Looking for Mr. Goodbar

[AnamorphicWidescreen]

For what it's worth, the LFMG novel & film were based on a very disturbing true event:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roseann_Quinn

Originally Posted by danny24

I would be ok with the some of the music being changed/modified if it means getting a Blu-ray/Digital release. So we have the opening credits, some bar scenes, and bedroom scenes, etc that all use music in the film. As long as it doesn't take to much away from the movie I would be fine with it. Of course this is all pure speculation on what is holding up a modern home video release. It could be something else entirely we have no idea of or it could be simply that Paramount has no interest in releasing it and there are no ties or hold up just Paramount being Paramount.

We can agree to disagree here. I felt the music used in LFMG was essential to the movie, and if they think it's OK to replace some of it - who knows where they'll stop?

The excellent 1977 drama "Heroes" (just released to Blu recently) replaced one key rock song for the DVD release. Kansas' iconic track "Carry on my Wayward Son" that played towards the end of the film was replaced by a generic crummy song that ruined the whole pace/tone/vibe of the scene it was played over - and AFAIC marred the entire film to a great extent. That being said, I don't know if the recent Blu release has the Kansas song restored, since I don't have this.

Originally Posted by dkelly26666

There was a 25 year hold up on Nicolas Roeg's "Bad Timing" ever seeing a home video release of any kind. Finally, Criterion released it in 2005. On that disc, Nicolas Roeg confirms that it was simply a music track used in one sequence, combined with his own stubborn refusal to alter the soundtrack, combined with the film's lack of commercial popularity, that kept it off the market. No label saw the film as being worth trying to sort that music dispute out. Finally, somehow, with the passing of time, Criterion was finally able to get everyone on the same page, and they finally released the film to DVD.

Kudos to Nic Roeg for standing his ground here. Bad Timing is a brilliant & horrific film - and the rock/pop songs on the soundtrack are very important for the scenes they're placed over. Notably, a couple of tracks by "The Who" are used here - and in at least one case only a small portion of one of their songs is used.

Again, I would rather not have seen the film at all than had some key songs removed/replaced.

[AnamorphicWidescreen]

The Wild Life is a great movie, but I've only streamed this. I think the stream had the original music, but I can't swear to this.

[danny24]

Some interesting tidbits from a few posters on the Kino Lorber thread explains why LFMGB is on the shelf:

Originally Posted by GetHarryPalmer View Post
Little Darlings, W.W. and the Dixie Dancekings, Superfly T.N.T., Bugsy Malone, Play it as it Lays, Sunburn, The Glass Web, Goodbye Again, 3 Ring Circus, War Party and few hundred more films are in need of music clearance. A few including Looking for Mr. Goodbar are 6 figures.

Originally Posted by bsend View Post
What music in Mr. Goodbar needs to be cleared?
Soundtrack Credits
Try Me, I Know We Can Make It
(1976)
Written by Donna Summer (uncredited), Giorgio Moroder (uncredited), Pete Bellotte (uncredited)
Performed by Donna Summer
Courtesy of Casablanca Record & FilmWorks
Prelude to Love
(1976)
Written by Donna Summer (uncredited), Giorgio Moroder (uncredited), Pete Bellotte (uncredited)
Performed by Donna Summer
Courtesy of Casablanca Record & FilmWorks
Could It Be Magic
(1976)
( Barry Manilow and Adrienne Anderson)
Performed by Donna Summer
Courtesy of Casablanca Record & FilmWorks
Machine Gun
(1972)
Written by Milan Williams (uncredited)
Performed by The Commodores
Courtesy of Motown Records
Don't Leave Me This Way
(1975)
Written by Kenny Gamble (uncredited), Leon Huff (uncredited), Cary Gilbert (uncredited)
Performed by Thelma Houston
Courtesy of Motown Records
Love Hangover
(1975)
Written by Marilyn McLeod (uncredited), Pamela Sawyer (uncredited)
Performed by Diana Ross
Courtesy of Motown Records
Back Stabbers
(1972)
Written by Leon Huff (uncredited), Gene McFadden (uncredited), John Whitehead (uncredited)
Performed by The O'Jays
Courtesy of CBS Records
Lowdown
(1976)
Written by Boz Scaggs (uncredited), David Paich (uncredited)
Performed by Boz Scaggs
Courtesy of CBS Records
She's Lonely
Performed by Bill Withers
Courtesy of CBS Records
Don't Ask to Stay Until Tomorrow
(1978)
Music by Artie Kane
Lyrics by Carol Connors
Vocals by Marlena Shaw
She Wants To
Performed by Bill Withers
Courtesy of CBS Records

