Dark Force Entertainment Discussion Thread

[miribeau]

Originally Posted by whedon

.... Generally, the versions of VS releases available on Amazon or other are edited, pan and scan, VHS quality versions that are almost unwatchable.

Both Arrow and VS have gone out of their way to offer restored, HD digital versions of a number of their films via the Amazon digital platform. The ones they have licensed from other companies, to restore and release on blu-ray/dvd only, to which they have no digital rights, are often VHS/rip-quality/full-SD, depending on the source and digital-distributing label, but Arrow and VS are both top notch when it comes to their individual digital content, under their respective labels. Actually, they have some of the best digital content out there. So does Bill, although he does charge more than VS. I check on their releases and buy the new ones as they come up. With very few exceptions, where VS or Arrow gives only the SD version for purchase, they put up a great HD transfer for sale. David only has the one title so far, at a great price, same as VS actually. I'm hoping in a few years, when the blu-rays are starting to dwindle in supply, he'll throw up the transfers for his OOPs and slumping-sales titles, wherever he has the digital rights, and then continue putting them up, as they go out of print or stop selling well. Movies are a wonderful thing in the kitchen. Blu-rays have no place there.

[whedon]

Originally Posted by indravayu

Go ahead and ask the labels how offering limited edition slip case versions is affecting sales - I think you will be quite surprised.

Vinegar Syndrome (and Severin and Arrow) releases have been popping up on Shudder. I think these labels knows where the market is heading. Not all VS releases on Amazon Prime Video are low quality - I have watched a bunch that were at bare minimum DVD quality (if not better).

I'm not saying it's not resulting in some sales but to most slips are a nice bonus and not much else. Nobody beyond a tiny group of slip fanatics and scalpers are buying releases because it's a slip. I think that if VS removed slips tomorrow their releases would still sell. People buying Night Beast are buying it for the film, not the slip it comes with.

As for streaming, there's a handful of things from VS and others available on the various platforms but the main avenue to find niche genre cinema is still DVD and Blu.

[miribeau]

Originally Posted by whedon

I'm not saying it's not resulting in some sales but to most slips are a nice bonus and not much else. Nobody beyond a tiny group of slip fanatics and scalpers are buying releases because it's a slip....

Close, but not quite. Think of it this way.... Very few are buying the release because of the slip, as you have stated. However, a lot of people run in and pay a few dollars more and buy very quickly in the run because the release has a slip. That translates not only into more profit, at 25 instead of 17 or 18, but faster profit that can be poured back into restoring more films. Factor in how many who don't want a slip just buy from Amazon, using VS as an example, then VS takes in an even lower profit, as Amazon keeps more. Slips not only facilitate additional sales, more money and faster sales, they encourage buying direct for the best price and best-quality/least-damaged slip, which means even more money for our favourite labels.

[DaveyJoe]

Slipcovers get me to order movies on release day, instead of on sale a year later. That's a pretty big incentive for the indie labels.

[whedon]

Originally Posted by DaveyJoe

Slipcovers get me to order movies on release day, instead of on sale a year later. That's a pretty big incentive for the indie labels.

The question here is, if there was no slipover at all would you still buy the release? To me a slipover is an added incentive to purchase a title, not a reason to purchase an item. I'd still purchase VS releases if they announced tomorrow that slipcovers were no more.

[deltatauhobbit]

Originally Posted by whedon

The question here is, if there was no slipover at all would you still buy the release? To me a slipover is an added incentive to purchase a title, not a reason to purchase an item. I'd still purchase VS releases if they announced tomorrow that slipcovers were no more.

Many VS releases eventually get a slipcover-less release, at a far cheaper price during their half off sales. The slipcover versions rarely make it to the half off price, so that tells me that either people want those films right away and are willing to pay more than twice the price they can get it later on, or people want those collectable slipcovers, or maybe it's a bit of both for some people.

I suppose I'm more in the camp of getting the slipcover if it looks cool, otherwise, I'm content to wait until the regular version comes out and is on sale, since I rarely pre-order films or buy the first week of release otherwise. So if there was no slipcover on VS releases, then I'm definitely waiting until a sale hits (unless it's still a limited release).

[dawnofthediscs]

Demon on Facebook regarding Zombie Nightmare’s “OOP” status...

“Yes Code Red put it out very early on. Long sold out and we picked up the rights. Lot of people still asking for it and will make great addition to collector's series.”

https://roninflix.com/products/zombie-nightmare

Dude is also going out of his way to delete the link in the comment section where people can buy the disc. I won’t be surprised if this film just got a new slip AKA 3-D COLLECTORS BOX and reused the old scan. And they’ll also probably will not be upfront about that fact. ZN is no Just Before Dawn.

[BIGXWHIFF]

Originally Posted by dawnofthediscs

Demon on Facebook regarding Zombie Nightmare’s “OOP” status...

“Yes Code Red put it out very early on. Long sold out and we picked up the rights. Lot of people still asking for it and will make great addition to collector's series.”

https://roninflix.com/products/zombie-nightmare

Dude is also going out of his way to delete the link where people can buy the disc. I won’t be surprised when they try to release this film with a slip without a new scan. And they’ll also probably not be upfront about it. ZN is no Just Before Dawn.

