Physical & Digital EST: The Future of Home Video Discussion Thread

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by alchav21

Best Buy Section is good, but it's not what it use to be, smaller now. I was at a function the other night, and asked people about watching Movies. No one goes to the Theater anymore, and buying Discs are way down on their list. Streaming from Netflix is always the common response. Like I said, I sell on eBay and I can't sell anything for more than $5 and that includes shipping. I was at Fry's Electronics, and they still have a big Movie Section but many Blu-ray Movies for $1....How can you compete with that. Discs may be around for a while, but no one wants to pay $30+ for them even if they are 4K!

Sorry, but they don’t care about movies. Our argument is Digital v disc for people that DO care. The masses are not us and they never will be. Plus, i’m sorry but I don’t believe half these stories you guys keep churning out.

Anyway, it’s time to leave this thread again. I’m stupid enough to keep it up but I need to get away. It’s idiotic trying to defend quality when others don’t care. I will keep on buying discs for the quality and that’s never going to change. If there is a major development I will post again but for now, I can’t argue my point anymore. Steed doesn’t accept second best and I never will.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by flyry

Inflation. Everyone knows less people are going to the movies than before.

This summer was the worst in terms of tickets sold since 1992. (per Forbes, and not some pimpled faced retail geek)

From 2008 thru 2016 , inflation averaged a mere 1.75%.

From 2008 thru 2016, Box Office receipts climbed 18.14% when comparing 2008 totals to 2016 totals. The Box Office Mojo chart shows each year's percentage change compared to the previous year.


Another actual citation for those who value facts: http://www.usinflationcalculator.com...flation-rates/

[whipnet]

Originally Posted by Vilya

And 2017 still has that little Star Wars movie coming up. A few people might go see it.

Star Wars 8 won't be anything as big as 7 now that everyone knows Disney has ruined Star Wars worse than George Lucas ever did.

*

[whipnet]

Originally Posted by Vilya

From 2008 thru 2016 , inflation averaged a mere 1.75%.

From 2008 thru 2016, Box Office receipts climbed 18.14%.

Math is your friend.

Another actual citation for those who value facts over hearsay: http://www.usinflationcalculator.com...flation-rates/

http://www.latimes.com/business/holl...830-story.html

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by whipnet

http://www.latimes.com/business/holl...830-story.html

Those figures are for summer only. The Box Office Mojo figures are for the entire year.

From your link, the summer of 2016 showed about $4.5B whereas the entire year ended at $11.37B.

Your link shows the summer of 2015 being about the same: $4.5B whereas the entire year ended at $11.12B.

2016 saw a 2.2% increase in receipts. Inflation in 2016 was 2.1%, a near wash, but a tiny gain just the same.

2015 saw a 7.4% increase in receipts. Inflation in 2015 was 0.7%. A substantial gain in this period.

[whipnet]

Originally Posted by Vilya

Those figures are for summer only. The Box Office Mojo figures are for the entire year.

From your link, the summer of 2016 showed about $4.5B whereas the entire year ended at $11.37B.

Your link shows the summer of 2015 being about the same: $4.5B whereas the entire year ended at $11.12B.

LOL. Box Office numbers are estimates. Production or marketing cost do not come into play and China takes $0.75 for every $1.00 earned there.

If you want to argue that more people WORLDWIDE are seeing Hollywood films, you'd be right. But the American audience is shrinking and Hollywood isn't making money.

*

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by whipnet

LOL. Box Office numbers are estimates. Production or marketing cost do not come into play and China takes $0.75 for every $1.00 earned there.

If you want to argue that more people WORLDWIDE are seeing Hollywood films, you'd be right. But the American audience is shrinking and Hollywood isn't making money.

*

Neither your link or mine state that these numbers are "estimates." The box office totals for previous years should be accurate. If the only data we can find is just to be summarily dismissed as "estimates", then we are only left with speculation again.

These figures represent Box Office revenue year to year, not profit or loss.

The chart I cited also shows data about the number of tickets sold each year. 2016 saw a drop, but only of 0.4% whereas 2015 saw an increase of 4.1%.

1.315B tickets were sold in 2016. In 2008, 1.34B tickets were sold. The number of tickets sold has not changed dramatically. That hardly foretells the demise of the theater business.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by whipnet

Star Wars 8 won't be anything as big as 7 now that everyone knows Disney has ruined Star Wars worse than George Lucas ever did.

*

I don't have a crystal ball, but I would not underestimate the appeal of this film. It is Star Wars. Carrie Fisher's tragic death alone might draw a lot of people to see it.

