Star Wars Wars the UOT Strikes Back and OTHER PEZ dispensers

[IndyMLVC]

Originally Posted by bboisvert

^

Not to mention that both Star Wars and The Empire Strikes Back have been included in the Library of Congress' National Film Registry for being “culturally, historically or aesthetically significant films”.

The damn US government has archival prints of these.

No one knows what condition they are in. Some of the good lads over at OT.com are going to take a look at it.

[PeterTHX]

Originally Posted by bboisvert

^

Not to mention that both Star Wars and The Empire Strikes Back have been included in the Library of Congress' National Film Registry for being “culturally, historically or aesthetically significant films”.

The damn US government has archival prints of these.

You don't do video transfers off of prints. Not good ones anyway, certainly not DVDs or Blu-rays.

[nmycon]

Originally Posted by PeterTHX

You don't do video transfers off of prints. Not good ones anyway, certainly not DVDs or Blu-rays.

Reels of film that have been mass produced are sometimes called prints, because that's basically what you're doing

exposing the original negatives (or reproduction copies) onto another roll of film, producing normal colour negatives. Very similar to how you would process a print on photographic paper...

Anyways, I wonder if the Library of Congress actually stores these movies on their original medium or if they have the film transferred and stored digitally.

[Lyle_JP]

Originally Posted by PeterTHX

You don't do video transfers off of prints. Not good ones anyway, certainly not DVDs or Blu-rays.

Well, you try not to, anyway. With some much older films, better sources simply aren't available.

As far as this applies to Star Wars, do we know if the Library of Congress has a used exhibition print, or an EK Show Print? Not that an EK Show Print is necessarily the best possible source either, but an HD transfer from it would certainly blow away the non-anamorphic DVDs or laserdiscs we're currently stuck with.

[nmycon]

Originally Posted by Lyle_JP

Well, you try not to, anyway. With some much older films, better sources simply aren't available.

As far as this applies to Star Wars, do we know if the Library of Congress has a used exhibition print, or an EK Show Print? Not that an EK Show Print is necessarily the best possible source either, but an HD transfer from it would certainly blow away the non-anamorphic DVDs or laserdiscs we're currently stuck with.

Ahh, now I understand what he meant.

Yes, I also prefer (especially for blu-rays) that the original master film reel is used whenever possible

[Shaft Windu]

Originally Posted by adywan

Provide this so called proof to back up your claims then. Form you previous statements all you have proved is that you clearly know nothing about anything you talk about.

Of course he is doing this for the money. Why do you think he has held off so long with releasing the films to Blu-Ray? He stated that he was waiting for the Blu-Ray market to become more mainstream. So if he was only doing it for the fans and not the money then why not release it years ago? Easy, he wants to make the most amount of profit off these releases. HE owns these films and not Fox so the biggest slice of the profit from sales go to George's company Lucasfilm. For every Blu-Ray produced the company has to pay a small fee to Sony, then there are packaging and disc duplication costs and finally distribution. But those are a small percentage of the final retail costs. So he gets a massive slice from each of these sets and only a fool would think he would only do this "for the fans".

Still not convinced that he is only concerned about the money? Still think he is only doing it for the fans? Well here's more proof against this:

1 - The Live action TV series. This is on hold for at least 3 years because it isn't financially viable to do it at the moment. If he can't make it cheap enough and make enough profit he isn't going to do it.

2 - The original theatrical versions. He stated at CV that the theatrical editions won't be included on this Blu-Ray set because it would cost too much to restore them (even though the restoration to the films was carried out for the Special editions BEFORE any changes were made, so that side of the work has already been done and FOX paid for this and not Lucas). Now he knows he needs to hold something back so a later release is guaranteed to sell. Now, with the 3D versions coming up, he knows that the 3D market is still pretty small so he will need to add something to the 3D Blu-Ray releases to guarantee sales and this will probably be the theatrical versions. Don't forget this is the same guy that originally said that the originals can never be restored because they don't exist any more because they cut the negative up to create the Special Editions. Now we know this isn't true. New negatives were made when the restoration was completed. They are sitting there in the vaults. Each and every films were scanned digitally before the work began on the SE's. Well now all of a sudden he is saying that it's "too expensive" to restore them. So what happened to the lie that they were destroyed? Robert Harris even said to George that he would restore these films for Free, but Lucas said no. So he doesn't really care about the fans there does he? No, he is holding off for when he needs to maximize sales for a product.

