according to Code Sheet Instructions. There is also a Spreadsheet that talks about how to Redeem, but MA works great. I think going forward Digital HD is The Future, but Disc will remain for the people that are not set up properly or have the Bandwidth for consistent Streaming.

I would say most of the problems I have seen are on vudus side but people like to hate on itunes. Basically people are hating on itunes because isn't upgrading their hd copies from vudu to uhd while vudu is turning uhd codes from itunes into sd

Anyway idk if you are an apple user I would say you are seeing a ton of problems on vudu and if you are a vudu user you see problems in apple. Both sides are having different bugs depending on where you redeems stuff.

Support on both sides has been rather atrocious also if you compare it to dma or even warner bros support.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by flyry

Wiki says the first 3D Blu-ray was 2010. I'm not aware of 3D blu's launching in 2006.

Oh sorry. Thought you were talking about normal Blu-ray. My fault. I was looking at the guy’s second paragraph rather than the last one when you quoted him.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by veritas

I would say most of the problems I have seen are on vudus side but people like to hate on itunes. Basically people are hating on itunes because isn't upgrading their hd copies from vudu to uhd while vudu is turning uhd codes from itunes into sd

Anyway idk if you are an apple user I would say you are seeing a ton of problems on vudu and if you are a vudu user you see problems in apple. Both sides are having different bugs depending on where you redeems stuff.

Support on both sides has been rather atrocious also if you compare it to dma or even warner bros support.

Alchave hates Apple certainly. I’m hearing 4K iTunes copies wipe the floor compared to rivals Digital wise.

[alchav21]

Originally Posted by veritas

I would say most of the problems I have seen are on vudus side but people like to hate on itunes. Basically people are hating on itunes because isn't upgrading their hd copies from vudu to uhd while vudu is turning uhd codes from itunes into sd

Anyway idk if you are an apple user I would say you are seeing a ton of problems on vudu and if you are a vudu user you see problems in apple. Both sides are having different bugs depending on where you redeems stuff.

Support on both sides has been rather atrocious also if you compare it to dma or even warner bros support.

Originally Posted by Steedeel

Alchave hates Apple certainly. I’m hearing 4K iTunes copies wipe the floor compared to rivals Digital wise.

Well since I don't have iTunes, and only UV Providers I would say the common denominator is iTunes, and that's where the problem lies. My main Providers are Amazon and Vudu, and both are working fine.