[Petra_Kalbrain]

[Dynamo of Eternia]

Originally Posted by whipnet

Star Wars 8 won't be anything as big as 7 now that everyone knows Disney has ruined Star Wars worse than George Lucas ever did.

*

[whipnet]

Originally Posted by Vilya

Neither your link or mine state that these numbers are "estimates." The box office totals for previous years should be accurate. If the only data we can find is just to be summarily dismissed as "estimates", then we are only left with speculation again.

These figures represent Box Office revenue year to year, not profit or loss.

The chart I cited also shows data about the number of tickets sold each year. 2016 saw a drop, but only of 0.4% whereas 2015 saw an increase of 4.1%.

1.315B tickets were sold in 2016. In 2008, 1.34B tickets were sold. The number of tickets sold has not changed dramatically. That hardly foretells the demise of the theater business.

Thanks for all of that, but I am a simple man and this is not worth arguing.

If the L.A. Times says Hollywood is in a sheitstorm, then that's good enough for me.

Here's a few more, but hey, what do they know?

http://variety.com/2016/film/feature...fg-1201822322/

http://www.npr.org/2017/08/30/547373...ce-in-a-decade

https://www.thewrap.com/hollywood-bo...wn-12-percent/

http://www.breitbart.com/big-hollywo...-spots-remain/

https://screenrant.com/summer-2017-box-office-bombs/

From last year:

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/new...revenue-901816

https://www.vanityfair.com/hollywood...e-ticket-sales

*

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by whipnet

Thanks for all of that, but I am a simple man and this is not worth arguing.

If the L.A. Times says Hollywood is in a sheitstorm, then that's good enough for me.

Here's a few more, but hey, what do they know?

Every. single. one. of those links looks at the summer box office only. I have presented data about yearly totals. 12 months versus 3.

As for Hollywood not being profitable:

Sony posted a $440M profit.
Disney: $2.53B profit
Time Warner: $1.7B profit
21st Century Fox: $1.3B profit
Universal: $1.23B profit
Viacom: $364M loss.

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/lis...ability-977490

Belief is a choice; facts are not. And with that, I will stop.

[flyry]

Originally Posted by Vilya

From 2008 thru 2016 , inflation averaged a mere 1.75%.

From 2008 thru 2016, Box Office receipts climbed 18.14% when comparing 2008 totals to 2016 totals. The Box Office Mojo chart shows each year's percentage change compared to the previous year.


Another actual citation for those who value facts: http://www.usinflationcalculator.com...flation-rates/

Bro you are the only person on earth saying that box office is showing "growth"

Inflation/3D etc have played a part in all the box office records, but attendance has been down.

Really the overall box office numbers have been held up by a handful of movies the past few years. Tons of blockbusters have flopped this year. The model is beginning to crumble.

Why else would Hollywood be in talks to have movies same day for $50 on VOD? They see the writing on the wall too.

[randian]

Originally Posted by flyry

Why else would Hollywood be in talks to have movies same day for $50 on VOD? They see the writing on the wall too.

How much theater business is from single people? If it's the aim of the studios to put the middleman (aka theaters) out of business by offering expensive VOD deals then they're losing a bunch of single theater-goers who will never in a million years pay $50 for VOD. Heck, even couples would pay much less than $50 to see a movie.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by flyry

Bro you are the only person on earth saying that box office is showing "growth"

Inflation/3D etc have played a part in all the box office records, but attendance has been down.

Really the overall box office numbers have been held up by a handful of movies the past few years. Tons of blockbusters have flopped this year. The model is beginning to crumble.

Why else would Hollywood be in talks to have movies same day for $50 on VOD? They see the writing on the wall too.

I said I would stop!

I said Box Office revenue is showing modest growth, to be exact.

I am just showing the data I found. The number of tickets sold is only down slightly. 2016 saw a 0.4% drop; 2015 saw a 4.1% increase.

Box office revenue is up, even when adjusted for inflation. Inflation has only averaged 1.75% from 2008 to 2016. Box Office receipts are up 18.14% comparing 2016 with 2008.

Studios posted profits.

People are going to the cinema; it is not in a death spiral.

I was simply responding to the exaggerated claims of "no one goes to the movies" or "Hollywood is in trouble." The data does not support any of that.

[Dynamo of Eternia]

Originally Posted by flyry

Really the overall box office numbers have been held up by a handful of movies the past few years. Tons of blockbusters have flopped this year. The model is beginning to crumble.

