Lossless Audio: Which takes the cake ?

[crackinhedz]

Originally Posted by blitz6speed

TrueHD having Dialnorm on as default is invalid.

"Dialogue Normalization: Friend or Foe"

a very informative read.

[Sir Terrence]

If it is all in the mix, and each codec is bit for bit to the master, then whether it is in Dts MA lossless or Dolby TrueHD should matter all that much should it?

Both of these codecs(at least these days) are audio carriers that should not alter the way the audio mix sounds. If you are finding differences amoung the lossless audio codecs, then there is something the matter with the way your equipment is handling the data within the audio chain, or it is a remix. If the encoder/decoders of both codecs are working correctly, or do not have some strange offset values(like dialog norm defaulting to on) there should be no difference between the lossless codecs, its just becomes a matter of efficiency, and nothing else.

Personally, I prefer PCM because of its simplicity. No lossless compression, which means no decompression. No complex mathmatical computation algorythms, just a straight shot from the master to the disc.

[Sir Terrence]

Originally Posted by crackinhedz

"Dialogue Normalization: Friend or Foe"

a very informative read.

Unfortunately we don't need dialog norm for any disc based media, because we tend to adjust audio as needed per disc. This feature works best in HDTV where channel surfing can produce many different dynamic ranges from many different program sources. We just do not see that with disc based media. Its wasted metadata in this case.

[blitz6speed]

Down with DOPE, Up with HOPE! DIE DIALNORM, DIE!

[crackinhedz]

Originally Posted by Sir Terrence

Its wasted metadata in this case.

absolutely agree with that.

[Sir Terrence]

Originally Posted by blitz6speed

Down with DOPE, Up with HOPE! DIE DIALNORM, DIE!

Crack is wack, and dat's a fact, DIE DIALNORM DIE!

[Woody]

Originally Posted by PeterTHX

Classic as in incorrect?

You can turn off DRC.

You can't turn off EE.

No, classic as in that it is exactly correct in that neither belong.

Give me the soundtrack as-is thanks , unless of course you are making it 7.1 instead of 5.1.

Well I guess we all can make that phrase fit how we like, hey Peter?

[SDon1969]

Originally Posted by crackinhedz

DRC for the PS3 applies to Dolby audio that is output in LPCM.

DRC basically levels the audio frequencies, so if you want to watch a movie late at night, the bass won't keep the neighbors up and you can hear the dialogue at lower volume levels. This is probably the reason why some people think TrueHD sounds "flat".

If your PS3 DRC is set to "automatic" or "on"...(LPCM) TrueHD will sound flat.

Turn it OFF.

Mine was set on automatic. I always thought quietly to myself that maybe Transformers lacked just a little "oomph" in the audio department. I checked my DRC setting on the ole PS3 - automatic. Now I think Transformers sounds about as I expected it to and that oomph is there. Surely it isn't my imagination, I just watched it recently. Thanks, man.

[PeterTHX]

Originally Posted by Woody

No, classic as in that it is exactly correct in that neither belong.

Incorrect. Many setups require DRC. BD is multimedia, meaning not just home theater, but in portables, PCs, laptops, and many other situations where wide dynamic range is not only impractical but can actually damage equipment.

Give me the soundtrack as-is thanks , unless of course you are making it 7.1 instead of 5.1.

Leave the soundtrack as it was originally, NO MORE FAKE 7.1 SOUND!

[saprano]

Originally Posted by blitz6speed

Down with DOPE, Up with HOPE! DIE DIALNORM, DIE!

Originally Posted by Sir Terrence

Crack is wack, and dat's a fact, DIE DIALNORM DIE!

I thought i'd continue the song

I like my movies loud,not turned down, DIE DIALNORM DIE!

[PeterTHX]

I like my movies loud,not turned down

If you're too lazy to turn it up a notch...

You also have to realize films are mastered at different levels. "One volume fits all" just doesn't work.

You also have to realize a LOT of people are still listening thru their TVs and such. BD is aimed at the masses.

[Woody]

Originally Posted by PeterTHX

Incorrect. Many setups require DRC. BD is multimedia, meaning not just home theater, but in portables, PCs, laptops, and many other situations where wide dynamic range is not only impractical but can actually damage equipment.