So $60,000 to clear the music rights for Looking For Mr. Goodbar. Not worth it for most studios and that explains why it's sitting on the shelf sadly. I am hoping Paramount licenses out LFMGB and some studio can pay off the music rights and it will get a Digital and modern Physical release. If not Paramount is going to have to pay that to get it out. This really though does explain alot of things and why it's on the shelf. Paramount doesn't stand to profit at all by releasing it on home video and digital unless they rerelease it into theaters as an anniversary edition of some kind with a 4K remaster, pay the music rights off and set a home video and digital release. Unlikely to happen. I do hope this sees release one day and it overcomes it's financial strap it has on it currently.

So we know they can rerelease it theatrically and air it on cable but potentially $60,000 to release it on digital and home video for music clearence.

An HD master does exist it was aired on cable. Hoping this gets resolved one day.

[slimdude]

$60.000 is practically nothing to pay for music copyrights compared to other artists. Since Donna Summer is now deceased ( who I miss dearly), I don't know who owns the copyrights to her music. Probably her surviving heirs.

[danny24]

Originally Posted by slimdude

$60.000 is practically nothing to pay for music copyrights compared to other artists. Since Donna Summer is now deceased ( who I miss dearly), I don't know who owns the copyrights to her music. Probably her surviving heirs.

Yes but for the studio to release it on modern home video, Digital and Physical, that will be the price to pay to make it happen. For an older catalogue title they would be lucky to make that back. That is most likely how they see it and why it's been on the shelf.

I like the idea of a theatrical rerelease of some kind for Paramount to garner hype and they can than use the profits to release it on modern home video and pay off the music rights. Maybe in 2022 they can do a 45th anniversary limited rerelease in theaters from a new 4K scan.

Most likely though our best hope is Criterion getting this from Paramount and paying the music rights off.

This remains one of my favorite Diane Keaton movies, her performance was amazing in this.

[slimdude]

Originally Posted by danny24

Yes but for the studio to release it on modern home video, Digital and Physical, that will be the price to pay to make it happen. For an older catalogue title they would be lucky to make that back. That is most likely how they see it and why it's been on the shelf.

I like the idea of a theatrical rerelease of some kind for Paramount to garner hype and they can than use the profits to release it on modern home video and pay off the music rights. Maybe in 2022 they can do a 45th anniversary limited rerelease in theaters from a new 4K scan.

Most likely though our best hope is Criterion getting this from Paramount and paying the music rights off.

This remains one of my favorite Diane Keaton movies, her performance was amazing in this.

Looking For Mr. Goodbar is a very good movie. Paramount and other movie studios have wasted millions and billions of dollars on theatrical movies that bombed drastically at the box office, and paying $60.000 for music copyrights is like $6.00 to them. If they release Looking For Mr. Goodbar on DVD or even Blu-ray, it will be a hot seller because, there are a lot of people who've been waiting for centuries for the movie to be released on the DVD, and Paramount will recoup the $60.000 spent and more.

[danny24]

Originally Posted by slimdude

Looking For Mr. Goodbar is a very good movie. Paramount and other movie studios have wasted millions and billions of dollars on theatrical movies that bombed drastically at the box office, and paying $60.000 for music copyrights is like $6.00 to them. If they release Looking For Mr. Goodbar on DVD or even Blu-ray, it will be a hot seller because, there are a lot of people who've been waiting for centuries for the movie to be released on the DVD, and Paramount will recoup the $60.000 spent and more.