3 - The 3D theatrical releases - Now he is starting with Episode 1 and releasing one film each year from 2012. Now he has gone on record to say that the other films will only be converted to 3D and release IF THE FIRST ONES MAKE ENOUGH MONEY! So, if not enough people go to see the bloody prequels we won't get the rest of the saga. Now is that thinking of his fans and only doing it for the fans? No. It's all about the money. What he is basically saying is "you don't support the 3D films and give me a nice little profit then i'm not giving you any more"

And i'm fed up of all these damn fans that blindly follow everything he has done calling any fan with a free mind who may question him "bashers" . It seems these people just want everything as they see it in their little bubble, but sorry, this is the real world. Why even come on a forum that isn't purposefully for Star Wars in the first place if you don't want people to have differing opinions to yourself?

What does a films box office record have anything to do with what audience the films were aimed at? And i can't even figure out why you even wrote this in reply to what i said because it actually had nothing to do with what i originally said. It was claimed that Star Wars was aimed at kids because there were action figures which kids played with. And my reply was that even films aimed at the "Adult" audience had merchandise aimed at children, so their point was invalid.

These are just spiteful, subjective rantings. In the end nobody can definetely say why George Lucas does something. We can just judge from his work. The movies - even the Sequel-Trilogy that you allegedly like are conveying messages of loyalty, friendship, love, bravery and modesty especially to children. In a time where religious fundamentalism, greed and general moral decay threatens our planet I am glad that these 6 movies can now reach a new generation. Who cares if some conservatives want Han or Greedo to shoot first - I don't even know what's supposed to be the right version. It's so small-minded. What matters is the integrity of the 6-part saga as a whole.

[chip75]

Originally Posted by adywan

It was claimed that Star Wars was aimed at kids because there were action figures which kids played with. And my reply was that even films aimed at the "Adult" audience had merchandise aimed at children, so their point was invalid.

Case in point there was a '99 Jaime Lee Curits film called Virus rated R and a BBFC 18 which had a load of toys and action figures made for it, they tried to sell them on QVC in the UK, I have no idea who they were marketed at but they weren't adults..... and the kiddies wouldn't go near them. I wonder what happened to them?

The pictures of the boxsets has made the release even more real, I think my ticker skipped a couple of beats when I saw them. Roll on September.....

[shelldweller]

Originally Posted by Shaft Windu

These are just spiteful, subjective rantings. In the end nobody can definetely say why George Lucas does something. We can just judge from his work. The movies - even the Sequel-Trilogy that you allegedly like are conveying messages of loyalty, friendship, love, bravery and modesty especially to children. In a time where religious fundamentalism, greed and general moral decay threatens our planet I am glad that these 6 movies can now reach a new generation. Who cares if some conservatives want Han or Greedo to shoot first - I don't even know what's supposed to be the right version. It's so small-minded. What matters is the integrity of the 6-part saga as a whole.

Couldn´t agree more!

[Chordata]

Pretty sure it's closed right now...

[StereoMike]

It took longer than I thought...When I left 6 months ago it was total chaos.

[MerrickG]

I am gonna change the topic a little bit because I want some opinions on Episode 3.

I really hope this doesn't turn into a problem in this thread, but I really have to ask why Episode 3 is so beloved when IMO the conversion of Skywalker to Darth Vader is handled so POORLY. I mean it just made no sense how he can be a noble Jedi one minute and then one minute later immediately forsake that and join the dark side and then another minute becoming a child killer. Anakin's transformation in my opinion was handled so piss poorly that.

I am just curious why so many people chose to ignore that flaw that IMO nearly ruins episode 3 and the prequels as a whole.

[nmycon]

Originally Posted by merrick97

I am gonna change the topic a little bit because I want some opinions on Episode 3.

I really hope this doesn't turn into a problem in this thread, but I really have to ask why Episode 3 is so beloved when IMO the conversion of Skywalker to Darth Vader is handled so POORLY. I mean it just made no sense how he can be a noble Jedi one minute and then one minute later immediately forsake that and join the dark side and then another minute becoming a child killer. Anakin's transformation in my opinion was handled so piss poorly that.