Leave the soundtrack as it was originally, NO MORE FAKE 7.1 SOUND!

Unless of course someone needs to use DRC right? Then it is ok to "alter" the track no?

[PeterTHX]

Originally Posted by Woody

Unless of course someone needs to use DRC right? Then it is ok to "alter" the track no?

At least they have the option. You can turn it on or off. If I want to apply PLIIx to turn 5.1 to 7.1 then I can if I want to.

Just like EE, if they don't use it you have the option of turning up the sharpness control on my set if I choose.

[ClaytonMG]

Originally Posted by PeterTHX

At least they have the option. You can turn it on or off. If I want to apply PLIIx to turn 5.1 to 7.1 then I can if I want to.

Just like EE, if they don't use it you have the option of turning up the sharpness control on my set if I choose.

I have to agree with you 1000%. And one thing that I don't think people realize with these "7.1" tracks is that the extra channels end up getting locked in the side channels when not actually using discrete 7.1. So what that means is that you no longer have the option to use PLIIx to take advantage of 7.1 if you want. I figure these films are meant for 5.1. Not many people are even taking advantage of 5.1 EX/ES even in theaters, so why are so many people obsessed with 7.1? I'd much, MUCH rather hear a track the way it was intended.

Some are trying the argument "well how do you know it's not meant for 7.1? Maybe they want 7.1 but don't have the option due to theater limitations." Well if that were true, why aren't they using Surround EX and Extended Surround? Those things are readily available and they're hardly used. And if they're not using that, why do you think they might have had the intention of using 7.1? Think about it...

[ALLIANCE68]

Originally Posted by Sir Terrence

If it is all in the mix, and each codec is bit for bit to the master, then whether it is in Dts MA lossless or Dolby TrueHD should matter all that much should it?

Both of these codecs(at least these days) are audio carriers that should not alter the way the audio mix sounds. If you are finding differences amoung the lossless audio codecs, then there is something the matter with the way your equipment is handling the data within the audio chain, or it is a remix. If the encoder/decoders of both codecs are working correctly, or do not have some strange offset values(like dialog norm defaulting to on) there should be no difference between the lossless codecs, its just becomes a matter of efficiency, and nothing else.

Personally, I prefer PCM because of its simplicity. No lossless compression, which means no decompression. No complex mathmatical computation algorythms, just a straight shot from the master to the disc.

Your statment is true but it should be Dynamic Range Control. Not Dialog norm.

[Woody]

Originally Posted by PeterTHX

At least they have the option. You can turn it on or off. If I want to apply PLIIx to turn 5.1 to 7.1 then I can if I want to.

Just like EE, if they don't use it you have the option of turning up the sharpness control on my set if I choose.

Ughhhhh, nevermind.

[cravnsn]

I’ve never thought of it as flat, just more homogonous & organic sounding

i.e. more realistic.

[DaMexiRican]

I haven't got transformers yet. I did have DRC on automatic until after checking this thread out. Glad I did. I got a few blu's that have Dolby True HD. Gonna check it out again

[ALLIANCE68]

Originally Posted by MiguelitoDaMexiRican

I haven't got transformers yet. I did have DRC on automatic until after checking this thread out. Glad I did. I got a few blu's that have Dolby True HD. Gonna check it out again

Try this if you have it.

Try this it should convince you. Play Spidey3 play the PCM Track (Crane scene). Now play the TRUHD Track same scene. TRUHD sounds soft; now while it is playing, hit the Triangle button go to A/V settings enter and scroll down to DRC and turn it off. It should now sound exactly the same as the PCM Track.

DRC only works on ALL DOLBY CODECS

[radagast]

Originally Posted by mrhonda2

The title says it all. Beating a dead horse, maybe Highs are meant to sound high and yes lows are meant to sound low. Dolby definately sounds midrange straight across the board. It has been confirmed with Transformers, The Nightmare Before Christmas and others that I would expect nothing but the best sound. Dolby Vs DTS:On paper, the same result. In reality, sorry. How many other things in this world are equal on paper? It is how it is mixed some say. Are all of the Dolby movies mixed poorly? Can't think of even one that stands out..not one.

My how things have changed. Audio engineers used to use the term "flat" to mean perfect frequency response.