I agree so than do we have another case of Paramount just sitting on a catalogue title and doing nothing with it despite what they may have to pay for music clearances to release Digital/DVD/BD/UHD.

I really like that 45th anniversary theatrical rerelease idea in 2022 for Paramount.

[AnamorphicWidescreen]

Originally Posted by danny24

Not worth it for most studios and that explains why it's sitting on the shelf sadly. I am hoping Paramount licenses out LFMGB and some studio can pay off the music rights and it will get a Digital and modern Physical release. If not Paramount is going to have to pay that to get it out. This really though does explain alot of things and why it's on the shelf. Paramount doesn't stand to profit at all by releasing it on home video and digital unless they rerelease it into theaters as an anniversary edition of some kind with a 4K remaster, pay the music rights off and set a home video and digital release. Unlikely to happen. I do hope this sees release one day and it overcomes it's financial strap it has on it currently.

No surprises here. We all knew that music rights were undoubtedly holding up this LFMG release. Replacing the existing music in the film with other songs that they don't have to pay a large amount of $ for would modify the entire tone/vibe of the movie. So, unless/until they get the music rights straightened out, it doesn't look like we'll be seeing this film on physical media.

[danny24]

Originally Posted by ForumUser

Not to be pedantic and detract from the interesting bit of information but I am curious about something. There is the mention of a six figure sum required for music licensing and then there is a mention of $60,000.

I was under the impression a six figure sum had a minimum value of $100,000.

Looks like your correct. It can range from anywhere between $100,000 to $999,999.

So yeah $60,000 probably isn't the correct amount Paramount would have to pay for music clearances. It's likely more or close to it.

Originally Posted by AnamorphicWidescreen

No surprises here. We all knew that music rights were undoubtedly holding up this LFMG release. Replacing the existing music in the film with other songs that they don't have to pay a large amount of $ for would modify the entire tone/vibe of the movie. So, unless/until they get the music rights straightened out, it doesn't look like we'll be seeing this film on physical media.

I got corrected for the 6 figure quote from the Kino Lorber thread. LFMGB could be even close to $1,000,000 to clear the music rights.
$60,000 sounds pretty cheap now in hindsight.

[danny24]

Originally Posted by ForumUser

Based on that, I wonder if some sort of Kickstarter campaign is feasible or let alone seen to be “acceptable” to be used by a major Hollywood studio.

If it had been another title, I would certainly balk at the idea. But in this instance I would be willing to contribute some amount.

I would contribute to but only Paramount for now has the power to do that and only they know what is needed most likely to get the film out on Digital and modern Physical media and clear the music rights. I have no idea if they would have any interest in a kickstarter campaign but since LFMGB is a Paramount property only they can get it started.

Our best bet is Paramount sells the distibution rights to a boutique label and they get it started.

We know they have an HD master of the film, it has been aired in HD on cable.

Since it has been absent on Digital, DVD, BD clearing the music rights must be quite alot for a major movie studio to shy away from releasing it.

[Aunt Peg]

I've never contributed to a kick start for any film but this would be an exception and my contribution would be very generous.

[Blackcauldron]

I remember reading somewhere that the artist in question (who has since refused for her work to be shown and released in the movie) is Thelma Houston, who sang "Don't Leave Me this Way."

[slimdude]

Originally Posted by Blackcauldron

I remember reading somewhere that the artist in question (who has since refused for her work to be shown and released in the movie) is Thelma Houston, who sang "Don't Leave Me this Way."

If Thelma Houston didn't write the music or the lyrics (and she didn't) she doesn't have the authority to restrict or deny anyone the copyrights of using it. Don't Leave Me This Way was composed by Kenny Gamble and Leon Huff, the owners of the former Philadelphia International Record Company, better known as the Philly Sound. Don't Leave Me This Way was originally recorded by: Harold Melvin and the Blue Notes. If anybody own the copyrights to the song it would be Kenny Gamble and Leon Huff, not Thelma Houston. She had to buy the rights to the song herself so she could record it.