I am just curious why so many people chose to ignore that flaw that IMO nearly ruins episode 3 and the prequels as a whole.

There's a bit more too it than being good one minute, bad the next...

He was so devoted to Padme, it was with good intentions that he moved to the dark side to begin with, and Darth Sidious started feeding him lies about the Republic and Obi-Wan and so on.

Perhaps they could have fleshed this part out a bit with more of an explanation, but it already makes sense as it is.

[MerrickG]

Originally Posted by nmycon

There's a bit more too it than being good one minute, bad the next...

He was so devoted to Padme, it was with good intentions that he moved to the dark side to begin with, and Darth Sidious started feeding him lies about the Republic and Obi-Wan and so on.

Perhaps they could have fleshed this part out a bit with more of an explanation, but it already makes sense as it is.

It needed to be fleshed out a LOT more, I just never bought it at all the way it was handled on screen. Perhaps a more capable director could have made it work.

I feel that Anakin's turn to the darkside was the most important part of the entire prequel trilogy and I am just surprised that so many people seemed to let it slide because it was "simply the best of the prequels"

[ST2012]

Originally Posted by merrick97

I am gonna change the topic a little bit because I want some opinions on Episode 3.

I really hope this doesn't turn into a problem in this thread, but I really have to ask why Episode 3 is so beloved when IMO the conversion of Skywalker to Darth Vader is handled so POORLY. I mean it just made no sense how he can be a noble Jedi one minute and then one minute later immediately forsake that and join the dark side and then another minute becoming a child killer. Anakin's transformation in my opinion was handled so piss poorly that.

I am just curious why so many people chose to ignore that flaw that IMO nearly ruins episode 3 and the prequels as a whole.

I'll agree with you that his swing to the dark side seemed way to rushed in ep. III. Speaking for myself, the reason III is my favorite of the PT is that it contains all the scenes that I looked forward to. I'm going to put them in spoilers just to be on the safe side...

[Show spoiler]Palpatine being "revealed", Obi-Wan vs. Anakin, the birth of Vaders suit, the birth of the twins.

I don't know if I would use the word "beloved" to describe my feelings for ep. III but it contains almost all the dramatic moments that I'd wanted to see on screen since I watched the original movies when I was a kid.

[greg_achen]

Originally Posted by merrick97

It needed to be fleshed out a LOT more, I just never bought it at all the way it was handled on screen. Perhaps a more capable director could have made it work.

I feel that Anakin's turn to the darkside was the most important part of the entire prequel trilogy and I am just surprised that so many people seemed to let it slide because it was "simply the best of the prequels"

A lot of people interpret the scene where Anakin cuts off Mace's arm as the moment when he turns to the dark side. When viewing it in that context, it does seem abrupt. However, I always viewed the preceding scene where Anakin is alone in the Council Chamber and he and Padme are looking at each other across Corucscant as the moment when he decides he will do whatever it takes to save Padme, even if it meant selling his soul to the "devil." At the end of that scene, when the tear runs down his face, his decision has been made. The scene where he aides in killing Mace was the actualization of a decision he already committed himself to and once he went through with it, there was no going back.

Though I acknowledge that rationalization doesn't work for everyone and people have legitimate reasons to be unhappy with his turn. However, when I view the scene I just described as his turning point, there is a subtlety and bittersweet poignancy that works for me, as opposed to the more melodramatic "turn" when he cuts off Mace's arm.

EDIT: It's a beautiful and haunting scene too. The music, cinematography, and even the acting were all rare instances of perfection in the PT, IMO.

YouTube - ‪Padme's Ruminations‬‏

[Shaft Windu]

Originally Posted by merrick97

I am gonna change the topic a little bit because I want some opinions on Episode 3.

I really hope this doesn't turn into a problem in this thread, but I really have to ask why Episode 3 is so beloved when IMO the conversion of Skywalker to Darth Vader is handled so POORLY. I mean it just made no sense how he can be a noble Jedi one minute and then one minute later immediately forsake that and join the dark side and then another minute becoming a child killer. Anakin's transformation in my opinion was handled so piss poorly that.

I am just curious why so many people chose to ignore that flaw that IMO nearly ruins episode 3 and the prequels as a whole.