This is why I will not buy from him. I don't care what he releases, I refuse to support his shady business practices.

[miribeau]

Originally Posted by dawnofthediscs

Demon on Facebook regarding Zombie Nightmare’s “OOP” status...

“Yes Code Red put it out very early on. Long sold out and we picked up the rights. Lot of people still asking for it and will make great addition to collector's series.”

https://roninflix.com/products/zombie-nightmare

Dude is also going out of his way to delete the link where people can buy the disc. I won’t be surprised when they try to release this film with a slip without a new scan. And they’ll also probably not be upfront about it. ZN is no Just Before Dawn.

Originally Posted by BIGXWHIFF

This is why I will not buy from him. I don't care what he releases, I refuse to support his shady business practices.

I don't understand. How is he removing the Ronin links? I can find Ronin easily, along with all items they sell, via search engines and within their website. One of you claimed he is removing the links, which doesn't appear to be the case, while the other said this is a shady business practice. Again, the links are all still functioning. What do you guys think he did to the Ronin links?

[painiac]

Originally Posted by Dark Force

Is Paniac some kind of legend around here? I'm not familiar.

i am a blu-ray samurai

[rdodolak]

Originally Posted by painiac

i am a blu-ray samurai

painiac-dono, that you are.

[rdodolak]

Originally Posted by miribeau

I don't understand. How is he removing the Ronin links? I can find Ronin easily, along with all items they sell, via search engines and within their website. One of you claimed he is removing the links, which doesn't appear to be the case, while the other said this is a shady business practice. Again, the links are all still functioning. What do you guys think he did to the Ronin links?

I think they mean that Dave is removing FB posts w/ links to RoninFlix posted to the Dark Force FB page.

[dawnofthediscs]

Originally Posted by rdodolak

I think they mean that Dave is removing FB posts w/ links to RoninFlix posted to the Dark Force FB page.

Correct

[miribeau]

Originally Posted by rdodolak

I think they mean that Dave is removing FB posts w/ links to RoninFlix posted to the Dark Force FB page.

Thanks for clarifying their issue. But, I have to ask, do people really consider it shady to remove advertising for another vendor from your own facebook page? I've never advertised, in addition to my own work, for any companies with whom I wasn't working directly. I hardly call that shady. Next think you know, people will be claiming he should be linking to the VS monthly pre-order bundle, every time it comes up, unless he wants people to think he's a shady businessman. As I'm sure you know, he has every right to try to make money off of his own release. He's not making anything if Bill sells a copy via Ronin. This all seems rather petty to me. If people want to criticize, that's fine, just pick something real and deserving.

[dawnofthediscs]

Uh oh, it’s mad....

[BIGXWHIFF]

Originally Posted by miribeau

Thanks for clarifying their issue. But, I have to ask, do people really consider it shady to remove advertising for another vendor from your own facebook page? I've never advertised, in addition to my own work, for any companies with whom I wasn't working directly. I hardly call that shady. Next think you know, people will be claiming he should be linking to the VS monthly pre-order bundle, every time it comes up, unless he wants people to think he's a shady businessman. As I'm sure you know, he has every right to try to make money off of his own release. He's not making anything if Bill sells a copy via Ronin. This all seems rather petty to me. If people want to criticize, that's fine, just pick something real and deserving.

To claim something as long sold out when it isnt and not being clear that it's simply another pressing with a slip added is extremely shady.

[Fiocca_Cola]

Originally Posted by Frightener22

"This one will likely look super cool when it GLOWS IN THE DARK!
darkforcesuperstore.com"

I also found Glow in the dark really cool when I was five years old

[dawnofthediscs]

I think transparency is very important. Maybe that’s just me though.

[miribeau]

Originally Posted by BIGXWHIFF

To claim something as long sold out when it isnt and not being clear that it's simply another pressing with a slip added is extremely shady.

David often forgets to check all of Bill's vendors before stating something is "sold out". He remembers that Bill labeled it an OOP title, when working out a deal to sell a small batch, and, once Bill has said, "I can't send you more", he assumes it is sold out everywhere. That isn't shady. It's normal human behaviour, especially for a middle-aged businessman with other things on his mind. Certainly, I understand the desire for better, and we can all ask that he remember to check Ronin, Screen Archives and Diabolik, before claiming a title is sold out, or just do what I would do and say "probably sold out, who knows where all Bill sent this thing", but he isn't lying to say it is sold out, if he thinks it is. I thought it was sold out a while ago and didn't care.

As to the new pressing, has he confirmed that he won't be doing any additional restoration? Has he confirmed an identical encode? I have to say, that doesn't sound like David. Right after making the announcement, he gauges interest and then decides what he wants to do. Chances are, he is in that stage and, if that's the case, now is the time to plead your case for what changes you would like him to make, not attack him with criticism he has not yet earned and may well not earn.

Sometimes the people here seem to forget that David DeFalco is a human being, just like everyone else. He makes mistakes, says the wrong thing, screws up, and then tries to do better, usually succeeding. If you treat him like one, you may find yourself pleasantly surprised by how he responds. And now, I am going to bed, because I am old and tired and my Mill of the Stone Women Blu is a calling.

[dawnofthediscs]

Being ignorant to the facts is just as bad as being shady when you’re interacting with your customer base. It’s also not the first time this has happened