That's because they keep churning out assembly line crap rather than making good movies. There are exceptions, of course, but overall people are starting to catch on to this and aren't going. People would likely go to the theaters more if these more studios made blockbuster movies that are actually good.

[veritas]

Originally Posted by Vilya

I was simply responding to the exaggerated claims of "no one goes to the movies" or "Hollywood is in trouble." The data does not support any of that.

People still go to the movies but less people do go to the movies. The only way profits stay up is the fact that ticket prices have inflated in price faster then the national average and they figured out how to price discriminate with 3d, imax, and xd. If theaters faze out 3d they will lose a large portion of revenue (because 3d lovers either wont go or will pay less per ticket) which is why it never made sense to me for studios to let 3d die.




Hollywood is in trouble in that movie returns now have a lot more volatility. If you have a franchise you can make money but a much larger percentage of original movies now flop (unless your Disney or pixar).

I mean look at this years top 10 domestic grossing films 8/10 of them are either sequels remakes or at least in some way set up with previous movies in a franchise. If you take a look back in 2000 and the 90s almost none of the highest grossing films are sequels or remakes.

Quite simply it isn't healthy for Hollywood to have this kind of distribution for box office success to box office failure. It kills creativity and eventually (I hope) people get tired of unoriginal sequels.

[Vilya]

Originally Posted by veritas

I mean look at this years top 10 domestic grossing films 8/10 of them are either sequels remakes or at least in some way set up with previous movies in a franchise. If you take a look back in 2000 and the 90s almost none of the highest grossing films are sequels or remakes.

Quite simply it isn't healthy for Hollywood to have this kind of distribution for box office success to box office failure. It kills creativity and eventually (I hope) people get tired of unoriginal sequels.

A vaccine for sequelitis is sorely needed.

[flyry]

Originally Posted by Vilya

I said I would stop!

I said Box Office revenue is showing modest growth, to be exact.

I am just showing the data I found. The number of tickets sold is only down slightly. 2016 saw a 0.4% drop; 2015 saw a 4.1% increase.

Box office revenue is up, even when adjusted for inflation. Inflation has only averaged 1.75% from 2008 to 2016. Box Office receipts are up 18.14% comparing 2016 with 2008.

Studios posted profits.

People are going to the cinema; it is not in a death spiral.

I was simply responding to the exaggerated claims of "no one goes to the movies" or "Hollywood is in trouble." The data does not support any of that.

I don't need #s to know less people are going to the movies. I can see that with the eye test. In the late 90s and early 00s my local theater had 3 concession stands running concurrently and they were all open all weekend with huge lines.

Nowadays they closed 2 of them and there's never any wait for the one open concession stand.


But speaking of numbers, they say the current teen generation just is not going to the theaters like we did back in the day. They prefer to be on social media/snapchat/youtube etc.

Hell it seems as most users on this very forum do not even go to the theaters that often. How often do you see "this is going to be a blind buy" or " i havent been to the theater in 10 years" type posts on here.

If enthusiasts like us aren't hitting the theaters, then of course casuals are fine with netflix or waiting 2.5-3 months to rent something.

Originally Posted by randian

How much theater business is from single people? If it's the aim of the studios to put the middleman (aka theaters) out of business by offering expensive VOD deals then they're losing a bunch of single theater-goers who will never in a million years pay $50 for VOD. Heck, even couples would pay much less than $50 to see a movie.

I wouldn't pay the 50 that is correct. I'm not single though I'm married, but no kids so I can still go to the theater whenever I want. Though I would gladly pay maybe $12 to rent a smaller indie or mid budget movie day and date.

I'd much rather have seen something like Detroit or Logan Lucky in the comfort of my own home rather than driving to the theater. I enjoyed watching movies like Brawl in Cell Block 99 and Shot Caller at home since they really did not get much of a theatrical run.

[irighti]

I can only comment on my two local best buy stores. One near hilton head, sc and the other in savannah, ga.

In the last month, the media section has shrunk big time. not just movies, but also cds (which was alreeady pretty small to be honest) and even video games.

Savannah being a bigger market has about two aisles (down from 8) of dvd/bluray etc. the store closest to me went from went from 3 aisles to now just having a small section on the back wall of the store behind games.

there is still a a new release structure at the front, but man it is really disheartening to see how this has turned. I love both physical and digital, so losing the easy access to drop in and pick one up is a bummer. I order plenty online, but sometimes you just get that wild hair and have to go by something right then. at least for me.

this is also happening at the 3 target locations near by. physical is not gone, but man it has shrunk down so much in the last couple of months. bummer.