How can you say that the transformation was too abrupt when in Anakin in fact was moving towards the dark side since he was a child: the grief over his mothers loss, the defiance of Obi-Wans teachings, Avenging his mother and his subsequent pull towards Padme, Lying to all the Jedi about his secret love, general arrogance, jealousy, Killing Dooku... In my opinion the transformation was subtle and beautifully executed.

[Dynamo of Eternia]

Originally Posted by merrick97

I am gonna change the topic a little bit because I want some opinions on Episode 3.

I really hope this doesn't turn into a problem in this thread, but I really have to ask why Episode 3 is so beloved when IMO the conversion of Skywalker to Darth Vader is handled so POORLY. I mean it just made no sense how he can be a noble Jedi one minute and then one minute later immediately forsake that and join the dark side and then another minute becoming a child killer. Anakin's transformation in my opinion was handled so piss poorly that.

I am just curious why so many people chose to ignore that flaw that IMO nearly ruins episode 3 and the prequels as a whole.

Well, generally speaking I am no 'defender' of the prequels, and I agree that this could have been handled a lot better.

That being said, I still overall enjoyed Episode III more than the previous 2 prequels in part because it was darker and more actual events occur. But it still has some huge, gaping flaws.

I think this issue, though, just goes hand in hand with the general mishandling of Anakin's character from the get-go in the prequels. One of the biggest problems with which (IMO) being that they started him out as a kid in Episode 1 and then we jump to him being a young adult in Episode 2.

He's this happy-go-lucky kid in the first movie (aside from being somewhat sad about being separated from his mom, etc), and then he's basically an arrogant prick from the get-go in Episode 2. Couple that with Hayden's questionable acting (which I attribute more to GL's directing than I do Hayden's ability as an actor), and there was never any real 'character development' with him.

Lucas tried to set up all of these parallels between Anakin and Luke, but they only exist on the surface.... they are very superficial. For example, both of them growing up in the desert on Tatooine, both getting their hands cut off in their respective 2nd movies, etc.

But really, it doesn't 'feel' like Anakin really grows as a character. With Luke, we see him go from a somewhat whiney farm boy who wants desperately to leave the farm to him becoming a Jedi. It really seems like he develops as a character over the course of those 3 movies.

By having the big age jump with Anakin from Episodes 1 to 2, there's no development... they just skip right over that portion of it. And he's never a likable character once we see him when he's older. He's just a big jag-off from the beginning of Episode 2. He never really seems to struggle that much with the decisions that he has to make to go to the dark side. He doesn't go from being a likable charcter to an evil one. He's just an evil jerk to start off with and it's really only in 'name' that he goes from being a Jedi to being a Sith. That's about it.

He should have been older to start with in Episode 1 (and should have been played by the same actor for all 3 movies), and they really should have done a better job with actual character development. In Episodes 1 and 2, Anakin should have been very similar to how Luke's character was portrayed in Episodes 4 and 5. And it would have been in their respective third episodes that they would have gone down 2 different paths. But like many things, they screwed that up.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by aiman04

YouTube-‪Padme's Ruminations‬‏

Lucas is at his very best when he doesn't have pesky dialogue to deal with, and that scene is a perfect fusion of images and music. Stunning.

Such a shame that it's followed by a horribly abrupt music cue as Anakin jumps into his speeder to go and save Palpatine, but such is the cut-and-shut bodge job cinematic world of George Lucas.

[Jim Morrison]

Originally Posted by Dynamo of Eternia

Well, generally speaking I am no 'defender' of the prequels, and I agree that this could have been handled a lot better.

That being said, I still overall enjoyed Episode III more than the previous 2 prequels in part because it was darker and more actual events occur. But it still has some huge, gaping flaws.

I think this issue, though, just goes hand in hand with the general mishandling of Anakin's character from the get-go in the prequels. One of the biggest problems with which (IMO) being that they started him out as a kid in Episode 1 and then we jump to him being a young adult in Episode 2.

He's this happy-go-lucky kid in the first movie (aside from being somewhat sad about being separated from his mom, etc), and then he's basically an arrogant prick from the get-go in Episode 2. Couple that with Hayden's questionable acting (which I attribute more to GL's directing than I do Hayden's ability as an actor), and there was never any real 'character development' with him.