[danny24]

I doubt it's one song holding up a DVD/Blu-ray release. If that was the case it would be easy to just edit it out. It has to be more than one song holding up a release. This is a great film hoping any music rights issues get resolved. This did get a Laserdisc and VHS release and apparently a Spain DVD is out (not sure if legit).

[cupboy]

It also came out on Beta Hi-Fi on TDK tape. Should have snagged it when I had the chance. The LD is a piece of garbage. I still have that.

[slimdude]

Originally Posted by cupboy

It also came out on Beta Hi-Fi on TDK tape. Should have snagged it when I had the chance. The LD is a piece of garbage. I still have that.

Beta? You have gone way back.

[AnamorphicWidescreen]

Recently re-watched LFMG again. Still a crummy print, but better than nothing - LOL.

Like many great films, each re-watch makes me appreciate the movie even more. Some comments:

-The opening photo montage, quick cuts, and the snippets of different rock/pop songs was extremely well-edited.

- For the first time, I noticed a Janis Joplin poster on Keaton's apartment well - very cool, and really defined the late '70's era to a great extent. I.e., a lot of '60's rock music continued to be popular in the '70's (and is still popular).

-At one point early in the film, Keaton is seen buying a vinyl record - nice.

-Interesting dichotomy between the seemingly conservative, selfless, and kind/caring teacher of deaf children during the day, and the bar hopping, promiscuous drug addict at night.

-The idea that Keaton was rebelling against her parents & her traditional upbringing by screwing around with various guys was emphasized even more when she was definitely not interested in the one conservative, "square" guy that her parents liked (Bill Atherton). He was exactly the type of guy that her parents would have wanted her to settle down with & have a family with, and that's why she wasn't into him. The scene when she tried to "seduce" him (to bring him down to her level, probably) was meant to humiliate him to a certain extent, as were the other jabs/barbs at him. It was interesting to see how she was such an a-hole to him, when she was a completely different, kind, and patient person when dealing with her students.

-Keaton's sister (played by Tuesday Weld) was an interesting character; she was rebelling against her parents/conservative upbringing to a great extent as well.

-The scene at the very end of the film

[Show spoiler]where the Keaton character was viciously murdered was harrowing & stomach-turning, even by today's standards - the flashing lights, blood, etc. were quite grotesque - which was the whole point. It was a good idea to have the film end on that note, and not have any kind of epilogue, etc. - it made this last scene all the more powerful.

[Aunt Peg]

I just watched this for the first time in over 30 years. I'd seen numerous times from about 1980 to 1985.

One of my favourites and it still holds up. Shame they can't untie the music rights issues. There is so much music in the film - I'd forgotten just how much.

If a was a billionaire I'd honestly pay the people who are holding out to try and win them over. It can't just be money - perhaps some people that hold rights to some of the film find the film offensive. Whilst I don't hold these views myself some do view the film as a 'punishment for a promiscuous woman', some find the ending way too brutal (it is but it needs to be) and then there is the 'gay angle' which if you have seen the film you'll understand what I mean. Just as Cruising outraged sections of the gay community, Looking for Mr. Goodbar also had its detractors from the gay community though not as vocal but for different reasons. Some female friends of mine from years ago hated the film - violence against women was their objection but the film never stumbles into exploitation.

The film is still certainly very strong stuff but it is one of the seminal films of the 1970s, with an excellent ensemble and the real sticking point - a soundtrack to due for.

[Thebackseat]

I just ordered this today.
https://www.deepdiscount.com/looking.../9317486003946

I already have the DUTCH dvd (pressed disk) from this company and it is "as good as it gets" quality for a DVD.
If this is the same quality I will be happy. Of course a Blu would be ideal, but they may never happen.
For $11.34, i'll take the risk.

[cupboy]

I'm sure it will look better than the lousy laserdisc but it probably won't sound anywhere near as good.