Lucas tried to set up all of these parallels between Anakin and Luke, but they only exist on the surface.... they are very superficial. For example, both of them growing up in the desert on Tatooine, both getting their hands cut off in their respective 2nd movies, etc.

But really, it doesn't 'feel' like Anakin really grows as a character. With Luke, we see him go from a somewhat whiney farm boy who wants desperately to leave the farm to him becoming a Jedi. It really seems like he develops as a character over the course of those 3 movies.

By having the big age jump with Anakin from Episodes 1 to 2, there's no development... they just skip right over that portion of it. And he's never a likable character once we see him when he's older. He's just a big jag-off from the beginning of Episode 2. He never really seems to struggle that much with the decisions that he has to make to go to the dark side. He doesn't go from being a likable charcter to an evil one. He's just an evil jerk to start off with and it's really only in 'name' that he goes from being a Jedi to being a Sith. That's about it.

He should have been older to start with in Episode 1 (and should have been played by the same actor for all 3 movies), and they really should have done a better job with actual character development. In Episodes 1 and 2, Anakin should have been very similar to how Luke's character was portrayed in Episodes 4 and 5. And it would have been in their respective third episodes that they would have gone down 2 different paths. But like many things, they screwed that up.

This, this and...this.

[s2mikey]

Originally Posted by Dynamo of Eternia

Well, generally speaking I am no 'defender' of the prequels, and I agree that this could have been handled a lot better.

That being said, I still overall enjoyed Episode III more than the previous 2 prequels in part because it was darker and more actual events occur. But it still has some huge, gaping flaws.

I think this issue, though, just goes hand in hand with the general mishandling of Anakin's character from the get-go in the prequels. One of the biggest problems with which (IMO) being that they started him out as a kid in Episode 1 and then we jump to him being a young adult in Episode 2.

He's this happy-go-lucky kid in the first movie (aside from being somewhat sad about being separated from his mom, etc), and then he's basically an arrogant prick from the get-go in Episode 2. Couple that with Hayden's questionable acting (which I attribute more to GL's directing than I do Hayden's ability as an actor), and there was never any real 'character development' with him.

Lucas tried to set up all of these parallels between Anakin and Luke, but they only exist on the surface.... they are very superficial. For example, both of them growing up in the desert on Tatooine, both getting their hands cut off in their respective 2nd movies, etc.

But really, it doesn't 'feel' like Anakin really grows as a character. With Luke, we see him go from a somewhat whiney farm boy who wants desperately to leave the farm to him becoming a Jedi. It really seems like he develops as a character over the course of those 3 movies.

By having the big age jump with Anakin from Episodes 1 to 2, there's no development... they just skip right over that portion of it. And he's never a likable character once we see him when he's older. He's just a big jag-off from the beginning of Episode 2. He never really seems to struggle that much with the decisions that he has to make to go to the dark side. He doesn't go from being a likable charcter to an evil one. He's just an evil jerk to start off with and it's really only in 'name' that he goes from being a Jedi to being a Sith. That's about it.

He should have been older to start with in Episode 1 (and should have been played by the same actor for all 3 movies), and they really should have done a better job with actual character development. In Episodes 1 and 2, Anakin should have been very similar to how Luke's character was portrayed in Episodes 4 and 5. And it would have been in their respective third episodes that they would have gone down 2 different paths. But like many things, they screwed that up.

Amen. In Phantom Menace, he should have been a little older. I also agree with the lack of slow and realistic development - hes a cute kid one minute and a cranky, misguided weenie the next minute. Luke and Han Solo both undergo believable transformations in the OT. Not the case for Anakin.

I also dont care at all for how they handled him being seperated from his Mother. Yer tellin me that Qui Gon couldnt have also got his Mother out of there too? C'mon - thats just not realistic. Noone would have noticed if they swiped her in the middle of the night and just bolted outta there and even then, was that Italian-talking character(forgot name ) gonna chase them across the galaxy for a slave that was stolen? No freegin way. I hated that. Plus, Anakin doesnt even try to go visit her sooner than he does? All of a sudden he has dreams about her....YEARS after he is separated from her? It just suddenly dawned on him that shes still a slave on Tatooine? Its just bad writing...no other way to put it.

I realize they had to have her die and for the two of them to ultimately be separated for the story to work but they could have handled this MUCH better and more realistically.